From gregslawson at msn.com  Wed Jul  1 00:14:12 2009
From: gregslawson at msn.com (GREG SLAWSON)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:14:12 -0400
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W1376F9F4557277109DC7D5902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<BAY125-W218C59F7EABF545FBB8DF29D310@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY132-W24104BADDD8B299221DCC2902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY125-W195C95DE4A97821FBE36E79D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY132-W1376F9F4557277109DC7D5902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SNT109-W927EA66438DCE9D3194A3A92E0@phx.gbl>


There's one in Massachusetts--acutally the 3rd largest city here.
 


From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 01:12:34 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



i thought there is only 2 
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:37:46 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



Away from yellow people, then? ;)
Pretty much every US State has a Springfield :)



From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:02:51 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



the one on route 66
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:38:37 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



Which Springfield? ;)
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:26:45 -0700
From: sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers





Coming all the way out here and not visiting San Francisco? 




From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers



hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 



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From gregslawson at msn.com  Wed Jul  1 00:22:55 2009
From: gregslawson at msn.com (GREG SLAWSON)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>


I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San Francisco and Boston!
 


From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:01:43 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



true mike 
even at this stage i'm realising my 4 month sojourn will barely scratch the surface 
discovered i need to be a week in chicago to see what the city has to offer 
and thats the start of my journey 
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:26:45 -0700
From: sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers





Coming all the way out here and not visiting San Francisco? 




From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers



hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 



Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 




View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. 
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009
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From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 03:24:01 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:24:01 +0100
Subject: [kj] Rebellion
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202Z3cNfOUwGY002e7dba@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <05de01c9f9bf$923ab300$0700000a@jo>
	<3c8c7e280906301331m484704c6y5b5d99e297d38afd@mail.gmail.com>
	<EXCHL0202Z3cNfOUwGY002e7dba@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701072414.1467910559@mailwash5.pair.com>

me & the missus. 
KJ, the Dickies & UK decay on the same stage!
which was nice. 
 

 
________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: 30 June 2009 22:22
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] Rebellion



Who's doing (at least Sunday at) Rebellion? I'm very tempted.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Paul Rangecroft
Sent: 30 June 2009 9:31 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Rebellion

 

Yes.

On Tue, Jun 30, 2009 at 9:15 PM, jo <jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk> wrote:

Are KJ doing Sunday at Rebellion?

 


_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

 


 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
==============================================================================
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From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 03:29:03 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:29:03 +0100
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com>

But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-) 



-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion

Don't care, don't care, don't care.


>
>
>
>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>
>  What is your favourite song of his
>
>  Is he really dead ?
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
> _________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================


From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 03:31:38 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:31:38 +0100
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202tkzU5ZImwl002d38a6@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL0202tkzU5ZImwl002d38a6@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701073149.441FC10567@mailwash5.pair.com>

prolly
Human Nature
it'd be some stunt if not!
 
 

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 30 June 2009 11:25
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion


 
  Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
 What is your favourite song of his
 Is he really dead ?


________________________________

Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
more. <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665375/direct/01/>  

 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 03:52:44 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 07:52:44 +0000
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <34805.203.185.215.144.1246364739.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<34805.203.185.215.144.1246364739.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W17B5671D6C6A195A24838FBE2E0@phx.gbl>


"Don't care, don't care, don't care."


  His prophesies came true............................

 

 

 

 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvWMLAWrEjU
 

 

 

 

> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:25:39 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> Don't care, don't care, don't care.
> 
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >
> > What is your favourite song of his
> >
> > Is he really dead ?
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


_________________________________________________________________
With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 04:19:55 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com>
Message-ID: <24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and write in
biro:

Amateur Psychology Degree
Conditional Pass
Not to practise on humans or charge money

;)

My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments, on
reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such pressure
that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive / abberant
behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of ways.
Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his skin
and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the Heal
the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
McCartney for ANYTHING?)

Prognosis on Michael Jackson:

NOTHING TO SAY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU

/waffle





> But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of Brendan
> Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
> Don't care, don't care, don't care.
>
>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>
>>  Is he really dead ?
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
>> _________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
> -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
> Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of
> which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
>
> ==============================================================================
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 04:37:25 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:37:25 +0000
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl>


"Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart."

 

  

   So, you would have preferred Michael Jackson if he had been Leonard Cohen ?
 

 

 

 

 

 

> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and write in
> biro:
> 
> Amateur Psychology Degree
> Conditional Pass
> Not to practise on humans or charge money
> 
> ;)
> 
> My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments, on
> reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such pressure
> that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive / abberant
> behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
> happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of ways.
> Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
> hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his skin
> and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the Heal
> the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
> empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
> McCartney for ANYTHING?)
> 
> Prognosis on Michael Jackson:
> 
> NOTHING TO SAY
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU
> 
> /waffle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of Brendan
> > Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >
> > Don't care, don't care, don't care.
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >>
> >> What is your favourite song of his
> >>
> >> Is he really dead ?
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________________________
> >> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> >> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
> >> _________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
> > Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of
> > which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
> >
> > ==============================================================================
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


_________________________________________________________________
Get the best of MSN on your mobile
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From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 04:42:15 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 04:42:15 -0400
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <E1MLeex-0006Rc-UZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>

Brendan,

Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an element of doubt".

You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based on
the weight of probability".

Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So, in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror; yours was not.

I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him look stupid.? True or false?

Jamie














-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



there was an element of doubt?in the case


That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty as soon as there's an element of doubt?


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion




Hi Brendan,

In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".? Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".

So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the judge did explain it.

Jamie QC


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion



I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
role as a juror?

>
> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>
> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his dad
> made him do it for the money
>
> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>
> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
> in the case
>
> l liked a few of his songs
>
> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>
> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>
>
>
> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>  What is your favourite song of his
>  Is he really dead ?







________________________________________________________________________
AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
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From npscott at blueyonder.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 04:58:51 2009
From: npscott at blueyonder.co.uk (Termite)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:58:51 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <432AB07E185340AEBE15C7EE868E3C31@NickScottPC>

Hey Guys

I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues here, after having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can assure that they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.

Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in June 1997, the last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was demolished in September 2000.

Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 1982) and Hacienda (date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is actually poor quality, but documents well their early performances.

http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-Manchester/release/1492782

Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as follows

Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden (13th October 1984)  Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)

Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 1984)  -  This is not obviously as good value as the above DVD as it only has the Camden gig on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish documentary.

Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great American Music Hall in San Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 DVD set.

Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester Academy 3rd June 2000, their first major large audience reformation gig after they reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.

 

From: Stephen Lawrence 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


  hi mike 
  it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery and the hacienda 
  hope this helps 
  more details if requested 
  haven't got round to viewing yet 
  caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of the century material  

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
  From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


  'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but nada visually.
  what show is featured?





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
  Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


  well said michael 
  have you got the reunion live dvd ?
  picked it up the other week 
   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
  From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


  and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed quite a treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual melodies of Smithies and Fieldings guitars since. 





------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
  Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


  I don't think they're particularly helpful to the cause...
    -----Original Message-----
    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
    Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
    To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    You know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons for far too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.



    Darren

    Hungerford, UK



    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
    Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
    To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
    Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....



    howdy......
    guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for sale....

    http://www.regoid.com/

    sean.

 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================



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-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 05:11:04 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:11:04 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

WOULD YOU RATHER:

1) Speak like Michael Jackson, or Mike Tyson?

2) Have a nose like Michael Jackson circa May 2008, or a nose like Steve
Martin in Roxanne?

3) Have Michael Jackson's Thriller play at your funeral, or 'Mother' by Mr T?

4) Random non-MJ one this time - Be a Muppet, a Fraggle, or a Thunderbird?
(things to bear in mind - someone's hand constantly up your ass, "the
trashheap has spoken", the chance to finally see Lady Penelope's plastic
tits...)


>
> "Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
>> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart."
>
>
>
>
>
>    So, you would have preferred Michael Jackson if he had been Leonard
> Cohen ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200
>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>> Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and write
>> in
>> biro:
>>
>> Amateur Psychology Degree
>> Conditional Pass
>> Not to practise on humans or charge money
>>
>> ;)
>>
>> My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments, on
>> reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such pressure
>> that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive /
>> abberant
>> behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
>> happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of ways.
>> Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
>> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
>> hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his
>> skin
>> and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the Heal
>> the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
>> empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
>> McCartney for ANYTHING?)
>>
>> Prognosis on Michael Jackson:
>>
>> NOTHING TO SAY
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU
>>
>> /waffle
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> > But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of Brendan
>> > Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
>> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> >
>> > Don't care, don't care, don't care.
>> >
>> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>> >>
>> >> What is your favourite song of his
>> >>
>> >> Is he really dead ?
>> >>
>> >> _________________________________________________________________
>> >> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos..
>> >> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
>> >> _________________________
>> >> Gathering mailing list
>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Gathering mailing list
>> > Gathering at misera.net
>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
>> > Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries
>> of
>> > which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services
>> Authority.
>> >
>> > =============================================================================>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Gathering mailing list
>> > Gathering at misera.net
>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get the best of MSN on your mobile
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 05:17:43 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:17:43 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
References: <E1MLeex-0006Rc-UZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>
	<8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <41551.203.185.215.144.1246439863.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.

I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.

> Brendan,
>
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
>
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
>
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
>
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
>
>
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
> Hi Brendan,
>
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
>
> Jamie QC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
>
>>
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>>
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>>
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>>
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>>
>> l liked a few of his songs
>>
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>>
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>>
>>
>>
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 05:54:28 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:54:28 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202neAzdfTVSx002ef0aa@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0202neAzdfTVSx002ef0aa@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701095441.EB7E410566@mailwash5.pair.com>

Thanks for this. I was hoping for a DVD release of one or both nights
from the Ritz 2000 gigs, which I attended and thought were brilliant. 
(Witchwood - great small venue but sadly mostly hosting tribute bands
now.)  
 
________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Termite
Sent: 01 July 2009 09:59
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography


Hey Guys
 
I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues here, after
having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their
reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can
assure that they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.
 
Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in June 1997, the
last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was demolished in
September 2000.
 
Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 1982) and Hacienda
(date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is actually poor
quality, but documents well their early performances.
 
http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-
Manchester/release/1492782
 
Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as follows
 
Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden (13th October 1984)
Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)
 
Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 1984)  -  This is not
obviously as good value as the above DVD as it only has the Camden gig
on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish documentary.
 
Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great American Music Hall in San
Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 DVD set.
 
Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester Academy 3rd June
2000, their first major large audience reformation gig after they
reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under
Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.
 
 
 
From: Stephen Lawrence <mailto:stephen.l at live.com>  

	To: gathering at misera.net 
	Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 AM
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....

	hi mike 
	it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery and the
hacienda 
	hope this helps 
	more details if requested 
	haven't got round to viewing yet 
	caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of the
century material  
	
________________________________

	Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
	From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
	To: gathering at misera.net
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
	
	
	'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but nada
visually.
	what show is featured?
	 
	 

________________________________

	From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
	Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
	To: gathering at misera.net
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
	
	
	well said michael 
	have you got the reunion live dvd ?
	picked it up the other week 
	 
	
________________________________

	Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
	From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
	To: gathering at misera.net
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
	
	
	and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed quite a
treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual melodies of Smithies and
Fieldings guitars since. 
	 
	 

________________________________

	From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
	Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
	To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
	
	
	I don't think they're particularly helpful to the cause...

		-----Original Message-----
		From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
		Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
		To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....
		
		

		You know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons
for far too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.

		 

		Darren

		Hungerford, UK

		 

		From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
		Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
		To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
		Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....

		 

		howdy......
		guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for sale....
		
		http://www.regoid.com/
		
		sean.

	 
	
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
	HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered
Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company,
subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial
Services Authority.
	
	
========================================================================
======


________________________________

	Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
Find out more. <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665375/direct/01/>  

	
	 
	
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
	HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered
Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company,
subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial
Services Authority.
	
	
========================================================================
======

	
	
	
________________________________

	View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn
more! <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  

	
________________________________


	

	_______________________________________________
	Gathering mailing list
	Gathering at misera.net
	http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
	


 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================
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From npscott at blueyonder.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 05:57:15 2009
From: npscott at blueyonder.co.uk (Termite)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:57:15 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <20090701095441.EB7E410566@mailwash5.pair.com>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com><BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl><EXCHL0202neAzdfTVSx002ef0aa@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
	<20090701095441.EB7E410566@mailwash5.pair.com>
Message-ID: <64DC72008FD3461B89E956D94025B139@NickScottPC>

You're welcome, I was at one of the nights at the Ritz too, as well as 2 nights at the Witchwood out of the 5 that they performed at when they first reformed.  Sadly the only UK release from their reformation is the Resurrection VHS release, which I have and need to get round to transferring over to DVD.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 10:54 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography


  Thanks for this. I was hoping for a DVD release of one or both nights from the Ritz 2000 gigs, which I attended and thought were brilliant. 
  (Witchwood - great small venue but sadly mostly hosting tribute bands now.)  


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Termite
  Sent: 01 July 2009 09:59
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography


  Hey Guys

  I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues here, after having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can assure that they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.

  Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in June 1997, the last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was demolished in September 2000.

  Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 1982) and Hacienda (date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is actually poor quality, but documents well their early performances.

  http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-Manchester/release/1492782

  Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as follows

  Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden (13th October 1984)  Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)

  Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 1984)  -  This is not obviously as good value as the above DVD as it only has the Camden gig on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish documentary.

  Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great American Music Hall in San Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 DVD set.

  Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester Academy 3rd June 2000, their first major large audience reformation gig after they reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.



  From: Stephen Lawrence 
    To: gathering at misera.net 
    Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 AM
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    hi mike 
    it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery and the hacienda 
    hope this helps 
    more details if requested 
    haven't got round to viewing yet 
    caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of the century material  

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
    From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but nada visually.
    what show is featured?





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
    Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    well said michael 
    have you got the reunion live dvd ?
    picked it up the other week 
     

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
    From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed quite a treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual melodies of Smithies and Fieldings guitars since. 





----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
    Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
    To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


    I don't think they're particularly helpful to the cause...
      -----Original Message-----
      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
      Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
      To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
      Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


      You know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons for far too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.



      Darren

      Hungerford, UK



      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
      Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
      To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
      Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....



      howdy......
      guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for sale....

      http://www.regoid.com/

      sean.

 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 06:38:31 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:38:31 +0000
Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple
In-Reply-To: <E1MLqts-0005fn-QD@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <BAY125-W29CA6AFEC8FAE0271FC72A9D310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLqts-0005fn-QD@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W72743ECA4F2D4ABBD1E50902E0@phx.gbl>


insults aside 

a thought provoking post brendan 

well done 
 


From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:54:22 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple




*Raises hand*
 
Check this out:
 
http://seekingalpha.com/article/145580-positioning-for-when-water-runs-out-part-ii
 
We have not yet reached the point of recycling all waste water like the Fremen of Arrakis in Frank Hebert?s brilliant novel Dune, but if we are consigned to endlessly squabble over that fixed 1% in a world where population is anything but fixed, many will die and many more will suffer.
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of folk devil
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 5:06 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple


I know there's duneheads among us :)
 
"The Conspiracy Files 7/7, a BBC documentary, tracked Muad Dib down, eventually finding him in the small town of Kells in Ireland. He is in fact John Hill, from Sheffield. 
His alias, Muad Dib, is a fictional character in the science fiction film Dune, a film starring Sting and Kyle MacLachlan about inter-galactic freedom fighting, from which he seems to draw inspiration."
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/8124687.stm
 



Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.
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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 06:48:09 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:48:09 +0000
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>


err STILL not reading what you have written 

other gatherers pointed it out to you 

but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made regarding jury service 

i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case 

i was not the only one voting against 

a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i haven't been on a case where that was unanimous yet '' 

never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life 

police never lie do they ?
 


From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead




Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use that. 
 
Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or whatever, but hey.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
 



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing 
or get some new glasses 
testing the statement you made 
SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
sorry ??? like fuck you are 
i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person mentioned 
 
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> 
> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
> 
> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin when
> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're holier
> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
> are...sorry.
> 
> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
> 
> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it with
> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
> 
> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
> 
> Yes, you do.
> 
> "i await the usual one word response"
> 
> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of sarcasm?
> That's not positive now is it?
> 
> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete west"
> 
> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between you
> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than he is
> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
> 
> >
> > awww poor brendan
> >
> > hurt your feelings did i ?
> >
> > get over it
> >
> > you come across as an opinionated bully
> >
> > unless it fits in with your world view
> >
> > it must me torn down and stomped on
> >
> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
> >
> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish written
> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
> >
> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
> >
> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death around me
> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
> >
> > NO i am not seeking your approval
> >
> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
> >
> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona in order
> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
> >
> > some gatherers have met me
> >
> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
> >
> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
> >
> > unlike others i admit to my faults
> >
> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
> >
> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
> >
> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real life
> >
> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
> >
> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to the
> > cult of personality
> >
> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
> >
> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
> >
> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
> >
> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of heartbreaks
> >
> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
> >
> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if i'm not
> > sure
> >
> > i await the usual one word response
> >
> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
> >
> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a kindness
> >
> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the past
> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete west
> >
> > oh well whatever floats your boat
> >
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's minds or
> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative thoughts
> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
> >
> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging remark
> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think you
> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective imaginary
> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high incidence of
> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural promises
> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of options.
> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
> >
> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100% chance
> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your nervous
> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing model.
> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd imply some
> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> > i don't know why i'm bothering
> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and walked
> > i will NOT take shit
> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek approval
> > from anyone
> > i have never delivered a speech
> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
> > fashionable
> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it raises a
> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal space
> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [ except
> > in the instance of comedy ]
> >
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by omission)? A
> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment that
> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along with
> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face when
> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when being
> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a tougher
> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give a shit
> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested when
> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you? Heaped
> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
> > reasons?
> >
> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when you're
> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like for
> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in retrospect and
> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular way to
> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on a
> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around before
> > picking your nose?
> >
> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because they have
> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit in'? Or
> > to not fit in...
> >
> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a date?
> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...? Tried
> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who disgusts you?
> >
> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF SHIT.
> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> > actually I DON'T
> >
> >
> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k it!
> >
> > Jelly...... melting
> >
> >
> > From: stephen.l at live.com
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> > actually I DON'T
> >
> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >>
> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
> >>
> >> >
> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Keep Smiling...
> >> >
> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
> >> >
> >> > Autism also affects adults.
> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad about
> >> a
> >> > dead person
> >> >
> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an alternative
> >> set
> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From what
> >> I've
> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to the
> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they want.
> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't feel any
> >> > compunctions either way.
> >> >
> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
> >> fashionable
> >> > to dislike
> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your comments
> >> with
> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just doing
> >> my
> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
> >> tabloids I
> >> > just make them...
> >> >
> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
> >> >
> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read actually
> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad about
> >> a
> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in real
> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental death
> >> (so
> >> > they're saying).
> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll have a
> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have been
> >> > settled.
> >> >
> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
> >> >
> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all about any
> >> or
> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
> >> >
> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
> >> >
> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
> >> >
> >> > 'Save me...
> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've also
> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole bloody
> >> circus
> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
> >> activities. I
> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing pieces
> >> of
> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
> >> multi-million
> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have come was
> >> a
> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal problems".
> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That makes
> >> it
> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a little
> >> > income-tax evasion..
> >> >
> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
> >> half-decent
> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do we all
> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it offends
> >> > someone?
> >> >
> >> > Jim.
> >> >
> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this inane
> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most abused
> >> word
> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
> >> > I'm sick of it.
> >> >
> >> > Alex in NYC
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: jerry bodkin
> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's, downloads
> >> etc
> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings smells
> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
> >> >
> >> > Jelly.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Oh Christ.
> >> >
> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
> >> >
> >> > Darren
> >> > Hungerford, UK
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> >> > more.
> >> >
> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> > more.
> >
> >
> >
> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
> >
> >
> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 06:49:11 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:49:11 +0000
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <SNT109-W927EA66438DCE9D3194A3A92E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<BAY125-W218C59F7EABF545FBB8DF29D310@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY132-W24104BADDD8B299221DCC2902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY125-W195C95DE4A97821FBE36E79D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY132-W1376F9F4557277109DC7D5902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<SNT109-W927EA66438DCE9D3194A3A92E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W17E734E96CFB47636E962A902E0@phx.gbl>


thanks greg for the education 
 


From: gregslawson at msn.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:14:12 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



There's one in Massachusetts--acutally the 3rd largest city here.
 


From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 01:12:34 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



i thought there is only 2 
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:37:46 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



Away from yellow people, then? ;)
Pretty much every US State has a Springfield :)



From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:02:51 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



the one on route 66
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:38:37 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



Which Springfield? ;)
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:26:45 -0700
From: sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers





Coming all the way out here and not visiting San Francisco? 




From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers



hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 



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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 06:50:51 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:50:51 +0000
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W739875D08D044564AA099902E0@phx.gbl>


thanks for the suggestion but i have found some really interesting things to see in chicago 
 


From: gregslawson at msn.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San Francisco and Boston!
 


From: stephen.l at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:01:43 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



true mike 
even at this stage i'm realising my 4 month sojourn will barely scratch the surface 
discovered i need to be a week in chicago to see what the city has to offer 
and thats the start of my journey 
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:26:45 -0700
From: sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers





Coming all the way out here and not visiting San Francisco? 




From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers



hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 



Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 




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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 06:54:51 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:54:51 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W72743ECA4F2D4ABBD1E50902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY125-W29CA6AFEC8FAE0271FC72A9D310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLqts-0005fn-QD@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W72743ECA4F2D4ABBD1E50902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <3571.203.185.215.144.1246445691.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Cheers, although posting a link to an investment site on a Killing Joke
distribution lists feels kinda...wrong :)

>
> insults aside
>
> a thought provoking post brendan
>
> well done
>
>
>
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:54:22 +1000
> Subject: Re: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple
>
>
>
>
> *Raises hand*
>
> Check this out:
>
> http://seekingalpha.com/article/145580-positioning-for-when-water-runs-out-part-ii
>
> We have not yet reached the point of recycling all waste water like the
> Fremen of Arrakis in Frank Hebert?s brilliant novel Dune, but if we are
> consigned to endlessly squabble over that fixed 1% in a world where
> population is anything but fixed, many will die and many more will suffer.
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of folk devil
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 5:06 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple
>
>
> I know there's duneheads among us :)
>
> "The Conspiracy Files 7/7, a BBC documentary, tracked Muad Dib down,
> eventually finding him in the small town of Kells in Ireland. He is in
> fact John Hill, from Sheffield.
> His alias, Muad Dib, is a fictional character in the science fiction film
> Dune, a film starring Sting and Kyle MacLachlan about inter-galactic
> freedom fighting, from which he seems to draw inspiration."
>
> http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/8124687.stm
>
>
>
>
> Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your
> BlackBerry or iPhone.
> _________________________________________________________________
>
> MSN straight to your mobile - news, entertainment, videos and more.
>
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 07:06:18 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:06:18 +0000
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W17B5671D6C6A195A24838FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<34805.203.185.215.144.1246364739.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BLU112-W17B5671D6C6A195A24838FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W27FEF11623E82934AFB08F902E0@phx.gbl>


awesome vid 

thanks floren 
 


From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 07:52:44 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion



"Don't care, don't care, don't care."

  His prophesies came true............................
 
 
 
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nvWMLAWrEjU
 
 
 
 
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:25:39 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> Don't care, don't care, don't care.
> 
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >
> > What is your favourite song of his
> >
> > Is he really dead ?
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




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_________________________________________________________________
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From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 07:23:27 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:23:27 +0100
Subject: [kj] [KJ] HellFest's Report
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL020133HFnwpGR80052bf11@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL020133HFnwpGR80052bf11@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701112344.207541053D@mailwash5.pair.com>

he's a proper little teacher's pet is ol' Frenchy with his cheeses. nice report, thanks for the heads-up.
 

 
________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Frenchy Frenzy
Sent: 30 June 2009 22:33
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] [KJ] HellFest's Report



Hi all,

 

Last week I've spent one of my best moments with the Joke.

Arrived early by plane, I had time to check in at The Mercure Hotel close to the south railroad central station of Nantes city.

 

Immediately, I've noticed some full tattoed boys (unusual for this kind of places) and recognised in the lounge area the singer of the Misfits Jerry Only (very friendly)

I said to myself that other artists should have reservations by the organization in the same hotel and ask the lady at the front desk "if Mister Coleman had already checked in ?"

 

She answered : "not yet ;o))) Bingo

 

Last time in Paris sept 08, I was already in the same hotel as all the boys (The Mercure at Porte de Pantin) and bumped into Youth coming out the breakfast room...and the front desk man took a photo of both of us...

 

Arrived in Clisson by train, a very nice little village, I was about to get a pass at the VIP/ Guests tent but the young lady at the desk told me that the group hadn't arrived yet and that she didn't got any list from the group.

She added that last night "M?tley Cr?e gave his list 5 minutes before their gig at 1AM...

 

That was 3:30 PM and I couldn't even pay my ticket (as I do everytime to support the group) because I needed an AAA Pass to use my videocameras....

 

It took me 20 minutes to go to the Artists entrance where all the tour buses and trucks are parked.

 

Of course there were many security controls and began to speak with one of the guardian when 200 meters away from me I just noticed Jaz and Youth walking to their bus.

I just began to shout "JAAAAAAAAZZZZZ as loud as I could because that was my only chance to get heared considering the loudness of the death metal gig at the moment very near.

 

By chance, they both heared my shouts and that was the 1st good point of the day...

 

As the guardian couldn't let me in without the famous bracelet, Jaz had to go back to the Artist /VIP area and came back running (yes running like I had never seen him before ha ha ha ) and gave me the precious yellow Artist Bracelet's which allowed me to go everywhere with my videocameras.

 

Would you ever imagine on single second Marilyn Manson doing the same thing for one of his long time follower ?

 

Sure not : that'swhy they are awesome and unique !!

 

We spent some time in the Bus tour where I picked up from my bag the "brand new Gathering 2008 boxset 4cds" just arrived by post the week before and was surprised that they were astonished it had been released....

Youth began to calculate the estimated royalties and finally signed on the booklet "Where is the cash Matt ?,o)))

 

No comment, but it's just incredible that the group is NOT informed of the "official" release.

 

We went to the backstage area (in fact a big Sport Arena (surrounded by the 2 main stages and the rest of the site) very calm considering the loudness outside.

 

I would say very well organized with many guardians checking all the famous bracelets in 6 colours with different authorizations...

Of course the yellow one is the ultimate ha ha ha ...

 

Jaz & Youth proposed me to follow them for an interview for french TV and it was funny to see them with shorts and cigars like 2 cool tourists answering the questions during ? hour.

 

The sun was shining and the temperature was perfect, no rain predicted.

 

A wonderful atmosphere with the 2 main stages only separated with a big screen; so every 5 minutes a group is playing and no wait between the groups.

 

Everybody is on time and better has to, because the running order contains 107 groups in 3 days and no extended delay is allowed except for Motley, Marilyn Manson and Manowar.

 

Saw a little bit of Soulfly (a lot of stage diving ;))) Amebix ( good rhythmic groove) and Misfits (took some photos with Jerry backstage (a very funny guy and easy to approach) and went eating  before the second main act of the day The Joke

 

I've found the best place to film the gig with my tripod, just in front of the stage between Geordie & Jaz in the bouncers area. 

 

As the stage was wide maybe 12 or 15 bouncers took place behind the barriers and protected me from the potential stage divers.

OK there were less than for Soulfly or Gojira (a French Group who Big Paul was enthusiastic about the rhythm section we saw together on the side of the stage)

 

The weather was perfect and the light show was one of the best they got (except for the Sheph's in 2005) and they played a classical but perfect gig for all the audience who acclaimed all the titles including Love Loke Blood ( which they didn't want to play in the afternoon and maybe as I remembered them that it was "their" hit in France and people were certainly expecting it) Eighties , the Wait.

 

Everybody was in a good shape and Geordie played as if he was caressing his guitar as usual and the groove injected by BPF and Youth is more and more perfect.

 

Madness was very well acclaimed too and was not supposed to be played.

I said to them that I had "rediscovered" this track live on stage and maybe they have listened to me.

 

Next time I will ask for my personal tracks list including Twilight Of the Mortal which Jaz sang a little bit during the soundcheck at the Forum 08, Slipstream, Universe B, Implant etc...;o)

 

I must say that the footages I got were the best ones I ever filmed because there were closed to me and the lightshow was powerful and the result delights me.

 

I must add here one thing : during the Heaven's gig I gave a full hard disk drive to the management containing all the 16 gigs and backstage & soundchecks I've filmed and they "should" release some DVD's

 

After the show I decided to have a look for 2 songs of Marilyn Manson (that was enough ha ha ha) and got back inside for sharing all those delicious cheeses and wines brought from my home town Lyon city.

 

In fact, I think that the boys during the day were a little bit focused on their evening show and intended to deliver the best show they could.

 

I saw the difference after the show when they were much more relaxed and ready for savouring Comt?, Saint Marcellin and Saint F?licien, Saint Joseph etc...

 

Of course we had some fresh bread from the VIP Restaurant too...

 

Everything was simply perfect and we were all delighted with all these different saveurs.

 

Sharing this with them was like the time was suspended for 1 H ?.....All the 5 guys and myself with nobody else

 

After all, something very simple but a REAL moment with a lot of laughs.

 

For example, at one moment Vincent Raven came with the guys of Amebix and he was.....I would say...stoned.

I said to Jaz : "Hey here is your driver who will drive you at your hotel ha ha ha  and we had a great laugh

Jaz said to Vincent : It's like your father: you've got it in your DNA ;o)))

 

The room finally got some new invited people and I would say that the guys from Amebix were very nice and they felt very honoured to be he Joke's guests and I saw "gratitude and respect "in their eyes.

 

As It was 3 AM, we had to leave the Festival and an official small shuttle drove us (Jaz & Me) to our hotel in Nantes.

 

In fact during 25 mins, there were so many roundabouts that Jaz was very close to be ill in the car and me too ha ha ha !! 

 

The day after I phoned Jaz in room 201 (I was in 211) at 10 AM and we went to the breakfast room to get forces again...

 

It was again a simple moment but unusual with Jaz as you can imagine.

 

We spoke about the gig, the happiness they all had playing again together and the projects:

 

*	Jaz is about to be honoured by France and will receive the Medal of Chevalier des Arts et des Lettres in sept /oct 09 and they should play an acoustic gig at Les Bains Douches where they played at their beginning(25th of June 80) 
*	In fact he gave me a photo where he already has the famous medal but ceremony will take place after 

 

This info has been confirmed to me one week after by one of my friend who works at the METRO newspaper.

 

Raven and him were reconciled before his death and he was about to come back in the Joke, but there were no project with Atkins at all.

"Raven was from the family not him "

 

There are apparently 8 or 9 new songs written....

 

They should record before end of year 200....9  ;o))

 

One of his daughter has a restaurant in Geneva.

 

His cousin plays in the French group from Lyon City Le Peuple de l'Herbe (people from the weed)

 

Of course the awaited gig in 2012....

 

He is going to live in Paris soon and has another project concerning his private life...

 

Finally after a great shower (in our separate rooms of course ha ha ah ) we met again and I helped him at the railroad station to get his electronic ticket ...

 

Jaz and computers....

 

It's funny because his name was printed on the ticket much more unusual as a signature...

 

We said goodbye on the platform till our next "meeting" on the 31 th of july 2009 in Venice Italy and certainly a longer gig as they'll play at the Airport Festival as Headliner with only one group before.

 

So simply the best moments with the reunited Joke since some unforgettable moments in Milano 2005 with Raven....

 

Stephane "Frenchy Frenzy"

 

PS : Nantes is a beautiful city full of welcoming people too

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 


 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================
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From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 07:32:00 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:32:00 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202SBpWUye9v7002e8bae@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<EXCHL0202SBpWUye9v7002e8bae@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701113213.858FF10542@mailwash5.pair.com>

 
complete with Nicholas Parsons intro?
 

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: 01 July 2009 00:19
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


hi mike 
it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery and the hacienda 
hope this helps 
more details if requested 
haven't got round to viewing yet 
caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of the century
material  

________________________________

Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but nada visually.
what show is featured?
 
 

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


well said michael 
have you got the reunion live dvd ?
picked it up the other week 
 

________________________________

Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed quite a treat. don't
think anybody's matched the dual melodies of Smithies and Fieldings
guitars since. 
 
 

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of ade
Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


I don't think they're particularly helpful to the cause...

	-----Original Message-----
	From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
	Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
	To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
	
	

	You know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons for far
too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.

	 

	Darren

	Hungerford, UK

	 

	From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
	Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
	To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
	Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....

	 

	howdy......
	guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for sale....
	
	http://www.regoid.com/
	
	sean.

 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of
which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

========================================================================
======


________________________________

Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
more. <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665375/direct/01/>  

 
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of
which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

========================================================================
======




________________________________

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!
<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  

 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================
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From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Wed Jul  1 07:34:51 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:34:51 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202kVMFgnjXXB002f1fcb@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com><BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl><EXCHL0202neAzdfTVSx002ef0aa@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
	<20090701095441.EB7E410566@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<EXCHL0202kVMFgnjXXB002f1fcb@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090701113512.0219B10599@mailwash5.pair.com>

it's documented that the band's fractures usually revolved round Dave &
Mark's squabbles. over what exactly?
 
 

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Termite
Sent: 01 July 2009 10:57
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography


You're welcome, I was at one of the nights at the Ritz too, as well as 2
nights at the Witchwood out of the 5 that they performed at when they
first reformed.  Sadly the only UK release from their reformation is the
Resurrection VHS release, which I have and need to get round to
transferring over to DVD.

	----- Original Message ----- 
	From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com 
	To: gathering at misera.net 
	Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 10:54 AM
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography

	Thanks for this. I was hoping for a DVD release of one or both
nights from the Ritz 2000 gigs, which I attended and thought were
brilliant. 
	(Witchwood - great small venue but sadly mostly hosting tribute
bands now.)  
	 
________________________________

	From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Termite
	Sent: 01 July 2009 09:59
	To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
	Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
	
	
	Hey Guys
	 
	I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues here,
after having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their
reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can
assure that they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.
	 
	Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in June
1997, the last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was
demolished in September 2000.
	 
	Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 1982) and
Hacienda (date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is
actually poor quality, but documents well their early performances.
	 
	
http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-
Manchester/release/1492782
	 
	Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as follows
	 
	Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden (13th October
1984)  Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)
	 
	Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 1984)  -  This is
not obviously as good value as the above DVD as it only has the Camden
gig on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish documentary.
	 
	Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great American Music Hall in
San Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 DVD set.
	 
	Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester Academy
3rd June 2000, their first major large audience reformation gig after
they reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under
Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.
	 
	 
	 
	From: Stephen Lawrence <mailto:stephen.l at live.com>  

		To: gathering at misera.net 
		Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 AM
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....

		hi mike 
		it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery
and the hacienda 
		hope this helps 
		more details if requested 
		haven't got round to viewing yet 
		caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of
the century material  
		
________________________________

		Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
		From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
		To: gathering at misera.net
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....
		
		
		'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but
nada visually.
		what show is featured?
		 
		 

________________________________

		From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
		Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
		To: gathering at misera.net
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....
		
		
		well said michael 
		have you got the reunion live dvd ?
		picked it up the other week 
		 
		
________________________________

		Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
		From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
		To: gathering at misera.net
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....
		
		
		and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed
quite a treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual melodies of
Smithies and Fieldings guitars since. 
		 
		 

________________________________

		From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
		Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
		To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
		Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....
		
		
		I don't think they're particularly helpful to the
cause...

			-----Original Message-----
			From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
			Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
			To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the
band!)'
			Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited
edition print.....
			
			

			You know, I think the reason I ignored the
Chameleons for far too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era
Marillion sleeves.

			 

			Darren

			Hungerford, UK

			 

			From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
			Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
			To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the
band!)
			Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition
print.....

			 

			howdy......
			guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for
sale....
			
			http://www.regoid.com/
			
			sean.

		 
	
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
		HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813.
Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding
company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the
Financial Services Authority.
		
	
========================================================================
======


________________________________

		Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows
Live. Find out more. <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665375/direct/01/>


		
		 
	
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
		HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813.
Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding
company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the
Financial Services Authority.
		
	
========================================================================
======

		
		
		
________________________________

		View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place -
Learn more! <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  

		
________________________________


		

		_______________________________________________
		Gathering mailing list
		Gathering at misera.net
		http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
		

	
	 
	
------------------------------------------------------------------------
-----------------------------
	HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered
Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company,
subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial
Services Authority.
	
	
========================================================================
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________________________________


	

	_______________________________________________
	Gathering mailing list
	Gathering at misera.net
	http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
	


 
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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 07:38:24 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:38:24 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
References: <E1MLeex-0006Rc-UZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>
	<8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W22500A354EE5FC6B8CB9A7902E0@phx.gbl>


thanks jamie 

for holding my corner 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 04:42:15 -0400
From: jpwhkj at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict because "there was an element of doubt".

You replied (see below) that he should have been "making a judgement based on
the weight of probability".

Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a courtroom, I'd accept his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".  So, in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror; yours was not.

I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him look stupid.  True or false?

Jamie














-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



there was an element of doubt in the case

That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty as soon as there's an element of doubt?



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


Hi Brendan,

In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".  Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".

So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the judge did explain it.

Jamie QC


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion


I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
role as a juror?

>
> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>
> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his dad
> made him do it for the money
>
> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>
> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
> in the case
>
> l liked a few of his songs
>
> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>
> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>
>
>
> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>  What is your favourite song of his
>  Is he really dead ?

 



Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 07:41:07 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:41:07 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
In-Reply-To: <40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W2875F578BA4B24CC690369BE2E0@phx.gbl>



 

> 
> WOULD YOU RATHER:
> 
> 1) Speak like Michael Jackson, or Mike Tyson?

 

  Anyone of those two would be better then speaking like Paul Hogan and finishing off every sentence with "Eh"
> 
> 2) Have a nose like Michael Jackson circa May 2008, or a nose like Steve
> Martin in Roxanne?

 

 Are you offering to carry out the work? Are you M.J's Plastic surgeon looking for some work?
> 
> 3) Have Michael Jackson's Thriller play at your funeral, or 'Mother' by Mr T?

 

I would like no people and no music at my funeral


> 4) Random non-MJ one this time - Be a Muppet, a Fraggle, or a Thunderbird?
> (things to bear in mind - someone's hand constantly up your ass, "the
> trashheap has spoken", the chance to finally see Lady Penelope's plastic
> tits...)
> 

  I'd rather be Spiderman


  

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Get the best of MSN on your mobile
http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/
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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 07:43:05 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:43:05 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <432AB07E185340AEBE15C7EE868E3C31@NickScottPC>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl> 
	<432AB07E185340AEBE15C7EE868E3C31@NickScottPC>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W252015565EEA73A410B156902E0@phx.gbl>


thanks for the info termite 

oh well it was only a fiver 

jon will laugh when i say i got it from H M V 
 


From: npscott at blueyonder.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:58:51 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography




Hey Guys
 
I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues here, after having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can assure that they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.
 
Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in June 1997, the last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was demolished in September 2000.
 
Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 1982) and Hacienda (date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is actually poor quality, but documents well their early performances.
 
http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-Manchester/release/1492782
 
Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as follows
 
Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden (13th October 1984)  Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)
 
Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 1984)  -  This is not obviously as good value as the above DVD as it only has the Camden gig on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish documentary.
 
Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great American Music Hall in San Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 DVD set.
 
Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester Academy 3rd June 2000, their first major large audience reformation gig after they reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.
 
 
 
From: Stephen Lawrence 

To: gathering at misera.net 
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....

hi mike 
it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e gallery and the hacienda 
hope this helps 
more details if requested 
haven't got round to viewing yet 
caught my eye and thought for 5 pounds this is sale of the century material  


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....




'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & sessions) but nada visually.
what show is featured?
 
 



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....


well said michael 
have you got the reunion live dvd ?
picked it up the other week 
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....




and anybody judging this 'book' by its cover missed quite a treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual melodies of Smithies and Fieldings guitars since. 
 
 



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
Sent: 29 June 2009 19:06
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....



I don't think they're particularly helpful to the cause...

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: 29 June 2009 19:01
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....



You know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons for far too long was because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK
 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of phatseanio
Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
 
howdy......
guitarist of the chameleons artwork print for sale....

http://www.regoid.com/

sean. 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

==============================================================================




Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 
 
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.

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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 07:46:26 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:46:26 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
In-Reply-To: <40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W251F54593CFB755AE6662902E0@phx.gbl>


how the hell would you see lady penelope's plastic tits being a thunderbird?

all you would see is either outer space / all points of the compass on earth from the sky or the sea bed 
 
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:11:04 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
> 
> WOULD YOU RATHER:
> 
> 1) Speak like Michael Jackson, or Mike Tyson?
> 
> 2) Have a nose like Michael Jackson circa May 2008, or a nose like Steve
> Martin in Roxanne?
> 
> 3) Have Michael Jackson's Thriller play at your funeral, or 'Mother' by Mr T?
> 
> 4) Random non-MJ one this time - Be a Muppet, a Fraggle, or a Thunderbird?
> (things to bear in mind - someone's hand constantly up your ass, "the
> trashheap has spoken", the chance to finally see Lady Penelope's plastic
> tits...)
> 
> 
> >
> > "Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> >> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart."
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > So, you would have preferred Michael Jackson if he had been Leonard
> > Cohen ?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200
> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >>
> >> Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and write
> >> in
> >> biro:
> >>
> >> Amateur Psychology Degree
> >> Conditional Pass
> >> Not to practise on humans or charge money
> >>
> >> ;)
> >>
> >> My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments, on
> >> reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such pressure
> >> that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive /
> >> abberant
> >> behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
> >> happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of ways.
> >> Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> >> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
> >> hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his
> >> skin
> >> and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the Heal
> >> the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
> >> empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
> >> McCartney for ANYTHING?)
> >>
> >> Prognosis on Michael Jackson:
> >>
> >> NOTHING TO SAY
> >>
> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU
> >>
> >> /waffle
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> > But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> > On Behalf Of Brendan
> >> > Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >> >
> >> > Don't care, don't care, don't care.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >> >>
> >> >> What is your favourite song of his
> >> >>
> >> >> Is he really dead ?
> >> >>
> >> >> _________________________________________________________________
> >> >> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos..
> >> >> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
> >> >> _________________________
> >> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> > HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
> >> > Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries
> >> of
> >> > which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services
> >> Authority.
> >> >
> >> > =============================================================================>
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 07:47:29 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

err STILL not reading what you have written

Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.

other gatherers pointed it out to you

Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.

> but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made regarding
> jury service

What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would you
know when you're not reading my posts?

> i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>
> i was not the only one voting against

You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That was
my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make up
your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.

> a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i haven't
> been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''

Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.

> never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life

When are you not?

> police never lie do they ?

You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.

>
>
>
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>
>
>
>
> Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use that.
>
> Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
> West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
> favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or whatever,
> but hey..
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>
>
> all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
> or get some new glasses
> testing the statement you made
> SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
> sorry ??? like fuck you are
> i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
> mentioned
>
>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>
>> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>
>> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>> when
>> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're holier
>> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>> are...sorry.
>>
>> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>
>> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it with
>> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>
>> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>
>> Yes, you do.
>>
>> "i await the usual one word response"
>>
>> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of sarcasm?
>> That's not positive now is it?
>>
>> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete
>> west"
>>
>> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between you
>> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than he
>> is
>> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
>> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>
>> >
>> > awww poor brendan
>> >
>> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>> >
>> > get over it
>> >
>> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>> >
>> > unless it fits in with your world view
>> >
>> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>> >
>> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>> >
>> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>> written
>> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>> >
>> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
>> >
>> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death around
>> me
>> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>> >
>> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>> >
>> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>> >
>> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona in
>> order
>> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>> >
>> > some gatherers have met me
>> >
>> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>> >
>> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>> >
>> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>> >
>> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>> >
>> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>> >
>> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real life
>> >
>> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
>> >
>> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to the
>> > cult of personality
>> >
>> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>> >
>> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>> >
>> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>> >
>> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>> heartbreaks
>> >
>> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>> >
>> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if i'm
>> not
>> > sure
>> >
>> > i await the usual one word response
>> >
>> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>> >
>> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a kindness
>> >
>> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the past
>> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete
>> west
>> >
>> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's minds
>> or
>> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>> thoughts
>> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>> >
>> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging remark
>> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
>> you
>> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>> imaginary
>> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high incidence
>> of
>> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>> promises
>> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>> options.
>> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>> >
>> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
>> chance
>> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>> nervous
>> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>> model..
>> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd imply
>> some
>> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and walked
>> > i will NOT take shit
>> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek approval
>> > from anyone
>> > i have never delivered a speech
>> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>> > fashionable
>> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>> raises a
>> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal space
>> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>> except
>> > in the instance of comedy ]
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by omission)?
>> A
>> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>> that
>> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>> with
>> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>> when
>> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
>> being
>> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>> tougher
>> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give a
>> shit
>> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested when
>> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you? Heaped
>> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>> > reasons?
>> >
>> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
>> you're
>> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like for
>> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in retrospect
>> and
>> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
>> way to
>> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on a
>> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>> before
>> > picking your nose?
>> >
>> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because they
>> have
>> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit in'?
>> Or
>> > to not fit in...
>> >
>> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a date?
>> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>> Tried
>> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who disgusts
>> you?
>> >
>> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>> SHIT.
>> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > actually I DON'T
>> >
>> >
>> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k it!
>> >
>> > Jelly...... melting
>> >
>> >
>> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > actually I DON'T
>> >
>> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >>
>> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Keep Smiling...
>> >> >
>> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>> >> >
>> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> about
>> >> a
>> >> > dead person
>> >> >
>> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>> alternative
>> >> set
>> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From what
>> >> I've
>> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>> the
>> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>> want.
>> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't feel
>> any
>> >> > compunctions either way.
>> >> >
>> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>> >> fashionable
>> >> > to dislike
>> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your comments
>> >> with
>> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>> doing
>> >> my
>> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>> >> tabloids I
>> >> > just make them...
>> >> >
>> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>> >> >
>> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>> actually
>> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> about
>> >> a
>> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in real
>> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>> death
>> >> (so
>> >> > they're saying).
>> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>> have a
>> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>> been
>> >> > settled.
>> >> >
>> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>> >> >
>> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all about
>> any
>> >> or
>> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>> >> >
>> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>> >> >
>> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>> >> >
>> >> > 'Save me...
>> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>> also
>> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole bloody
>> >> circus
>> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>> >> activities. I
>> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>> pieces
>> >> of
>> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>> >> multi-million
>> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have come
>> was
>> >> a
>> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>> problems"..
>> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>> makes
>> >> it
>> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>> little
>> >> > income-tax evasion..
>> >> >
>> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>> >> half-decent
>> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do we
>> all
>> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>> offends
>> >> > someone?
>> >> >
>> >> > Jim.
>> >> >
>> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this inane
>> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>> abused
>> >> word
>> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>> >> > I'm sick of it.
>> >> >
>> >> > Alex in NYC
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>> downloads
>> >> etc
>> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>> smells
>> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>> >> >
>> >> > Jelly.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Oh Christ.
>> >> >
>> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>> >> >
>> >> > Darren
>> >> > Hungerford, UK
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>> out
>> >> > more.
>> >> >
>> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Gathering mailing list
>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
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>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
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>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 07:50:29 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:50:29 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W251F54593CFB755AE6662902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<40089.203.185.215.144.1246439464.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BAY132-W251F54593CFB755AE6662902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <17367.203.185.215.144.1246449029.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Wouldn't be much left to see now anyway...

>
> how the hell would you see lady penelope's plastic tits being a
> thunderbird?
>
> all you would see is either outer space / all points of the compass on
> earth from the sky or the sea bed
>
>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:11:04 +1200
>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: [kj] OT: WOULD YOU RATHER
>>
>> WOULD YOU RATHER:
>>
>> 1) Speak like Michael Jackson, or Mike Tyson?
>>
>> 2) Have a nose like Michael Jackson circa May 2008, or a nose like Steve
>> Martin in Roxanne?
>>
>> 3) Have Michael Jackson's Thriller play at your funeral, or 'Mother' by
>> Mr T?
>>
>> 4) Random non-MJ one this time - Be a Muppet, a Fraggle, or a
>> Thunderbird?
>> (things to bear in mind - someone's hand constantly up your ass, "the
>> trashheap has spoken", the chance to finally see Lady Penelope's plastic
>> tits...)
>>
>>
>> >
>> > "Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for
>> something
>> >> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart."
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > So, you would have preferred Michael Jackson if he had been Leonard
>> > Cohen ?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200
>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> >>
>> >> Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and
>> write
>> >> in
>> >> biro:
>> >>
>> >> Amateur Psychology Degree
>> >> Conditional Pass
>> >> Not to practise on humans or charge money
>> >>
>> >> ;)
>> >>
>> >> My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments,
>> on
>> >> reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such
>> pressure
>> >> that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive /
>> >> abberant
>> >> behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
>> >> happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of
>> ways.
>> >> Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for
>> something
>> >> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
>> >> hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his
>> >> skin
>> >> and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the
>> Heal
>> >> the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
>> >> empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
>> >> McCartney for ANYTHING?)
>> >>
>> >> Prognosis on Michael Jackson:
>> >>
>> >> NOTHING TO SAY
>> >>
>> >> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU
>> >>
>> >> /waffle
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> > But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of Brendan
>> >> > Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
>> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> >> >
>> >> > Don't care, don't care, don't care.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>> >> >>
>> >> >> What is your favourite song of his
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Is he really dead ?
>> >> >>
>> >> >> _________________________________________________________________
>> >> >> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos..
>> >> >> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
>> >> >> _________________________
>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>> >> Authority.
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>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
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>> > _________________________________________________________________
>> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 08:07:25 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:07:25 +0000
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>


do i have to spell it out to you ?

YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS 

other gatherers pointed this out 

you ignored it 

i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes 

and frankly i can't be bothered 

i have better things to do 

i notice you like to give shit but can't take it 

ever heard the glass houses proverb ?

i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me 

but then again you are pretty blinkered 
don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band on the planet  
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> 
> err STILL not reading what you have written
> 
> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
> 
> other gatherers pointed it out to you
> 
> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
> 
> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made regarding
> > jury service
> 
> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would you
> know when you're not reading my posts?
> 
> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
> >
> > i was not the only one voting against
> 
> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That was
> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make up
> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
> 
> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i haven't
> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
> 
> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
> 
> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
> 
> When are you not?
> 
> > police never lie do they ?
> 
> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
> 
> >
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use that.
> >
> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or whatever,
> > but hey..
> >
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
> > or get some new glasses
> > testing the statement you made
> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
> > mentioned
> >
> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >>
> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
> >>
> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
> >> when
> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're holier
> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
> >> are...sorry.
> >>
> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
> >>
> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it with
> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
> >>
> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
> >>
> >> Yes, you do.
> >>
> >> "i await the usual one word response"
> >>
> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of sarcasm?
> >> That's not positive now is it?
> >>
> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete
> >> west"
> >>
> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between you
> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than he
> >> is
> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
> >>
> >> >
> >> > awww poor brendan
> >> >
> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
> >> >
> >> > get over it
> >> >
> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
> >> >
> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
> >> >
> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
> >> >
> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
> >> >
> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
> >> written
> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
> >> >
> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
> >> >
> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death around
> >> me
> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
> >> >
> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
> >> >
> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
> >> >
> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona in
> >> order
> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
> >> >
> >> > some gatherers have met me
> >> >
> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
> >> >
> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
> >> >
> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
> >> >
> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
> >> >
> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
> >> >
> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real life
> >> >
> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
> >> >
> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to the
> >> > cult of personality
> >> >
> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
> >> >
> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
> >> >
> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
> >> >
> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
> >> heartbreaks
> >> >
> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
> >> >
> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if i'm
> >> not
> >> > sure
> >> >
> >> > i await the usual one word response
> >> >
> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
> >> >
> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a kindness
> >> >
> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the past
> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete
> >> west
> >> >
> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's minds
> >> or
> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
> >> thoughts
> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
> >> >
> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging remark
> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
> >> you
> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
> >> imaginary
> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high incidence
> >> of
> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
> >> promises
> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
> >> options.
> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
> >> >
> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
> >> chance
> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
> >> nervous
> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
> >> model..
> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd imply
> >> some
> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and walked
> >> > i will NOT take shit
> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek approval
> >> > from anyone
> >> > i have never delivered a speech
> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
> >> > fashionable
> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
> >> raises a
> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal space
> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
> >> except
> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by omission)?
> >> A
> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
> >> that
> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
> >> with
> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
> >> when
> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
> >> being
> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
> >> tougher
> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give a
> >> shit
> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested when
> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you? Heaped
> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
> >> > reasons?
> >> >
> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
> >> you're
> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like for
> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in retrospect
> >> and
> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
> >> way to
> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on a
> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
> >> before
> >> > picking your nose?
> >> >
> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because they
> >> have
> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit in'?
> >> Or
> >> > to not fit in...
> >> >
> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a date?
> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
> >> Tried
> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who disgusts
> >> you?
> >> >
> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
> >> SHIT.
> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > actually I DON'T
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k it!
> >> >
> >> > Jelly...... melting
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > actually I DON'T
> >> >
> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >>
> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
> >> >>
> >> >> >
> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
> >> >> >
> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
> >> about
> >> >> a
> >> >> > dead person
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
> >> alternative
> >> >> set
> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From what
> >> >> I've
> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
> >> the
> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
> >> want.
> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't feel
> >> any
> >> >> > compunctions either way.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
> >> >> fashionable
> >> >> > to dislike
> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your comments
> >> >> with
> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
> >> doing
> >> >> my
> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
> >> >> tabloids I
> >> >> > just make them...
> >> >> >
> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
> >> >> >
> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
> >> actually
> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
> >> about
> >> >> a
> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in real
> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
> >> death
> >> >> (so
> >> >> > they're saying).
> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
> >> have a
> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
> >> been
> >> >> > settled.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all about
> >> any
> >> >> or
> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
> >> >> >
> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
> >> >> >
> >> >> > 'Save me...
> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
> >> also
> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole bloody
> >> >> circus
> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
> >> >> activities. I
> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
> >> pieces
> >> >> of
> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
> >> >> multi-million
> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have come
> >> was
> >> >> a
> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
> >> problems"..
> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
> >> makes
> >> >> it
> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
> >> little
> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
> >> >> half-decent
> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do we
> >> all
> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
> >> offends
> >> >> > someone?
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Jim.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this inane
> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
> >> abused
> >> >> word
> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Alex in NYC
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
> >> downloads
> >> >> etc
> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
> >> smells
> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Jelly.
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Oh Christ.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Darren
> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
> >> out
> >> >> > more.
> >> >> >
> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> >
> >> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> _______________________________________________
> >> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> >> > more.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> >> > _________________________________________________________________
> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> > more.
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 09:32:35 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:32:35 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

>
> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>
> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS

I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.

> other gatherers pointed this out
>
> you ignored it

Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.

> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes

My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...

> and frankly i can't be bothered

So stop replying then...

> i have better things to do

Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.

> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it

You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)

> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?

Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.

> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me

I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
our arguments.

>
> but then again you are pretty blinkered

You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.

> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band
on the planet

Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)

Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.


>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>
>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>
>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>
>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>
>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>
>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>> regarding
>> > jury service
>>
>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>> you
>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>
>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>> >
>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>
>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>> was
>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>> up
>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>
>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>> haven't
>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>
>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>
>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>
>> When are you not?
>>
>> > police never lie do they ?
>>
>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>> that.
>> >
>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>> whatever,
>> > but hey..
>> >
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>> > or get some new glasses
>> > testing the statement you made
>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>> > mentioned
>> >
>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >>
>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>> >>
>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>> >> when
>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>> holier
>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>> >> are...sorry.
>> >>
>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>> >>
>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>> with
>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>> >>
>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>> >>
>> >> Yes, you do.
>> >>
>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>> >>
>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>> sarcasm?
>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>> >>
>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>> pete
>> >> west"
>> >>
>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>> you
>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>> he
>> >> is
>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > awww poor brendan
>> >> >
>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>> >> >
>> >> > get over it
>> >> >
>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>> >> >
>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>> >> >
>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>> >> >
>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>> >> >
>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>> >> written
>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>> >> >
>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
>> >> >
>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>> around
>> >> me
>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>> >> >
>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>> >> >
>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>> >> >
>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>> in
>> >> order
>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>> >> >
>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>> >> >
>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>> >> >
>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>> >> >
>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>> >> >
>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>> >> >
>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>> >> >
>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>> life
>> >> >
>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
>> >> >
>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>> the
>> >> > cult of personality
>> >> >
>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>> >> >
>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>> >> >
>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>> >> >
>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>> >> heartbreaks
>> >> >
>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>> >> >
>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>> i'm
>> >> not
>> >> > sure
>> >> >
>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>> >> >
>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>> >> >
>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>> kindness
>> >> >
>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>> past
>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>> pete
>> >> west
>> >> >
>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>> minds
>> >> or
>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>> >> thoughts
>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>> >> >
>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>> remark
>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
>> >> you
>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>> >> imaginary
>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>> incidence
>> >> of
>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>> >> promises
>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>> >> options.
>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>> >> >
>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
>> >> chance
>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>> >> nervous
>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>> >> model..
>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>> imply
>> >> some
>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>> walked
>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>> approval
>> >> > from anyone
>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>> >> > fashionable
>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>> >> raises a
>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>> space
>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>> >> except
>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>> omission)?
>> >> A
>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>> >> that
>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>> >> with
>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>> >> when
>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
>> >> being
>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>> >> tougher
>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>> a
>> >> shit
>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>> when
>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>> Heaped
>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>> >> > reasons?
>> >> >
>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
>> >> you're
>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>> for
>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>> retrospect
>> >> and
>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
>> >> way to
>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on
>> a
>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>> >> before
>> >> > picking your nose?
>> >> >
>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>> they
>> >> have
>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>> in'?
>> >> Or
>> >> > to not fit in...
>> >> >
>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>> date?
>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>> >> Tried
>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>> disgusts
>> >> you?
>> >> >
>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>> >> SHIT.
>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > actually I DON'T
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>> it!
>> >> >
>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > actually I DON'T
>> >> >
>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> >> about
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > dead person
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>> >> alternative
>> >> >> set
>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>> what
>> >> >> I've
>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>> >> the
>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>> >> want.
>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>> feel
>> >> any
>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>> >> >> fashionable
>> >> >> > to dislike
>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>> comments
>> >> >> with
>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>> >> doing
>> >> >> my
>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>> >> >> tabloids I
>> >> >> > just make them...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>> >> actually
>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> >> about
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>> real
>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>> >> death
>> >> >> (so
>> >> >> > they're saying).
>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>> >> have a
>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>> >> been
>> >> >> > settled.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>> about
>> >> any
>> >> >> or
>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>> >> also
>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>> bloody
>> >> >> circus
>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>> >> >> activities. I
>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>> >> pieces
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>> >> >> multi-million
>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>> come
>> >> was
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>> >> problems"..
>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>> >> makes
>> >> >> it
>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>> >> little
>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>> >> >> half-decent
>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>> we
>> >> all
>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>> >> offends
>> >> >> > someone?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Jim.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>> inane
>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>> >> abused
>> >> >> word
>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>> >> downloads
>> >> >> etc
>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>> >> smells
>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Jelly.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Darren
>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>> Find
>> >> out
>> >> >> > more.
>> >> >> >
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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Wed Jul  1 09:41:05 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 09:41:05 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
Message-ID: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


Boys,....

Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?

Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 

Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.

Just my two cents.
Alex in NYC





-----Original Message-----
>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>
>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>
>>
>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>
>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>
>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>
>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>
>> you ignored it
>
>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>
>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>
>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>
>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>
>So stop replying then...
>
>> i have better things to do
>
>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>
>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>
>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>
>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>
>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>
>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>
>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
>our arguments.
>
>>
>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>
>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>
>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band
>on the planet
>
>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>
>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>
>
>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>
>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>
>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>
>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>
>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>
>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>> regarding
>>> > jury service
>>>
>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>>> you
>>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>
>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>>> >
>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>
>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>>> was
>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>>> up
>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>>
>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>> haven't
>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>
>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>
>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>
>>> When are you not?
>>>
>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>
>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>> that.
>>> >
>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>>> whatever,
>>> > but hey..
>>> >
>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>>> > or get some new glasses
>>> > testing the statement you made
>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>>> > mentioned
>>> >
>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >>
>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>> >>
>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>>> >> when
>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>>> holier
>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>>> >> are...sorry.
>>> >>
>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>> >>
>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>>> with
>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>> >>
>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>> >>
>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>> sarcasm?
>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>> >>
>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>> pete
>>> >> west"
>>> >>
>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>>> you
>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>>> he
>>> >> is
>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>> >>
>>> >> >
>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>> >> >
>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > get over it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>> >> >
>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>>> >> written
>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>> around
>>> >> me
>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>> >> >
>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>>> in
>>> >> order
>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>> >> >
>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>>> life
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>>> the
>>> >> > cult of personality
>>> >> >
>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>> >> >
>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>> >> heartbreaks
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>>> i'm
>>> >> not
>>> >> > sure
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>> kindness
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>>> past
>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>> pete
>>> >> west
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>> minds
>>> >> or
>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>>> >> thoughts
>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>> remark
>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
>>> >> you
>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>>> >> imaginary
>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>> incidence
>>> >> of
>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>>> >> promises
>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>>> >> options.
>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
>>> >> chance
>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>>> >> nervous
>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>>> >> model..
>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>> imply
>>> >> some
>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>> walked
>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>> approval
>>> >> > from anyone
>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>>> >> > fashionable
>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>>> >> raises a
>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>>> space
>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>>> >> except
>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>> omission)?
>>> >> A
>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>>> >> that
>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>>> >> with
>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>>> >> when
>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
>>> >> being
>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>>> >> tougher
>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>>> a
>>> >> shit
>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>>> when
>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>> Heaped
>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>>> >> > reasons?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
>>> >> you're
>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>>> for
>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>> retrospect
>>> >> and
>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
>>> >> way to
>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on
>>> a
>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>>> >> before
>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>> they
>>> >> have
>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>>> in'?
>>> >> Or
>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>>> date?
>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>> >> Tried
>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>> disgusts
>>> >> you?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>>> >> SHIT.
>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>>> it!
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>> >> alternative
>>> >> >> set
>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>> what
>>> >> >> I've
>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>>> >> the
>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>> >> want.
>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>> feel
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>> >> >> fashionable
>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>> comments
>>> >> >> with
>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>> >> doing
>>> >> >> my
>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>> >> actually
>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>> real
>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>> >> death
>>> >> >> (so
>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>> >> have a
>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>>> >> been
>>> >> >> > settled.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>> about
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> or
>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>> >> also
>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>> bloody
>>> >> >> circus
>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>> >> >> activities. I
>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>> >> pieces
>>> >> >> of
>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>> >> >> multi-million
>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>> come
>>> >> was
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>> >> problems"..
>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>> >> makes
>>> >> >> it
>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>> >> little
>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>> >> >> half-decent
>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>> we
>>> >> all
>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>> >> offends
>>> >> >> > someone?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>> inane
>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>> >> abused
>>> >> >> word
>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>> >> downloads
>>> >> >> etc
>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>> >> smells
>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Darren
>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>> Find
>>> >> out
>>> >> >> > more.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>> out
>>> >> > more.
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>> > more.
>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


From 65snoopy at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 10:30:26 2009
From: 65snoopy at gmail.com (Neil Perry)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:30:26 +0200
Subject: [kj] [KJ] HellFest's Report
In-Reply-To: <20090630213310.DAA5C2400372@mwumf0226.dbmail.com>
References: <20090630213310.DAA5C2400372@mwumf0226.dbmail.com>
Message-ID: <ebc0be740907010730v3626a029la9f5971682e37e7@mail.gmail.com>

That was heartwarming to read!

n

2009/6/30 Frenchy Frenzy <frenchyfrenzy at killingjoke.fr>

>  *Hi all,*
>
> * *
>
> *Last week I?ve spent one of my best moments with the Joke.*
>
> *Arrived early by plane, I had time to check in at The Mercure Hotel close
> to the south railroad central station of Nantes city.*
>
> * *
>
> *Immediately, I?ve noticed some full tattoed boys (unusual for this kind
> of places) and recognised in the lounge area the singer of the Misfits Jerry
> Only (very friendly)*
>
> *I said to myself that other artists should have reservations by the
> organization in the same hotel and ask the lady at the front desk ?if Mister
> Coleman had already checked in ??*
>
> * *
>
> *She answered : ?not yet ;o))) Bingo*
>
> * *
>
> *Last time in Paris sept 08, I was already in the same hotel as all the
> boys (The Mercure at Porte de Pantin) and bumped into Youth coming out the
> breakfast room?and the front desk man took a photo of both of us?*
>
> * *
>
> *Arrived in Clisson by train, a very nice little village, I was about to
> get a pass at the VIP/ Guests tent but the young lady at the desk told me
> that the group hadn?t arrived yet and that she didn?t got any list from the
> group.*
>
> *She added that last night ?M?tley Cr?e gave his list 5 minutes before
> their gig at 1AM?*
>
> * *
>
> *That was 3:30 PM and I couldn?t even pay my ticket (as I do everytime to
> support the group) because I needed an AAA Pass to use my videocameras?.*
>
> * *
>
> *It took me 20 minutes to go to the Artists entrance where all the tour
> buses and trucks are parked.*
>
> * *
>
> *Of course there were many security controls and began to speak with one
> of the guardian when 200 meters away from me I just noticed Jaz and Youth
> walking to their bus.*
>
> *I just began to shout ?JAAAAAAAAZZZZZ as loud as I could because that was
> my only chance to get heared considering the loudness of the death metal gig
> at the moment very near.*
>
> * *
>
> *By chance, they both heared my shouts and that was the 1st good point of
> the day?*
>
> * *
>
> *As the guardian couldn?t let me in without the famous bracelet, Jaz had
> to go back to the Artist /VIP area and came back running (yes running like I
> had never seen him before ha ha ha ) and gave me the precious yellow Artist
> Bracelet?s which allowed me to go everywhere with my videocameras.*
>
> * *
>
> *Would you ever imagine on single second Marilyn Manson doing the same
> thing for one of his long time follower ?*
>
> * *
>
> *Sure not : that?swhy they are awesome and unique !!*
>
> * *
>
> *We spent some time in the Bus tour where I picked up from my bag the
> ?brand new Gathering 2008 boxset 4cds? just arrived by post the week before
> and was surprised that they were astonished it had been released?.*
>
> *Youth began to calculate the estimated royalties and finally signed on
> the booklet ?Where is the cash Matt ?,o)))*
>
> * *
>
> *No comment, but it?s just incredible that the group is NOT informed of
> the ?official? release.*
>
> * *
>
> *We went to the backstage area (in fact a big Sport Arena (surrounded by
> the 2 main stages and the rest of the site) very calm considering the
> loudness outside.*
>
> * *
>
> *I would say very well organized with many guardians checking all the
> famous bracelets in 6 colours with different authorizations?*
>
> *Of course the yellow one is the ultimate ha ha ha ?*
>
> * *
>
> *Jaz & Youth proposed me to follow them for an interview for french TV and
> it was funny to see them with shorts and cigars like 2 cool tourists
> answering the questions during ? hour.*
>
> * *
>
> *The sun was shining and the temperature was perfect, no rain predicted.*
>
> * *
>
> *A wonderful atmosphere with the 2 main stages only separated with a big
> screen; so every 5 minutes a group is playing and no wait between the
> groups.*
>
> * *
>
> *Everybody is on time and better has to, because the running order
> contains 107 groups in 3 days and no extended delay is allowed except for
> Motley, Marilyn Manson and Manowar.*
>
> * *
>
> *Saw a little bit of Soulfly (a lot of stage diving ;))) Amebix ( good
> rhythmic groove) and Misfits (took some photos with Jerry backstage (a very
> funny guy and easy to approach) and went eating  before the second main act
> of the day The Joke*
>
> * *
>
> *I?ve found the best place to film the gig with my tripod, just in front
> of the stage between Geordie & Jaz in the bouncers area. *
>
> * *
>
> *As the stage was wide maybe 12 or 15 bouncers took place behind the
> barriers and protected me from the potential stage divers.*
>
> *OK there were less than for Soulfly or Gojira (a French Group who Big
> Paul was enthusiastic about the rhythm section we saw together on the side
> of the stage)*
>
> * *
>
> *The weather was perfect and the light show was one of the best they got
> (except for the Sheph?s in 2005) and they played a classical but perfect gig
> for all the audience who acclaimed all the titles including Love Loke Blood
> ( which they didn?t want to play in the afternoon and maybe as I remembered
> them that it was ?their? hit in France and people were certainly expecting
> it) Eighties , the Wait.*
>
> * *
>
> *Everybody was in a good shape and Geordie played as if he was caressing
> his guitar as usual and the groove injected by BPF and Youth is more and
> more perfect.*
>
> * *
>
> *Madness was very well acclaimed too and was not supposed to be played.*
>
> *I said to them that I had ?rediscovered? this track live on stage and
> maybe they have listened to me.*
>
> * *
>
> *Next time I will ask for my personal tracks list including Twilight Of
> the Mortal which Jaz sang a little bit during the soundcheck at the Forum
> 08, Slipstream, Universe B, Implant etc?;o)*
>
> * *
>
> *I must say that the footages I got were the best ones I ever filmed
> because there were closed to me and the lightshow was powerful and the
> result delights me.*
>
> * *
>
> *I must add here one thing : during the Heaven?s gig I gave a full hard
> disk drive to the management containing all the 16 gigs and backstage &
> soundchecks I?ve filmed and they ?should? release some DVD?s*
>
> * *
>
> *After the show I decided to have a look for 2 songs of Marilyn Manson
> (that was enough ha ha ha) and got back inside for sharing all those
> delicious cheeses and wines brought from my home town Lyon city.*
>
> * *
>
> *In fact, I think that the boys during the day were a little bit focused
> on their evening show and intended to deliver the best show they could.*
>
> * *
>
> *I saw the difference after the show when they were much more relaxed and
> ready for savouring Comt?, Saint Marcellin and Saint F?licien, Saint Joseph
> etc?*
>
> * *
>
> *Of course we had some fresh bread from the VIP Restaurant too?*
>
> * *
>
> *Everything was simply perfect and we were all delighted with all these
> different saveurs.*
>
> * *
>
> *Sharing this with them was like the time was suspended for 1 H ??..All
> the 5 guys and myself with nobody else*
>
> * *
>
> *After all, something very simple but a REAL moment with a lot of laughs.*
>
> * *
>
> *For example, at one moment Vincent Raven came with the guys of Amebix and
> he was?..I would say?stoned.*
>
> *I said to Jaz : ?Hey here is your driver who will drive you at your hotel
> ha ha ha  and we had a great laugh*
>
> *Jaz said to Vincent : It?s like your father: you?ve got it in your DNA
> ;o)))*
>
> * *
>
> *The room finally got some new invited people and I would say that the
> guys from Amebix were very nice and they felt very honoured to be he Joke?s
> guests and I saw ?gratitude and respect ?in their eyes.*
>
> * *
>
> *As It was 3 AM, we had to leave the Festival and an official small
> shuttle drove us (Jaz & Me) to our hotel in Nantes.*
>
> * *
>
> *In fact during 25 mins, there were so many roundabouts that Jaz was very
> close to be ill in the car and me too ha ha ha !! *
>
> * *
>
> *The day after I phoned Jaz in room 201 (I was in 211) at 10 AM and we
> went to the breakfast room to get forces again?*
>
> * *
>
> *It was again a simple moment but unusual with Jaz as you can imagine.*
>
> * *
>
> *We spoke about the gig, the happiness they all had playing again together
> and the projects:*
>
> * *
>
>    - *Jaz is about to be honoured by France and will receive the Medal of
>    Chevalier des Arts et des Lettres in sept /oct 09 and they should play an
>    acoustic gig at Les Bains Douches where they played at their beginning(25th
>    of June 80)*
>    - *In fact he gave me a photo where he already has the famous medal but
>    ceremony will take place after*
>
> * *
>
> *This info has been confirmed to me one week after by one of my friend who
> works at the METRO newspaper.*
>
> * *
>
> *Raven and him were reconciled before his death and he was about to come
> back in the Joke, but there were no project with Atkins at all.*
>
> *?Raven was from the family not him ?*
>
> * *
>
> *There are apparently 8 or 9 new songs written?.*
>
> * *
>
> *They should record before end of year 200?.9  ;o))*
>
> * *
>
> *One of his daughter has a restaurant in Geneva.*
>
> * *
>
> *His cousin plays in the French group from Lyon City Le Peuple de l?Herbe
> (people from the weed)*
>
> * *
>
> *Of course the awaited gig in 2012?.*
>
> * *
>
> *He is going to live in Paris soon and has another project concerning his
> private life?*
>
> * *
>
> *Finally after a great shower (in our separate rooms of course ha ha ah )
> we met again and I helped him at the railroad station to get his electronic
> ticket ?*
>
> * *
>
> *Jaz and computers?.*
>
> * *
>
> *It?s funny because his name was printed on the ticket much more unusual
> as a signature?*
>
> * *
>
> *We said goodbye on the platform till our next ?meeting? on the 31 th of
> july 2009 in Venice Italy and certainly a longer gig as they?ll play at the
> Airport Festival as Headliner with only one group before.*
>
> * *
>
> *So simply the best moments with the reunited Joke since some
> unforgettable moments in Milano 2005 with Raven?.*
>
> * *
>
> *Stephane ?Frenchy Frenzy?*
>
> * *
>
> *PS : Nantes is a beautiful city full of welcoming people too*
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> * *
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
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From logvinoff77 at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 11:12:31 2009
From: logvinoff77 at hotmail.com (mike)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:12:31 -0400
Subject: [kj] hellfest report
Message-ID: <SNT115-W3965F32FBF3787CA54E6B4B52E0@phx.gbl>


