[kj] Jaz would nt appreciate this article

[Robert Martin]

I realised when I put Bill Gates in my last piece that it was a
mistake but he was the first one that sprung to mind.
I've never defended Bill Gates before but what exactly do you class as
'earning' money?
Sweeping the floor in a factory, filling supermarket shelves,
whatever?
I'm not going to waste words on defending him any more as he has
lawyers to do that for him.
Think of him as purely an example and perhaps now switch to Richard
Branson or anybody who earns more than YOU think is the right wage.

Getting back to the point - rather than have a go at me for putting up
a different point of view or all the people who earn a good wage, what
do YOU think should be done to change it?
Who do I send all my money to so that these problems all go away?

It all very well highlighting what's wrong - that's easy!
What's not so easy is coming up with a better plan.

Rob


Quoting gathering-request at misera.net:

> Date: Wed, 06 Apr 2005 08:21:58 -0400
> From: gregslawson at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [kj] Jaz would nt appreciate this article
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Message-ID: <8C708BA5CF51B9A-E88-8561 at mblk-r26.sysops.aol.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> 
> Saying that Bill Gates earned his $ is the most bone-headed,
> ridiculous argument, so lame that it makes Peter look like a
> genius. Are you saying that he works thousands of times harder than
> another manager? Or tens of thousands of times as hard as a factory
> worker? Or that his precious decisions are thousands of times
> smarter than any other computer geek? With your arguments, we all
> might as well volunteer ourselves for slavery. He earned all his $
> by LEGALLY STEALING from others, who work for his companies for a
> wage that is a fraction of what these workers produce in value.
> This little fact, which some people either don't realize or justify
> away (like you), is the root of most of the world's problems, like
> poverty and war (since the companies don't pay workers for the full
> value of their work, the workers can't buy all the products and
> services that these companies make. So how do the companies make up
> for it? Go to war to take some other countries profits!).  
>  
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Martin <robmartin at bluebottle.com>
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Sent: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 07:08:56 -0500
> Subject: Re: [kj] Jaz would nt appreciate this article
> 
> 
> I've got to ask this question:
> What is/was the point of this topic?
> Is it supposed to be saying to us all that anyone earning more
> than
> say 50 grand a year (or whatever) should give it over to an
> organization to re-distribute it to the poorer nations?
> A rich persons tax, say.
> If so, and you earned more than 50 grand, would you be happy to
> hand
> it all over?
> It sounds like the most unrealistic thing I've heard for ages.
> 
> I give monthly direct debits to 3 charities every month and that
> helps
> me to sleep at night slightly easier in the knowledge that if
> everyone
> did the same, it would go a massive way to sorting out the mess.
> I guess this is just me justifying my relatively large earnings
> compared to many others in the World.
> 
> I just wish that when people come out with this unrealistic
> bullshit,
> they would put themselves in the place of Bill Gates or whoever
> and
> ask themselves if they would give it all up if they were him.
> Why should he or any other person who has EARNED a large amount of
> money by hard work or making excellent decisions feel guilty
> enough
> to give it all away?
> How many times have you heard of people saying that if they won a
> million pounds, it wouldn't change them, only for them to change
> completely when they've become millionaires.
> We all think we'd do things differently but I think you don't know
> the
> truth until you have the huge amounts of dosh.
> 
> Rob Martin
> 
> 
> Quoting gathering-request at misera.net:
> 
> > Date: Wed, 6 Apr 2005 10:48:47 +0100
> > From: "peter.west410" <peter.west410 at ntlworld.com>
> > Subject: Re: [kj] Jaz would nt appreciate this article
> > To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
> >   <gathering at misera.net>
> > Message-ID: <00e501c53a8d$d47f00e0$9749ff3e at yourby3nr533ht>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1
> > 
> > 
> > 
> >  The latest figure, compiled by world hunger groups and such, is
> > 50,000 die
> > each day due to hunger and preventable disease (like diherrea
> due
> > to
> > untreated  drinking water, or, in the UK, to Peter West's open
> > mouth, lol).
> > I think the  figure used to be 30,000 a day, but I'm not sure
> how
> > it's
> > changed in recent  years.
> > 
> > *******Yes,Only because the world s population has increased.Its
> a
> > sad fact
> > that populations of some countries produce an unsustainable
> amount
> > of
> > people.They may have ten kids and five may make it to teenage
> > years.These
> > countries receive aid from the West,Its the corruption on a
> local
> > scale that
> > stops the needy receiving.
> >     If these countries cant sustain themselves,Would you be
> happy
> > if the
> > West took over these countries and put them straight?*******
> > 
> >  Second, the fact that tech-related consumer goods get cheaper
> with
> > time is
> > both good and bad. Good for the consumer, but bad because the
> > labour
> > required to  produce each unit is less. That means that the
> company
> > profits
> > less on each  unit sold (for example, a cell phone solf for $50
> > yeilds less
> > profit than one  sold for $100). And guess what happens when
> less
> > profit is
> > made? Wages, hours,  benefits, etc. go down!
> > *******So how come the rich are getting richer and the poor are
> > getting
> > poorer?
> > 
> > That's why the total buying power is going down (and
> > > people are less able to afford necessities). For example, when
> I
> > WAS A
> > KID,
> > > almost everyone could afford to buy a home by around age 30,
> even
> > if you
> > didn't go
> > > to college. Now, it's a complete fantasy to buy a home before
> age
> > 30, and
> > if
> > > you didn't go to college it takes even longer, or never. Karl
> > Marx
> > predicted
> > > all this 150 years ago and it came true--not fortune telling,
> > just
> > economics.
> > 
> > *********House prices go up and down,Wait until the price
> > crashes,then
> > purchase************
> >