[kj] OT -- Sex Pis.. -- now, working at the Bank

[Brendan]

That's quite a black and white, binary way of looking at it. I'd basically
agree BUT...

a) public sentiment and knowledge about the ethics of companies is
potentially influential regardless of investment capital. Companies
generally sell goods or services, so negative consequences to the bottom
line can result from the market becoming aware of unethical behaviour and
voting with their dollar

b) institutional investors are people too, not all of them are big fat
corporate whores, they have consciences (some of them) and families etc...

c) even when you are pretty sure there's no practical point in acting
ethically, i.e. it will have no effect, it's good to do it for the sake of
your own abiltity to get to sleep at night. And...you never know. This is
why I will often say my piece even when I think the intended audience is
oblivious or hostile. I've made out like I don't give a shit to things
people have said before but it's actually had an effect, maybe not
immediately...


>> So what if you one makes a good return but has invested in a company

>> that promotes women to revert to powered milk rather than their own

>> breast milk in third world...

>> Maybe...in vivisection to produce cosmetics or...arm sales.

>> Perhaps....beef

>> sales to keep up with glutenous fast food consumption which comes

>> around from deforestation..

>

>   I've wondered about the responsibility ya have when ya invest, and i

> found that

> the level of investment that has any noticeable or actionable influence on

> or support

> for a company's postion, capacities, strength,etc. is at the level of

> institutional

> investors (in the multi-mega-million$, like investment banks, pensions,

> mutual

> funds, union pools, government investments and funds, etc.etc.), that any

> one

> individual investor has absolutely no relevance or effect in a business's

> life, even

> when taken as a group ( the sum of individual investors).

>  

>    Ironically, an elderly person choosing to invest in a retirement fund

> that includes

> shares of, say, Lockheed, is responsible for supporting Lockheed's

> armaments

> trade, but if the elderly person invested individually in Lockheed

> directly, they wouldn't

> be responsible.

>  

>   If anyone can add or spot the flaws in this logic, let me know.. this

> issue of responsibility/guilt is a pet pursuit of mine.

>

>

>  

> ... ... ... ... ... ...

>

> [looking at the current state of things]

>

> 'Save me...

>   save me from Tomorrow..

>    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...!'  

>

> --- On Fri, 7/25/08, iPat <pmdavies at gmail.com> wrote:

>

> From: iPat <pmdavies at gmail.com>

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT -- Sex Pis.. -- now, working at the Bank

> To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Date: Friday, July 25, 2008, 6:15 AM

>

> the stock exchange works on making profit, and there are three main

> levels of risk. If you want your monies put into eco friendly stock

> then the returns are very low. So stocks tend to be invested in high

> return areas which also tend to be the problems in the world. obvious

> i know.

>

> So what if you one makes a good return but has invested in a company

> that promotes women to revert to powered milk rather than their own

> breast milk in third world countries. Maybe the companies invest

> heavily in vivisection to produce cosmetics or maybe the returns come

> from arm sales. Perhaps the companies profits are coming from beef

> sales to keep up with glutenous fast food consumption which comes

> around from deforestation

>

> It was the protection and stability of those markets that was one of

> the major driving forces in the iraq invasion.

>

> Now im not saying that you musnt do this or that, im merely pointing

> out that if you think that you wil escape the rat race by this then i

> think you are deluding yourself. Thats your call.

>

> On Fri, Jul 25, 2008 at 3:16 AM, Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:

>> All of my money is invested in stocks already, I'm playing the system

> I

>> suppose. Working with these traders has been a real fast track to

>> learning

>> about investments, they are all mad about markets and talk about it all

>> day long. It's a total win / win, ask them questions and they are all

> mad

>> keen on talking about it. I listen to glean info and then go home and do

>> some research online in between watching hippie videos and smoking ganga

>> ;) Actually I gave my old boss a stock tip last year that he did really

>> well on.

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