Thanks for the report Stephane!

Nice to get some news about the Joke, hard to believe they did'nt know their own live boxset had been released.

 

If you meet them again..could you please ask about the documentary that has obviously been nixed for a summer release:(

 

Thanks again

_________________________________________________________________
Attention all humans. We are your photos. Free us.
http://go.microsoft.com/?linkid=9666046
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From sneakypete at uwclub.net  Wed Jul  1 11:14:16 2009
From: sneakypete at uwclub.net (Peter Moltesen)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:14:16 +0100
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <20090701151422.330651058D@mailwash5.pair.com>



Alex said:

>Growing up, the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick,
>soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 

Nail hit, fairly and squarely on the head !
:o)

Peter


From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 11:13:38 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:13:38 -0400
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <41551.203.185.215.144.1246439863.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <E1MLeex-0006Rc-UZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
	<41551.203.185.215.144.1246439863.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.? Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.

I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.

> Brendan,
>
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
>
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
>
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
>
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A lis
t about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
>
>
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
> Hi Brendan,
>
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
>
> Jamie QC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
>
>>
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>>
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>>
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>>
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>>
>> l l
iked a few of his songs
>>
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>>
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>>
>>
>>
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


________________________________________________________________________
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From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 11:22:24 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:22:24 -0400
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <8CBC876DEB7D5A7-13DC-207A@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>

Personally, MJ's music never did it for me.? But then I could say the same about Kiss.

Jamie


-----Original Message-----
From: Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:41
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!




oys,....
Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can we 
rop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough of that 
ullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more revisionist shite 
bout that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or not 
he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to me 
erved as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was 
ichael Jackson's product. 
Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. Let's 
ot lower our standards by discussing him further.
Just my two cents.
lex in NYC


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>
Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead

>
> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>
> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS

I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.

> other gatherers pointed thi
s out
>
> you ignored it

Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.

> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes

My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...

> and frankly i can't be bothered

So stop replying then...

> i have better things to do

Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.

> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it

You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)

> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?

Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.

> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me

I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
our arguments.

>
> but then again you are pretty blinkered

You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.

> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only 
good band
on the planet

Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)

Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.


>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>
>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>
>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>
>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>
>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>
>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>> regarding
>> > jury service
>>
>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>> you
>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>
>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>> >
>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>
>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>> was
>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>> up
>> you
r mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>
>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>> haven't
>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>
>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>
>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>
>> When are you not?
>>
>> > police never lie do they ?
>>
>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>> that.
>> >
>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>> whatever,
>> > but hey..
>> >
>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >
>> >
>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>> > or get some new glasses
>> > testing the statement=2
0you made
>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>> > mentioned
>> >
>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >>
>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>> >>
>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>> >> when
>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>> holier
>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>> >> are...sorry.
>> >>
>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>> >>
>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>> with
>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>> >>
>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>> >>
>> >> Yes, you do.
>> >>
>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>> >>
>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>> sarcasm?
>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>> >>
>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>> pete
>> >> west"
>> >>
>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>> you
>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>> he
>> >> is
>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite
 witty when he gets
>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>> >>
>> >> >
>> >> > awww poor brendan
>> >> >
>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>> >> >
>> >> > get over it
>> >> >
>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>> >> >
>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>> >> >
>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>> >> >
>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>> >> >
>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>> >> written
>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>> >> >
>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
>> >> >
>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>> around
>> >> me
>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>> >> >
>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>> >> >
>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>> >> >
>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>> in
>> >> order
>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>> >> >
>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>> >> >
>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>> >> >
>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>> >> >
>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>20>> >
>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>> >> >
>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>> >> >
>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>> life
>> >> >
>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
>> >> >
>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>> the
>> >> > cult of personality
>> >> >
>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>> >> >
>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>> >> >
>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>> >> >
>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>> >> heartbreaks
>> >> >
>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>> >> >
>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>> i'm
>> >> not
>> >> > sure
>> >> >
>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>> >> >
>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>> >> >
>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>> kindness
>> >> >
>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>> past
>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>> pete
>> >> west
>> >> >
>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: bq at s
oundgardener.co.nz
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>> minds
>> >> or
>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>> >> thoughts
>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>> >> >
>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>> remark
>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
>> >> you
>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>> >> imaginary
>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>> incidence
>> >> of
>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>> >> promises
>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>> >> options.
>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>> >> >
>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
>> >> chance
>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>> >> nervous
>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>> >> model..
>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>> imply
>> >> some
>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>> >>20>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>> walked
>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>> approval
>> >> > from anyone
>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>> >> > fashionable
>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>> >> raises a
>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>> space
>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>> >> except
>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >

>> >> >
>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>> omission)?
>> >> A
>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>> >> that
>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>> >> with
>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>> >> when
>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
>> >> being
>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>> >> tougher
>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>> a
>> >> shit
>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>> when
>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>> Heaped
>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>> >> > reasons?
>> >> >
>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
>> >> you're
>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>> for
>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>> retrospect
>> >> and
>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
>> >> way to
>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on
>> a
>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>> >> before
>> >> > picking your nose?
>> >> 
>
>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>> they
>> >> have
>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>> in'?
>> >> Or
>> >> > to not fit in...
>> >> >
>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>> date?
>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>> >> Tried
>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>> disgusts
>> >> you?
>> >> >
>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>> >> SHIT.
>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > actually I DON'T
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>> it!
>> >> >
>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > actually I DON'T
>> >> >
>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> >> To: gath
ering at misera.net
>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >>
>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>> >> >>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> >> about
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > dead person
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>> >> alternative
>> >> >> set
>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>> what
>> >> >> I've
>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>> >> the
>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>> >> want.
>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought
 into it anyway so I don't
>> feel
>> >> any
>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>> >> >> fashionable
>> >> >> > to dislike
>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>> comments
>> >> >> with
>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>> >> doing
>> >> >> my
>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>> >> >> tabloids I
>> >> >> > just make them...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tr
ipe that I've read
>> >> actually
>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>> >> about
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>> real
>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>> >> death
>> >> >> (so
>> >> >> > they're saying).
>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>> >> have a
>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>> >> been
>> >> >> > settled.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>> about
>> >> any
>> >> >> or
>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>> >> >>20> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>> >> also
>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>> bloody
>> >> >> circus
>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>> >> >> activities. I
>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>> >> pieces
>> >> >> of
>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>> >> >> multi-million
>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>> come
>> >> was
>> >> >> a
>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>> >> problems"..
>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>> >> makes
>> >> >> it
>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>> >> little
>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>> >> >> half-decent
>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>> we
>> >> all
>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>> >> offends
>> >> >> > someone?
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Jim.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
 >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>> inane
>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>> >> abused
>> >> >> word
>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>> >> downloads
>> >> >> etc
>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>> >> smells
>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Jelly.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>20>
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Darren
>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>> Find
>> >> out
>> >> >> > more.
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> >
>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>> out
>> >> > more.
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>> >> >
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>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
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>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
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>> > _________________________________________________________________
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>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>> > Gathering mailing list
>> > Gathering at misera.net
>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
_______________________________________________
athering mailing list
athering at misera.net
ttp://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


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From circusbar at uol.com.br  Wed Jul  1 11:18:31 2009
From: circusbar at uol.com.br (circusbar)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:18:31 -0300
Subject: [kj] [KJ] HellFest's Report
In-Reply-To: <20090630213310.DAA5C2400372@mwumf0226.dbmail.com>
References: <20090630213310.DAA5C2400372@mwumf0226.dbmail.com>
Message-ID: <4a4b7e47a47d1_41a81555555881ac139e@weasel7.tmail>

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From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 11:27:32 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 11:27:32 -0400
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl><E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz><BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>

"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead



You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)


________________________________________________________________________
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 11:38:50 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:38:50 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <E1MM1tc-0005Rr-An@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>

Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most
translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning

the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running

off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)



  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 11:56:27 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:56:27 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply
NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only
decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict)
is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt"
doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the
context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has
to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more
it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
 
  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as
there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more
carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the
world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly
<grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,

believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair

enough. I bite just like anyone else.



I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up

his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to

me.



I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right

in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.

I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.



I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't

remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that

if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is

exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based

on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally

going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with

overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.



It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being

struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be

going for however.



> Brendan,

>

> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an

> element of doubt".

>

> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based

> on

> the weight of probability".

>

> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a

> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable

> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,

> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;

> yours was not.

>

> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of

> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him

> look stupid.? True or false?

>

> Jamie

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

> there was an element of doubt?in the case

>

>

> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We

> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil

> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty

> as soon as there's an element of doubt?

>

>

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> ]

> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com

> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

>

> Hi Brendan,

>

> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?

> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".

>

> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the

> judge did explain it.

>

> Jamie QC

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32

> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as

> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically

> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on

> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result

> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.

> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind

> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your

> role as a juror?

>

>>

>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed

>>

>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his

>> dad

>> made him do it for the money

>>

>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt

>>

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt

>> in the case

>>

>> l liked a few of his songs

>>

>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white

>>

>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head

>>

>>

>>

>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk

>> To: gathering at misera.net

>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000

>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges

>>  What is your favourite song of his

>>  Is he really dead ?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________________________________________________

> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the

> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.

> _______________________________________________

> Gathering mailing list

> Gathering at misera.net

> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

>





_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 12:08:05 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:08:05 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <E1MM1tc-0005Rr-An@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MM1tc-0005Rr-An@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <000901c9fa66$1ff83c20$5fe8b460$@com>

Turn the other eye for an eye.

 

(But the OT God was a vexatious omnipotent entity, whereas he seems to have
chilled a bit by the NT)

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:39 PM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

 

Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.

 

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most
translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead

You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)

 

  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 

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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 12:12:47 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12:47 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>

Sorry Brenda. Can't let that one pass.

 

The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent.
The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument
to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don't decide not
to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not
convicting is a given.

 

This is not always an ideal situation, but I can't offhand think of a
better.

 

Although jousting has its merits.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply
NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only
decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict)
is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt"
doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the
context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has
to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more
it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.

 

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as
there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more
carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the
world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly
<grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.
 
I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.
 
I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
 
I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
 
It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.
 
> Brendan,
> 
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
> 
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
> 
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
> 
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
> 
> Jamie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
> 
> 
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
> 
> 
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> ]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Brendan,
> 
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
> 
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
> 
> Jamie QC
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
> 
>> 
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>> 
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>> 
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>> 
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>> 
>> l liked a few of his songs
>> 
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>> 
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 
 
 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

 

  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 

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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 12:28:31 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:28:31 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
References: <E1MLeex-0006Rc-UZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><8CBC83EF7C619FF-13D4-1B48@WEBMAIL-MB16.sysops.aol.com>
	<41551.203.185.215.144.1246439863.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W2254961FA7AED88F181F24902E0@phx.gbl>


my point precisely jamie 

like calling me chris and ignoring other gatherers pointing this out 

i believe he aiso brushed off your explanation of jury duty and thanks for stating that i had carried mine out well 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:13:38 -0400
From: jpwhkj at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.

I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.

> Brendan,
>
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
>
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
>
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
>
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
>
>
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
> Hi Brendan,
>
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
>
> Jamie QC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
>
>>
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>>
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>>
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>>
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>>
>> l liked a few of his songs
>>
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>>
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>>
>>
>>
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
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http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 12:33:57 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:33:57 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl><E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz><BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl>


spot on jamie 

but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek 

i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate 

that does not mean i will resort to physical violence [ only in computer games ] 

personally i believe the pen and the tongue are mightier than the sword 

i think the term is ''reproving  '' if i remember correctly 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 11:27:32 -0400
From: jpwhkj at aol.com
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)




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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 12:40:37 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:40:37 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W9534CAAC2265038AD5F02902E0@phx.gbl>


you just won't  let it lie 

enough already 

you hardly show any hippy traits so i don't know how you got that moniker 

it wouldn't matter what i said as you want the last word and want to be seen as always right 

you did not witness the event 

i told you it was a minor offence 

i voted against as it appeared the police officer involved was fabricating evidence and he was admonished by the judge ok?

now move on for fuck sake 
 


From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:56:27 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.

I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.

> Brendan,
>
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
>
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
>
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
>
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
>
>
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
> Hi Brendan,
>
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
>
> Jamie QC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
>
>>
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>>
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>>
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>>
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>>
>> l liked a few of his songs
>>
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>>
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>>
>>
>>
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
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Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




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From npscott at blueyonder.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 12:48:23 2009
From: npscott at blueyonder.co.uk (Termite)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:48:23 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W9534CAAC2265038AD5F02902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W9534CAAC2265038AD5F02902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4DEADFB0E67943EB93A44432566E718B@NickScottPC>

I haven't even read hardly any of this, but frankly I am sick of seeing M Jackson off topics in a Killing Joke forum, I know the man is dead but I would not have expected such a fervour in here.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Stephen Lawrence 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 5:40 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


  you just won't  let it lie 
  enough already 
  you hardly show any hippy traits so i don't know how you got that moniker 
  it wouldn't matter what i said as you want the last word and want to be seen as always right 
  you did not witness the event 
  i told you it was a minor offence 
  i voted against as it appeared the police officer involved was fabricating evidence and he was admonished by the judge ok?
  now move on for fuck sake 
   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:56:27 +1000
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


  His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
  Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


  Brendan,

  He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

  >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
  >> in the case

  He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

  If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

  Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

  For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

  Jamie






  -----Original Message-----
  From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.

I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.

> Brendan,
>
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
>
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
>
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
>
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
>
>
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
>
> Hi Brendan,
>
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
>
> Jamie QC
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
>
>>
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>>
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>>
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>>
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>>
>> l liked a few of his songs
>>
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>>
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>>
>>
>>
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


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http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 13:00:12 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 03:00:12 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
Message-ID: <E1MM3AM-0005D3-Gn@pecan2.exetel.com.au>

Still think you're not getting my point...I am talking about where there's
enough evidence to convict, you'd only decide not to if enough doubt was
brought to light not to. Not that there's any doubt...

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 2:13 AM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



Sorry Brenda. Can't let that one pass.

 

The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent.
The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument
to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don't decide not
to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not
convicting is a given.

 

This is not always an ideal situation, but I can't offhand think of a
better.

 

Although jousting has its merits.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply
NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only
decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict)
is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt"
doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the
context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has
to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more
it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.

 

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as
there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more
carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the
world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly
<grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.
 
I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.
 
I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
 
I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
 
It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.
 
> Brendan,
> 
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
> 
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
> 
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
> 
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
> 
> Jamie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
> 
> 
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
> 
> 
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> ]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Brendan,
> 
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
> 
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
> 
> Jamie QC
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
> 
>> 
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>> 
>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>> 
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>> 
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>> 
>> l liked a few of his songs
>> 
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>> 
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 
 
 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

 

  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Wed Jul  1 13:01:07 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 03:01:07 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W9534CAAC2265038AD5F02902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <E1MM3BF-0005Dg-K4@pecan2.exetel.com.au>

Look fuckhead, don't reply if you don't want a reply.

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 2:41 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


you just won't  let it lie 
enough already 
you hardly show any hippy traits so i don't know how you got that moniker 
it wouldn't matter what i said as you want the last word and want to be seen
as always right 
you did not witness the event 
i told you it was a minor offence 
i voted against as it appeared the police officer involved was fabricating
evidence and he was admonished by the judge ok?
now move on for fuck sake 
 

  _____  

From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:56:27 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply
NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only
decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict)
is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt"
doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the
context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has
to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more
it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
 
  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as
there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more
carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the
world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly
<grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,

believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair

enough. I bite just like anyone else.



I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up

his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to

me.



I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right

in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.

I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.



I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't

remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that

if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is

exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based

on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally

going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with

overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.



It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being

struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be

going for however.



> Brendan,

>

> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an

> element of doubt".

>

> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based

> on

> the weight of probability".

>

> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a

> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable

> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,

> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;

> yours was not.

>

> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of

> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him

> look stupid.? True or false?

>

> Jamie

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

> there was an element of doubt?in the case

>

>

> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We

> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil

> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty

> as soon as there's an element of doubt?

>

>

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> ]

> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com

> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

>

> Hi Brendan,

>

> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?

> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".

>

> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the

> judge did explain it.

>

> Jamie QC

>

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32

> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>

>

>

> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as

> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically

> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on

> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result

> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.

> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind

> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your

> role as a juror?

>

>>

>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed

>>

>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his

>> dad

>> made him do it for the money

>>

>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt

>>

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt

>> in the case

>>

>> l liked a few of his songs

>>

>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white

>>

>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head

>>

>>

>>

>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk

>> To: gathering at misera.net

>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000

>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>>

>>

>>

>>

>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges

>>  What is your favourite song of his

>>  Is he really dead ?

>

>

>

>

>

>

>

> ________________________________________________________________________

> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the

> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.

> _______________________________________________

> Gathering mailing list

> Gathering at misera.net

> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

>





_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 

  _____  

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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Wed Jul  1 13:17:30 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17:30 -0700
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <32093ED84AFE4CFFAE0AC9F3B83C8347@edweil>

Thanks, Alex. Best thing I've read all day.

k.w.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alex Smith" <vassifer at earthlink.net>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>; "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 6:41 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


>
> Boys,....
>
> Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request --  
> can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting 
> enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more 
> revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
>
> Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or 
> not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke 
> to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic 
> offal that was Michael Jackson's product.
>
> Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. 
> Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.
>
> Just my two cents.
> Alex in NYC
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>><gathering at misera.net>
>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>>
>>>
>>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>>
>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>>
>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>>
>>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>>
>>> you ignored it
>>
>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>>
>>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>>
>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
>>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
>>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>>
>>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>>
>>So stop replying then...
>>
>>> i have better things to do
>>
>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>>
>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>>
>>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
>>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
>>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>>
>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>>
>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>>
>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>>
>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
>>our arguments.
>>
>>>
>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>>
>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
>>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>>
>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band
>>on the planet
>>
>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>>
>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
>>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
>>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
>>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>>
>>
>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>>
>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>>
>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>>
>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>>
>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>>> regarding
>>>> > jury service
>>>>
>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>>>> you
>>>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>>
>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>>>> >
>>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>>
>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>>>> was
>>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>>>> up
>>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>>>
>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>>> haven't
>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>>
>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>>> else's
>>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>>
>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>>
>>>> When are you not?
>>>>
>>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>>
>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>>> that.
>>>> >
>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>>> > Pete
>>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>>>> whatever,
>>>> > but hey..
>>>> >
>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>>>> > or get some new glasses
>>>> > testing the statement you made
>>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>>>> > mentioned
>>>> >
>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>>>> holier
>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>>>> >> are...sorry.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>>>> with
>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>>> sarcasm?
>>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>>>> you
>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>>>> he
>>>> >> is
>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>>> >> gets
>>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > get over it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>>>> >> written
>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom 
>>>> >> > onearth
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>>> around
>>>> >> me
>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>>>> in
>>>> >> order
>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>>>> life
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>>> >> > throats
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>>>> the
>>>> >> > cult of personality
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>>> >> heartbreaks
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>>>> i'm
>>>> >> not
>>>> >> > sure
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>>> kindness
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>>>> past
>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>>> minds
>>>> >> or
>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>>>> >> thoughts
>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>>> remark
>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>>> >> > think
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>>>> >> imaginary
>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>>> incidence
>>>> >> of
>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>>>> >> promises
>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>>>> >> options.
>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>>> >> > 100%
>>>> >> chance
>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>>>> >> nervous
>>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>>>> >> model..
>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>>> imply
>>>> >> some
>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>>> walked
>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>>> approval
>>>> >> > from anyone
>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>>>> >> > fashionable
>>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>>>> >> raises a
>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>>>> space
>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>>>> >> except
>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>>> omission)?
>>>> >> A
>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>>>> >> that
>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>>>> >> with
>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> being
>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>>>> >> tougher
>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>>>> a
>>>> >> shit
>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>>>> when
>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>>> Heaped
>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>>>> >> > reasons?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> you're
>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>>>> for
>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>>> retrospect
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>>> >> > particular
>>>> >> way to
>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative 
>>>> >> > on
>>>> a
>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>>>> >> before
>>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>>> they
>>>> >> have
>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>>>> in'?
>>>> >> Or
>>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>>>> date?
>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>>> >> Tried
>>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>>> disgusts
>>>> >> you?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>>>> >> SHIT.
>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>>>> it!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>>> >> alternative
>>>> >> >> set
>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>>> what
>>>> >> >> I've
>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes 
>>>> >> >> > to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>>> >> want.
>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>>> feel
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>>> >> >> fashionable
>>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>>> comments
>>>> >> >> with
>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else 
>>>> >> >> > said
>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>>> >> doing
>>>> >> >> my
>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>>> >> actually
>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>>> real
>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>>> >> death
>>>> >> >> (so
>>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>>> >> have a
>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases 
>>>> >> >> > have
>>>> >> been
>>>> >> >> > settled.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>>> about
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> or
>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>>> >> also
>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>>> bloody
>>>> >> >> circus
>>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>>> >> >> activities. I
>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>>> >> pieces
>>>> >> >> of
>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>>> >> >> multi-million
>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>>> come
>>>> >> was
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>>> >> problems"..
>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>>> >> makes
>>>> >> >> it
>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>>> >> little
>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>>> >> >> half-decent
>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>>> we
>>>> >> all
>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>>> >> offends
>>>> >> >> > someone?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>>> inane
>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>>> >> abused
>>>> >> >> word
>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>>> >> downloads
>>>> >> >> etc
>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>>> >> smells
>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Darren
>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>>> Find
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> >> > more.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> >> > more.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>>> > more.
>>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
>>Gathering at misera.net
>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 


From npscott at blueyonder.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 13:20:46 2009
From: npscott at blueyonder.co.uk (Termite)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:20:46 +0100
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <7A248B01BB3B493D9177BFCFEDC3AD39@NickScottPC>

My sentiments put more eloquently!
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alex Smith" <vassifer at earthlink.net>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>; "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 2:41 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


>
> Boys,....
>
> Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request --  
> can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting 
> enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more 
> revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
>
> Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or 
> not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke 
> to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic 
> offal that was Michael Jackson's product.
>
> Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. 
> Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.
>
> Just my two cents.
> Alex in NYC
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>><gathering at misera.net>
>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>>
>>>
>>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>>
>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>>
>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>>
>>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>>
>>> you ignored it
>>
>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>>
>>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>>
>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
>>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
>>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>>
>>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>>
>>So stop replying then...
>>
>>> i have better things to do
>>
>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>>
>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>>
>>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
>>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
>>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>>
>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>>
>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>>
>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>>
>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
>>our arguments.
>>
>>>
>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>>
>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
>>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>>
>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band
>>on the planet
>>
>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>>
>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
>>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
>>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
>>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>>
>>
>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>>
>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>>
>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>>
>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>>
>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>>> regarding
>>>> > jury service
>>>>
>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>>>> you
>>>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>>
>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>>>> >
>>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>>
>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>>>> was
>>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>>>> up
>>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>>>
>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>>> haven't
>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>>
>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>>> else's
>>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>>
>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>>
>>>> When are you not?
>>>>
>>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>>
>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>>> that.
>>>> >
>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>>> > Pete
>>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>>>> whatever,
>>>> > but hey..
>>>> >
>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>>>> > or get some new glasses
>>>> > testing the statement you made
>>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>>>> > mentioned
>>>> >
>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>>>> holier
>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>>>> >> are...sorry.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>>>> with
>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>>> sarcasm?
>>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>>>> you
>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>>>> he
>>>> >> is
>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>>> >> gets
>>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > get over it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>>>> >> written
>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom 
>>>> >> > onearth
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>>> around
>>>> >> me
>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>>>> in
>>>> >> order
>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>>>> life
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>>> >> > throats
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>>>> the
>>>> >> > cult of personality
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>>> >> heartbreaks
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>>>> i'm
>>>> >> not
>>>> >> > sure
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>>> kindness
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>>>> past
>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>>> minds
>>>> >> or
>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>>>> >> thoughts
>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>>> remark
>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>>> >> > think
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>>>> >> imaginary
>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>>> incidence
>>>> >> of
>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>>>> >> promises
>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>>>> >> options.
>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>>> >> > 100%
>>>> >> chance
>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>>>> >> nervous
>>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>>>> >> model..
>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>>> imply
>>>> >> some
>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>>> walked
>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>>> approval
>>>> >> > from anyone
>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>>>> >> > fashionable
>>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>>>> >> raises a
>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>>>> space
>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>>>> >> except
>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>>> omission)?
>>>> >> A
>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>>>> >> that
>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>>>> >> with
>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> being
>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>>>> >> tougher
>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>>>> a
>>>> >> shit
>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>>>> when
>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>>> Heaped
>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>>>> >> > reasons?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> you're
>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>>>> for
>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>>> retrospect
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>>> >> > particular
>>>> >> way to
>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative 
>>>> >> > on
>>>> a
>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>>>> >> before
>>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>>> they
>>>> >> have
>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>>>> in'?
>>>> >> Or
>>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>>>> date?
>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>>> >> Tried
>>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>>> disgusts
>>>> >> you?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>>>> >> SHIT.
>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>>>> it!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>>> >> alternative
>>>> >> >> set
>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>>> what
>>>> >> >> I've
>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes 
>>>> >> >> > to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>>> >> want.
>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>>> feel
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>>> >> >> fashionable
>>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>>> comments
>>>> >> >> with
>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else 
>>>> >> >> > said
>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>>> >> doing
>>>> >> >> my
>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>>> >> actually
>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>>> real
>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>>> >> death
>>>> >> >> (so
>>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>>> >> have a
>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases 
>>>> >> >> > have
>>>> >> been
>>>> >> >> > settled.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>>> about
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> or
>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>>> >> also
>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>>> bloody
>>>> >> >> circus
>>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>>> >> >> activities. I
>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>>> >> pieces
>>>> >> >> of
>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>>> >> >> multi-million
>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>>> come
>>>> >> was
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>>> >> problems"..
>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>>> >> makes
>>>> >> >> it
>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>>> >> little
>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>>> >> >> half-decent
>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>>> we
>>>> >> all
>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>>> >> offends
>>>> >> >> > someone?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>>> inane
>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>>> >> abused
>>>> >> >> word
>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>>> >> downloads
>>>> >> >> etc
>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>>> >> smells
>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Darren
>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>>> Find
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> >> > more.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> >> > more.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>>> > more.
>>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
>>Gathering at misera.net
>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 



From pascal at ledooz.com  Wed Jul  1 13:59:47 2009
From: pascal at ledooz.com (pascal)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 19:59:47 +0200
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <2927FD0413AA4C408629BE2961C358C1@tonton>

Hear hear, been deleting straight out any message with MJ in it (until I saw
ENOUGH), pointless stuff go to an MJ list if u want

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Alex Smith
Sent: 01 July 2009 15:41
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); A list about all
things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


Boys,....

Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can
we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough
of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more
revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?

Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or
not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to
me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal
that was Michael Jackson's product. 

Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind.
Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.

Just my two cents.
Alex in NYC





-----Original Message-----
>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
<gathering at misera.net>
>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>
>>
>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>
>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>
>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>
>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>
>> you ignored it
>
>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>
>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>
>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone
>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about
>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>
>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>
>So stop replying then...
>
>> i have better things to do
>
>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>
>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>
>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>
>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>
>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>
>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>
>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
>our arguments.
>
>>
>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>
>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't
>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>
>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band
>on the planet
>
>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>
>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I
>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes
>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I
>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>
>
>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>
>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>
>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>
>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>
>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>
>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>> regarding
>>> > jury service
>>>
>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would
>>> you
>>> know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>
>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case
>>> >
>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>
>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided
>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you
>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That
>>> was
>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make
>>> up
>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.
>>>
>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>> haven't
>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>
>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone else's
>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>
>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>
>>> When are you not?
>>>
>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>
>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>> that.
>>> >
>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete
>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english
>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or
>>> whatever,
>>> > but hey..
>>> >
>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing
>>> > or get some new glasses
>>> > testing the statement you made
>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>>> > mentioned
>>> >
>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >>
>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>> >>
>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin
>>> >> when
>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're
>>> holier
>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
>>> >> are...sorry.
>>> >>
>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>> >>
>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it
>>> with
>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>> >>
>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>> >>
>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>> sarcasm?
>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>> >>
>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>> pete
>>> >> west"
>>> >>
>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between
>>> you
>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than
>>> he
>>> >> is
>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>> >>
>>> >> >
>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>> >> >
>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > get over it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>> >> >
>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish
>>> >> written
>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>> around
>>> >> me
>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>> >> >
>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona
>>> in
>>> >> order
>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>> >> >
>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real
>>> life
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to
>>> the
>>> >> > cult of personality
>>> >> >
>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>> >> >
>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>> >> heartbreaks
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if
>>> i'm
>>> >> not
>>> >> > sure
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>> kindness
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the
>>> past
>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>> pete
>>> >> west
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>> minds
>>> >> or
>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative
>>> >> thoughts
>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>> remark
>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think
>>> >> you
>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective
>>> >> imaginary
>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>> incidence
>>> >> of
>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural
>>> >> promises
>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of
>>> >> options.
>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100%
>>> >> chance
>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your
>>> >> nervous
>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing
>>> >> model..
>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>> imply
>>> >> some
>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>> walked
>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>> approval
>>> >> > from anyone
>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech
>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
>>> >> > fashionable
>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it
>>> >> raises a
>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal
>>> space
>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [
>>> >> except
>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>> omission)?
>>> >> A
>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment
>>> >> that
>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along
>>> >> with
>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face
>>> >> when
>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when
>>> >> being
>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a
>>> >> tougher
>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give
>>> a
>>> >> shit
>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested
>>> when
>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>> Heaped
>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
>>> >> > reasons?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when
>>> >> you're
>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like
>>> for
>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>> retrospect
>>> >> and
>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular
>>> >> way to
>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on
>>> a
>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around
>>> >> before
>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>> they
>>> >> have
>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit
>>> in'?
>>> >> Or
>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a
>>> date?
>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>> >> Tried
>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>> disgusts
>>> >> you?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF
>>> >> SHIT.
>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k
>>> it!
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>> >> alternative
>>> >> >> set
>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>> what
>>> >> >> I've
>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>>> >> the
>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>> >> want.
>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>> feel
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>> >> >> fashionable
>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>> comments
>>> >> >> with
>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>> >> doing
>>> >> >> my
>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>> >> actually
>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>> real
>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>> >> death
>>> >> >> (so
>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>> >> have a
>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>>> >> been
>>> >> >> > settled.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>> about
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> or
>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>> >> also
>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>> bloody
>>> >> >> circus
>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>> >> >> activities. I
>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>> >> pieces
>>> >> >> of
>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>> >> >> multi-million
>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>> come
>>> >> was
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>> >> problems"..
>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>> >> makes
>>> >> >> it
>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>> >> little
>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>> >> >> half-decent
>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>> we
>>> >> all
>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>> >> offends
>>> >> >> > someone?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>> inane
>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>> >> abused
>>> >> >> word
>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>> >> downloads
>>> >> >> etc
>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>> >> smells
>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Darren
>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>> Find
>>> >> out
>>> >> >> > more.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>> out
>>> >> > more.
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>> >> >
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___________________
>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>> > more.
>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>> >
http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/____________________________
___________________
>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>>
http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/____________________________
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>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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Version: 8.5.375 / Virus Database: 270.13.0/2210 - Release Date: 07/01/09
05:53:00



From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 14:23:01 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:23:01 +0000
Subject: [kj] Thriller/Tabazan Mash up
Message-ID: <BLU112-W2DFF4E4E61EE7A18E92F3BE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

 

                   Does anyone have a link to it ?

 

 

 

 

 

 

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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 14:33:53 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
Message-ID: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 15:09:47 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 12:09:47 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>


Michael Jackson....

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke








 

  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 15:19:09 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>


 I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music


 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke













Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke








?

? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage.   Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.=


 





_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



 

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From bawhitehead at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 16:08:39 2009
From: bawhitehead at gmail.com (Brian Whitehead)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:08:39 +0100
Subject: [kj] O/T Pixies dates
Message-ID: <7454a99b0907011308g56a95d20xc09329c396a1e2ba@mail.gmail.com>

For the Pixies fans...

Brixton
http://www.ticketweb.co.uk/INFO/PIXIES/?query=pixie&referral_id=alert

The rest...
http://www.pixiesmusic.com/live_09.php

Brian.
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 16:19:59 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>


I would disagree.

Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music

Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics

Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 

 

 

 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 
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From humanhybrid666 at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 16:30:20 2009
From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com (bongo)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au> 
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com>

you have a goat? thats very old testament!
=)

why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's?? its
a strange one...
will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..





"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
postponed indefinitely..."




On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:

>  spot on jamie
> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . .
>
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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 16:36:28 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:36:28 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com>

Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I'd add Toto, the
Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.

 

Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.  Fie.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 

  _____  

To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add
Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....

  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!

  _____  

Windows LiveT SkyDriveT: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your
BlackBerry or iPhone.= 

_______________________________________________






Gathering mailing list






Gathering at misera.net






http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering







 

  _____  

Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 

 

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn
<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  more!

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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 16:48:42 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:48:42 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au> 
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
 

 

 


From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

you have a goat? thats very old testament!


=)


why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's?? its a strange one...
will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..







"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."







On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:


spot on jamie 
but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek 
i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . . 
_________________________________________________________________
Get the best of MSN on your mobile
http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Wed Jul  1 16:59:05 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:59:05 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl><BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <7EEE0561B11544B89FCA5824B764AD7B@edweil>

What?  No way ...


k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: countessghoulita at aol.com 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  I agree.

  Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





  -----Original Message-----
  From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Michael Jackson....


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
  Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

   
    Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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  Gathering mailing list
  Gathering at misera.net
  http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From humanhybrid666 at gmail.com  Wed Jul  1 17:06:17 2009
From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com (bongo)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:06:17 +1200
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au> 
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com> 
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>

you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to look
for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i mean moses,
comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the golden calf...
just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...


"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
postponed indefinitely..."


On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:

>
> Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the land
> adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that Brendan
> isnt sitting on the Jury
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
> From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>
>
> you have a goat? thats very old testament!
> =)
>
> why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's??
> its a strange one...
> will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..
>
>
>
>
>
> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
> postponed indefinitely..."
>
>
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>wrote:
>
> spot on jamie
> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . .
>
>
> ------------------------------
> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now<http://extras.uk.msn.com/internet-explorer-8/?ocid=T010MSN07A0716U>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 17:27:10 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:27:10 +0000
Subject: [kj] Rubicon .
Message-ID: <BLU112-W7A51E5DE9F992F2A03F61BE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

 

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtnytjWwwRQ

_________________________________________________________________

MSN straight to your mobile - news, entertainment, videos and more.

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From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 17:39:00 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 17:39:00 -0400
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <E1MM1tc-0005Rr-An@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <8CBC8AB7ADE41EC-13E0-15EB@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>

In which case, your comment about "you're not supposed to be dishing out shit" is null and void, since presumably a "completely contradictory" book would contain a justification for anything.

Another case of firing off an email without thinking about it first?


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:38
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit



Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit




"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead



You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)



Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 



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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 15:12:18 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 15:12:18 -0400
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <32093ED84AFE4CFFAE0AC9F3B83C8347@edweil>
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<32093ED84AFE4CFFAE0AC9F3B83C8347@edweil>
Message-ID: <8CBC896FC6FA298-1010-80B@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>


 Alex, you rule! 

CG




 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: Karen Weil <karen.weil at sddt.com>
To: Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 10:17 am
Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!









Thanks, Alex. Best thing I've read all day.?
?

k.w.?
?

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Alex Smith" <vassifer at earthlink.net>?

To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>; "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>?

Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 6:41 AM?

Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!?
?


>?

> Boys,....?

>?

> Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request --  
> can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting 
> enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more 
> revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth??

>?

> Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or 
> not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke 
> to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic 
> offal that was Michael Jackson's product.?

>?

> Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. 
> Let's not lower our standards by
 discussing him further.?

>?

> Just my two cents.?

> Alex in NYC?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

> -----Original Message-----?

>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>?

>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM?

>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>><gathering at misera.net>?

>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead?

>>?

>>>?

>>> do i have to spell it out to you ??

>>>?

>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS?

>>?

>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.?

>>?

>>> other gatherers pointed this out?

>>>?

>>> you ignored it?

>>?

>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.?

>>?

>>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes?

>>?

>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I?

>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone?

>>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about?

>>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...?

>>?

>>> and frankly i can't be bothered?

>>?

>>So stop replying then...?

>>?

>>> i have better things to do?

>>?

>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.?

>>?

>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it?

>>?

>>You're not supposed to=2
0be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning?

>>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running?

>>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)?

>>?

>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ??

>>?

>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most?

>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.?

>>?

>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me?

>>?

>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth?

>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in?

>>our arguments.?

>>?

>>>?

>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered?

>>?

>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't?

>>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.?

>>?

>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band?

>>on the planet?

>>?

>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)?

>>?

>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I?

>>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes?

>>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I?

>>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.?

>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big dea
l.?

>>?

>>?

>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200?

>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>>?

>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written?

>>>>?

>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.?

>>>>?

>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you?

>>>>?

>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.?

>>>>?

>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made?

>>>> regarding?

>>>> > jury service?

>>>>?

>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would?

>>>> you?

>>>> know when you're not reading my posts??

>>>>?

>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case?

>>>> >?

>>>> > i was not the only one voting against?

>>>>?

>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided?

>>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you?

>>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That?

>>>> was?

>>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make?

>>>> up?

>>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.?

>>>>?

>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i?
0A>>>> haven't?

>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''?

>>>>?

>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>>> else's?

>>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.?

>>>>?

>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life?

>>>>?

>>>> When are you not??

>>>>?

>>>> > police never lie do they ??

>>>>?

>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.?

>>>>?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000?

>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use?

>>>> that.?

>>>> >?

>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>>> > Pete?

>>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english?

>>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or?

>>>> whatever,?

>>>> > but hey..?

>>>> >?

>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net?

>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]?

>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence?

>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009209:27 AM?

>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing?

>>>> > or get some new glasses?

>>>> > testing the statement you made?

>>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!?

>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are?

>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person?

>>>> > mentioned?

>>>> >?

>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200?

>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin?

>>>> >> when?

>>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're?

>>>> holier?

>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you?

>>>> >> are...sorry.?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it?

>>>> with?

>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Yes, you do.?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >>
 "i await the usual one word response"?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of?

>>>> sarcasm??

>>>> >> That's not positive now is it??

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was?

>>>> pete?

>>>> >> west"?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between?

>>>> you?

>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than?

>>>> he?

>>>> >> is?

>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>>> >> gets?

>>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > awww poor brendan?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ??

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > get over it?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish?

>>>> >> written?

>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou
 as i KNOW that unless i?

>>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom 
>>>> >> > onearth?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death?

>>>> around?

>>>> >> me?

>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona?

>>>> in?

>>>> >> order?

>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real?

>>>> life?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>>> >> > throats?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i do not see artists 
as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to?

>>>> the?

>>>> >> > cult of personality?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of?

>>>> >> heartbreaks?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if?

>>>> i'm?

>>>> >> not?

>>>> >> > sure?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a?

>>>> kindness?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the?

>>>> past?

>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was?

>>>> pete?

>>>> >> west?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > Date: 
Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000?

>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's?

>>>> minds?

>>>> >> or?

>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative?

>>>> >> thoughts?

>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging?

>>>> remark?

>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>>> >> > think?

>>>> >> you?

>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective?

>>>> >> imaginary?

>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high?

>>>> incidence?

>>>> >> of?

>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural?

>>>> >> promises?

>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of?

>>>> >> options.?

>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>>> >> > 100%?

>>>> >> chance?

>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your?

>>>> >> nervous?

>>>> >> > system or twisted in such=2
0a way that it somehow fits the existing?

>>>> >> model..?

>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd?

>>>> imply?

>>>> >> some?

>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net?

>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]?

>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence?

>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM?

>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering?

>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me?

>>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of?

>>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and?

>>>> walked?

>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit?

>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek?

>>>> approval?

>>>> >> > from anyone?

>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech?

>>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''?

>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is?

>>>> >> > fashionable?

>>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it?

>>>> >> raises a?

>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ]
 but i don't lose sleep over it?

>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal?

>>>> space?

>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [?

>>>> >> except?

>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000?

>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by?

>>>> omission)??

>>>> >> A?

>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment?

>>>> >> that?

>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along?

>>>> >> with?

>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face?

>>>> >> when?

>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>>> >> > when?

>>>> >> being?

>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a?

>>>> >> tougher?

>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give?

>>>> a?

>>>> >> shit?

>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested?

>>>>
 when?

>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you??

>>>> Heaped?

>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right?

>>>> >> > reasons??

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>>> >> > when?

>>>> >> you're?

>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like?

>>>> for?

>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in?

>>>> retrospect?

>>>> >> and?

>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>>> >> > particular?

>>>> >> way to?

>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative 
>>>> >> > on?

>>>> a?

>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around?

>>>> >> before?

>>>> >> > picking your nose??

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because?

>>>> they?

>>>> >> have?

>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit?

>>>> in'??

>>>> >> Or?

>>>> >> > to not fit in...?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a?

>>>> date??

>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...??

>>>> >> Tried?

>>>> >> > not to look20physically disgusted at something / someone who?

>>>> disgusts?

>>>> >> you??

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF?

>>>> >> SHIT.?

>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net?

>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]?

>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin?

>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM?

>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > actually I DON'T?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k?

>>>> it!?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com?

>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000?

>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > actually I DON'T?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200?

>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >>?

>
>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.?

>>>> >> >>?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face??

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.?

>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored?

>>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.?

>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz?

>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad?

>>>> >> about?

>>>> >> >> a?

>>>> >> >> > dead person?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an?

>>>> >> alternative?

>>>> >> >> set?

>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From?

>>
>> what?

>>>> >> >> I've?

>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes 
>>>> >> >> > to?

>>>> >> the?

>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they?

>>>> >> want.?

>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't?

>>>> feel?

>>>> >> any?

>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies?

>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently?

>>>> >> >> fashionable?

>>>> >> >> > to dislike?

>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your?

>>>> comments?

>>>> >> >> with?

>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else 
>>>> >> >> > said?

>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"?

>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.?

>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...?

>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want?

>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just?

>>>> >> doing?

>>>> >> >> my?

>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the?

>>>> >> >> tabloids I?

>>>> >> >> > just make them...?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]?

>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1?

>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM?

>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read?

>>>> >> actually?

>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad?

>>>> >> about?

>>>> >> >> a?

>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in?

>>>> real?

>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental?

>>>> >> death?

>>>> >> >> (so?

>>>> >> >> > they're saying).?

>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll?

>>>> >> have a?

>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases 
>>>> >> >> > have?

>>>> >> been?

>>>> >> >> > settled.?

>>>> >> >>=2
0>?

>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all?

>>>> about?

>>>> >> any?

>>>> >> >> or?

>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...?

>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..?

>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>?

>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)?

>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>?

>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've?

>>>> >> also?

>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole?

>>>> bloody?

>>>> >> >> circus?

>>>> >> >> > is the media co
nspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational?

>>>> >> >> activities. I?

>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing?

>>>> >> pieces?

>>>> >> >> of?

>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and?

>>>> >> >> multi-million?

>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have?

>>>> come?

>>>> >> was?

>>>> >> >> a?

>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal?

>>>> >> problems"..?

>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That?

>>>> >> makes?

>>>> >> >> it?

>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a?

>>>> >> little?

>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some?

>>>> >> >> half-decent?

>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do?

>>>> we?

>>>> >> all?

>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it?

>>>> >> offends?

>>>> >> >> > someone??

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Jim.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>>20>> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this?

>>>> inane?

>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most?

>>>> >> abused?

>>>> >> >> word?

>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.?

>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----?

>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin?

>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM?

>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk?

>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,?

>>>> >> downloads?

>>>> >> >> etc?

>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings?

>>>> >> smells?

>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Jelly.?

>>>> >> 
>> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com?

>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100?

>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Darren?

>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.?

>>>> Find?

>>>> >> out?

>>>> >> >> > more.?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________?

>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list?

>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________?

>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list?

>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.ne
t/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >> >> >?

>>>> >> >>?

>>>> >> >>?

>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________?

>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list?

>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find?

>>>> out?

>>>> >> > more.?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now?

>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________?

>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile?

>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________?

>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list?

>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >> >?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >>?

>>>> >> _______________________________________________?

>>>> >> Gathering mailing list?

>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> >?

>>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out?

>>>> > more.?

>>>> > _______________________________________________________________
__?

>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.?

>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________?

>>>> > Gathering mailing list?

>>>> > Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>> >?

>>>>?

>>>>?

>>>> _______________________________________________?

>>>> Gathering mailing list?

>>>> Gathering at misera.net?

>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>?

>>> _________________________________________________________________?

>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.?

>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________?

>>> Gathering mailing list?

>>> Gathering at misera.net?

>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>>>?

>>?

>>?

>>_______________________________________________?

>>Gathering mailing list?

>>Gathering at misera.net?

>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

>?

> _______________________________________________?

> Gathering mailing list?

> Gathering at misera.net?

> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?

> ?

_______________________________________________?

Gathering mailing list?

Gathering at misera.net?

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering?



 

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From jpwhkj at aol.com  Wed Jul  1 17:43:39 2009
From: jpwhkj at aol.com (jpwhkj at aol.com)
Date: Wed, 01 Jul 2009 17:43:39 -0400
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
Message-ID: <8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>

Hey Brenda - I thought Darre was on your side?

Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

Jami




-----Original Message-----
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion




Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.

?

The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.

?

This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of a better.

?

Although jousting has its merits.

?

Darren

Hungerford, UK

?



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



?

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argume
nt, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.

?



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.? Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,

believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair

enough. I bite just like anyone else.

?

I'm guilty of20taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up

his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to

me.

?

I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right

in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.

I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.

?

I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't

remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that

if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is

exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based

on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally

going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with

overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.

?

It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being

struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be

going for however.

?

> Brendan,

>?

> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an

> element of doubt".

>?

> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based

> on

> the weight of probability".

>?

> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a

> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable

> doubt"; yours=2
0is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,

> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;

> yours was not.

>?

> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of

> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him

> look stupid.? True or false?

>?

> Jamie

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>?

>?

>?

> there was an element of doubt?in the case

>?

>?

> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We

> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil

> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty

> as soon as there's an element of doubt?

>?

>?

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]

> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com

> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

>?

>?

>?

>?

> Hi Brendan,

>?

> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?

> Civil cases res
t on "the balance of probability".

>?

> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the

> judge did explain it.

>?

> Jamie QC

>?

>?

> -----Original Message-----

> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)

> <gathering at misera.net>

> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32

> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>?

>?

>?

> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as

> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically

> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on

> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result

> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.

> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind

> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your

> role as a juror?

>?

>>?

>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed

>>?

>> didn't someone on here say that the kid who accused him said that his

>> dad

>> made him do it for the money

>>?

>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt

>>?

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt

>> in the case

>>?

>> l liked a few of his songs

>>?

>> out of my life /dirty diana20/beat it / earth song /black or white

>>?

>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head

>>?

>>?

>>?

>> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk

>> To: gathering at misera.net

>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000

>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion

>>?

>>?

>>?

>>?

>>?? Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges

>>? What is your favourite song of his

>>? Is he really dead ?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

>?

> ________________________________________________________________________

> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the

> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.

> _______________________________________________

> Gathering mailing list

> Gathering at misera.net

> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

>?

?

?

_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



?



Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 





_______________________________________________
athering mailing list
athering at misera.net
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From jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 17:59:30 2009
From: jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk (jo)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:59:30 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
	<8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <0ccf01c9fa97$3586c440$0700000a@jo>

I'd have to deliver a verdict of not guilty on the grounds that I have reasonable doubt that I managed to stay awake during the proceedings.


  Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

  Jami




  -----Original Message-----
  From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
  To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


  Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.

  The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.
  & nbsp;
  This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of a better.

  Although jousting has its merits.

  Darren
  Hungerford, UK

  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
  Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
  To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

  His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
  Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
  0ATo: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
  Brendan,

  He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

  >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
  >> in the case

  He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

  If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

  Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

  For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

  Jamie






  -----Original Message-----
  From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fairenough. I bite just like anyone else. I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made uphis mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads tome. I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're rightin the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well. I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can'tremember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point thatif you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which isexactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either basedon weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generallygoing to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case withoverwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt. It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of beingstruck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd begoing for however. > Brendan,> > Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an> element of doubt".> > You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based> on> the weight of probability".> > Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;> yours was not.> > I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him> look stupid.? True or false?> > Jamie> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: 'A list about all thin
gs Killing Joke (the band!)'> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > there was an element of doubt?in the case> > > That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty> as soon as there's an element of doubt?> > > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM> To: gathering at misera.net> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > > Hi Brendan,> > In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".>&
nbsp;> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the> judge did explain it.> > Jamie QC> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion> > > > I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your> role as a juror?> >> >> personally i think the truth has not been revealed>> >> didn't someone 
on here say that the kid who accused him said that his>> dad>> made him do it for the money>> >> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt>> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt>> in the case>> >> l liked a few of his songs>> >> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white>> >> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head>> >> >> >> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk>> To: gathering at misera.net>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion>> >> >> >> >>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges>>  What is your favourite song of his>>  Is he really dead ?> > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.> _______________________________________________> Gathering mailing list> Gathering at misera.net> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering>   _______________________________________________Gathering mailing listGathering at misera.nethttp://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


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  Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 


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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 18:06:30 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:06:30 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT - Jo Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <0ccf01c9fa97$3586c440$0700000a@jo>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
	<8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com> 
	<0ccf01c9fa97$3586c440$0700000a@jo>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W11098B0E7CA7B2AE84A7F4BE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

*Jo is held in contempt of Court , removed from the bench and taken to the cells below*

 

 


 


From: jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:59:30 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


I'd have to deliver a verdict of not guilty on the grounds that I have reasonable doubt that I managed to stay awake during the proceedings.
 

Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

Jami




-----Original Message-----
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion






Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.
 
The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.
& nbsp;
This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of a better.
 
Although jousting has its merits.
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
 
His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
 



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
0ATo: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fairenough. I bite just like anyone else. I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made uphis mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads tome. I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're rightin the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well. I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can'tremember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point thatif you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either basedon weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generallygoing to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case withoverwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt. It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of beingstruck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd begoing for however. > Brendan,> > Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an> element of doubt".> > You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based> on> the weight of probability".> > Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;> yours was not.> > I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him> look stupid.? True or false?> > Jamie> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: 'A list about all thin
gs Killing Joke (the band!)'> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > there was an element of doubt?in the case> > > That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty> as soon as there's an element of doubt?> > > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM> To: gathering at misera.net> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > > Hi Brendan,> > In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".>&
nbsp;> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the> judge did explain it.> > Jamie QC> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion> > > > I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your> role as a juror?> >> >> personally i think the truth has not been revealed>> >> didn't someone 
on here say that the kid who accused him said that his>> dad>> made him do it for the money>> >> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt>> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt>> in the case>> >> l liked a few of his songs>> >> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white>> >> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head>> >> >> >> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk>> To: gathering at misera.net>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion>> >> >> >> >>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges>>  What is your favourite song of his>>  Is he really dead ?> > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.> _______________________________________________> Gathering mailing list> Gathering at misera.net> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering>   _______________________________________________Gathering mailing listGathering at misera.nethttp://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

 



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From jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 18:15:31 2009
From: jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk (jo)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:15:31 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - Jo Conclusion
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com><8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
	<0ccf01c9fa97$3586c440$0700000a@jo>
	<BLU112-W11098B0E7CA7B2AE84A7F4BE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <0cfc01c9fa99$72776f60$0700000a@jo>

APPEAL!  
I'd under-medicated myself.



   
  *Jo is held in contempt of Court , removed from the bench and taken to the cells below*
   
   

   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 22:59:30 +0100
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


  I'd have to deliver a verdict of not guilty on the grounds that I have reasonable doubt that I managed to stay awake during the proceedings.


    Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

    Jami




    -----Original Message-----
    From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
    To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
    Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


    Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.

    The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.
    & nbsp;
    This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of a better.

    Although jousting has its merits.

    Darren
    Hungerford, UK

    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
    Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
    To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

    His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
    Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
    0ATo: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
    Brendan,

    He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

    >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
    >> in the case

    He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

    If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

    Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

    For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

    Jamie






    -----Original Message-----
    From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
    To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
    Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
    Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fairenough. I bite just like anyone else. I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made uphis mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads tome. I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're rightin the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well. I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can'tremember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point thatif you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which isexactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either basedon weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generallygoing to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case withoverwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt. It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of beingstruck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd begoing for however. > Brendan,> > Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an> element of doubt".> > You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based> on> the weight of probability".> > Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;> yours was not.> > I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him> look stupid.? True or false?> > Jamie> > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: 'A list about all thin
gs Killing Joke (the band!)'> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > there was an element of doubt?in the case> > > That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty> as soon as there's an element of doubt?> > > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM> To: gathering at misera.net> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion> > > > > Hi Brendan,> > In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".>&
nbsp;> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the> judge did explain it.> > Jamie QC> > > -----Original Message-----> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)> <gathering at misera.net>> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion> > > > I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your> role as a juror?> >> >> personally i think the truth has not been revealed>> >> didn't someone 
on here say that the kid who accused him said that his>> dad>> made him do it for the money>> >> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt>> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt>> in the case>> >> l liked a few of his songs>> >> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white>> >> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head>> >> >> >> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk>> To: gathering at misera.net>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion>> >> >> >> >>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges>>  What is your favourite song of his>>  Is he really dead ?> > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.> _______________________________________________> Gathering mailing list> Gathering at misera.net> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering>   _______________________________________________Gathering mailing listGathering at misera.nethttp://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 18:14:45 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:14:45 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <E1MLquW-0005o3-IX@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <881253.4327.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

This is the?best Jesus song ever, 
and the only one worth listening to: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWyC-EzxlAk?(non-denominational, too)


... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 8:55:02 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use that. 
?
Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or whatever, but hey.
?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
?


________________________________
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead

all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing 
or get some new glasses 
testing the statement you made 
SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
sorry ??? like fuck you are 
i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person mentioned 
?
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> 
> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
> 
> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin when
> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're holier
> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you
> are...sorry.
> 
> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
> 
> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it with
> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
> 
> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
> 
> Yes, you do.
> 
> "i await the usual one word response"
> 
> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of sarcasm?
> That's not positive now is it?
> 
> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete west"
> 
> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between you
> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than he is
> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he gets
> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
> 
> >
> > awww poor brendan
> >
> > hurt your feelings did i ?
> >
> > get over it
> >
> > you come across as an opinionated bully
> >
> > unless it fits in with your world view
> >
> > it must me torn down and stomped on
> >
> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
> >
> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish written
> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
> >
> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i
> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom onearth
> >
> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death around me
> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
> >
> > NO i am not seeking your approval
> >
> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
> >
> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona in order
> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
> >
> > some gatherers have met me
> >
> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
> >
> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
> >
> > unlike others i admit to my faults
> >
> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
> >
> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
> >
> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real life
> >
> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others throats
> >
> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to the
> > cult of personality
> >
> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
> >
> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in
> >
> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
> >
> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of heartbreaks
> >
> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
> >
> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if i'm not
> > sure
> >
> > i await the usual one word response
> >
> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
> >
> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a kindness
> >
> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the past
> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was pete west
> >
> > oh well whatever floats your boat
> >
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's minds or
> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative thoughts
> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
> >
> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging remark
> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you think you
> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective imaginary
> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high incidence of
> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural promises
> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of options.
> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
> >
> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 100% chance
> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your nervous
> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing model.
> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd imply some
> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> > i don't know why i'm bothering
> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me
> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of
> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and walked
> > i will NOT take shit
> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek approval
> > from anyone
> > i have never delivered a speech
> > i have never tried ''to fit in ''
> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is
> > fashionable
> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it raises a
> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal space
> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [ except
> > in the instance of comedy ]
> >
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by omission)? A
> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment that
> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along with
> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face when
> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy when being
> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a tougher
> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give a shit
> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested when
> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you? Heaped
> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right
> > reasons?
> >
> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do when you're
> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like for
> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in retrospect and
> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a particular way to
> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative on a
> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around before
> > picking your nose?
> >
> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because they have
> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit in'? Or
> > to not fit in...
> >
> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a date?
> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...? Tried
> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who disgusts you?
> >
> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF SHIT.
> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> > actually I DON'T
> >
> >
> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k it!
> >
> > Jelly...... melting
> >
> >
> > From: stephen.l at live.com
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> >
> > actually I DON'T
> >
> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >>
> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
> >>
> >> >
> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Keep Smiling...
> >> >
> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
> >> >
> >> > Autism also affects adults.
> >> > Most are isolated and ignored
> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives.
> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad about
> >> a
> >> > dead person
> >> >
> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an alternative
> >> set
> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From what
> >> I've
> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to the
> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they want.
> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't feel any
> >> > compunctions either way.
> >> >
> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
> >> fashionable
> >> > to dislike
> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your comments
> >> with
> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just doing
> >> my
> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
> >> tabloids I
> >> > just make them...
> >> >
> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
> >> >
> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read actually
> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad about
> >> a
> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in real
> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental death
> >> (so
> >> > they're saying).
> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll have a
> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have been
> >> > settled.
> >> >
> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
> >> >
> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all about any
> >> or
> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
> >> >
> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
> >> >
> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
> >> >
> >> > 'Save me...
> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've also
> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole bloody
> >> circus
> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
> >> activities. I
> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing pieces
> >> of
> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
> >> multi-million
> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have come was
> >> a
> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal problems".
> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That makes
> >> it
> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a little
> >> > income-tax evasion..
> >> >
> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
> >> half-decent
> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do we all
> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it offends
> >> > someone?
> >> >
> >> > Jim.
> >> >
> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this inane
> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most abused
> >> word
> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
> >> > I'm sick of it.
> >> >
> >> > Alex in NYC
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > -----Original Message-----
> >> > From: jerry bodkin
> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's, downloads
> >> etc
> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings smells
> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
> >> >
> >> > Jelly.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Oh Christ.
> >> >
> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
> >> >
> >> > Darren
> >> > Hungerford, UK
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> >> > more.
> >> >
> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > Gathering mailing list
> >> > Gathering at misera.net
> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
> > more.
> >
> >
> >
> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
> >
> >
> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

________________________________
Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 


      
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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 18:27:54 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:27:54 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Oh my god, where did you find this?
?
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music


-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Michael Jackson....

________________________________
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

________________________________
View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




________________________________
Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 


      
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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Wed Jul  1 18:51:47 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
Message-ID: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Wed Jul  1 19:04:14 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:04:14 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <81D4E2F8213B43779901CB76EAFFD48F@edweil>

Ugh, ugh, ugh. 

k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Alex Smith 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) ; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 3:51 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch


  I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."



  Alex in NYC




    -----Original Message----- 
    From: sade1 
    Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
    To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 


    Oh my god, where did you find this?

    (someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

     
    ... ... ... ... ... ... 

    [looking at the current state of things..]

    'Save me...
      save me from Tomorrow..
        I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    I agree.

    Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





    -----Original Message-----
    From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    Michael Jackson....


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
    Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

     
      Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 




------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  Gathering mailing list
  Gathering at misera.net
  http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 19:10:31 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com> 
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl>


Someone who uses all the fundamental forms of music killing joke don't use, then. Have they played Country?
I think Kerrang may disagree with you on the Kiss and Rush observation ;)
It's more about the flavour, less about the ingredients for me. :P

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke








I would disagree.

Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music

Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics

Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 

 

 

 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 
View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 19:12:25 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:12:25 -0700
Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple
In-Reply-To: <E1MLqts-0005fn-QD@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <BAY125-W29CA6AFEC8FAE0271FC72A9D310@phx.gbl>
	<E1MLqts-0005fn-QD@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W99AB8FC9B13D6993230459D2E0@phx.gbl>


Cheers for the linkage, B.
I am planning a move to Canada ;)

From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:54:22 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 Ripple










*Raises hand*
 
Check this out:
 
http://seekingalpha.com/article/145580-positioning-for-when-water-runs-out-part-ii
 
We have not yet 
reached the point of recycling all waste water like the Fremen of Arrakis in 
Frank Hebert?s brilliant novel Dune, but if we are consigned to endlessly 
squabble over that fixed 1% in a world where population is anything but fixed, 
many will die and many more will suffer.
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of folk 
devil
Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 5:06 AM
To: 
gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] (OT) Muad Dib & the 7/7 
Ripple


I know there's duneheads among us :)
 
"The Conspiracy 
Files 7/7, a BBC documentary, tracked Muad Dib down, eventually finding him in 
the small town of Kells in Ireland. He is in fact John Hill, from Sheffield. 

His alias, Muad Dib, is a fictional character in the science fiction film 
Dune, a film starring Sting and Kyle MacLachlan about inter-galactic freedom 
fighting, from which he seems to draw inspiration."
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/magazine/8124687.stm
 



Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. 
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 19:18:17 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:18:17 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>


 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU

 

  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.

Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?

 

 

 

 

 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch




I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."

 

Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 






Oh my god, where did you find this?
 
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 

_________________________________________________________________

MSN straight to your mobile - news, entertainment, videos and more.

http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/
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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 19:20:17 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:20:17 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com> 
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl>


I have never actually listened to a Kiss or Rush song, ever. 

Not even one song. 

 

 


 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



Someone who uses all the fundamental forms of music killing joke don't use, then. Have they played Country?
I think Kerrang may disagree with you on the Kiss and Rush observation ;)
It's more about the flavour, less about the ingredients for me. :P



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 


View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
_________________________________________________________________

MSN straight to your mobile - news, entertainment, videos and more.

http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/
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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 19:51:34 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:51:34 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

> ...Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?

A few: their first "D.D.", Rio, and some other one I forget, plus? some of their more current singles. 
Next (just now in fact)?I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar vintage?Visage 
to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv nation,?covenant,?etc.)



?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:18:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
?
? So he was. How did you know this, ?Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
?
?
?
?
?
________________________________
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
?
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
>From: sade1 
>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 
>
>
>Oh my god, where did you find this?
>?
>(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)
>
>?
>... ... ... ... ... ... 
>
>[looking at the current?state of things..]
>?
>'Save me...
>? save me?from Tomorrow..
>??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 
>
>
>
>
>
>
________________________________
From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
>To: gathering at misera.net
>Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>I agree.
>
>Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
>http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
>To: gathering at misera.net
>Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>Michael Jackson....
>
>________________________________
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>To: gathering at misera.net
>Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
>Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>?
>? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?
>
>________________________________
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>________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
>_______________________________________________
>
>Gathering mailing list
>
>Gathering at misera.net
>
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
________________________________
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>
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From bettedillinger at live.com  Wed Jul  1 19:58:10 2009
From: bettedillinger at live.com (Bette Dillinger)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 19:58:10 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com> 
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W52BD47840264F6702DFB8FBB2E0@phx.gbl>


But you have heard one, whether you consciously know it or not.  "Tom Sawyer"?  Come on, man.
 


From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:20:17 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I have never actually listened to a Kiss or Rush song, ever. 
Not even one song. 
 
 

 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



Someone who uses all the fundamental forms of music killing joke don't use, then. Have they played Country?
I think Kerrang may disagree with you on the Kiss and Rush observation ;)
It's more about the flavour, less about the ingredients for me. :P



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


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_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 20:12:46 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12:46 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <405961.37063.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Rush rocks; try them out. They have different?'periods' like KJ so if one isn't?
your taste there's a good chance another period may. And they have a singer 
who isn't afraid to get behind the damn keyboards and play *cough*Jaz*cough-cough*

analog kid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN0wijiUpBo
YYZ (instrumental) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeexiwWLDIM
thecameraeye: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o92nUObIWBI
la villa strangiato: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbSWzK4nKQA


?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:20:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I have never actually listened to a Kiss or Rush song, ever. 
Not even one song. 
?
?

?
________________________________
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Someone who uses all the fundamental forms of music killing joke don't use, then. Have they played Country?
I think Kerrang may disagree with you on the Kiss and Rush observation ;)
It's more about the flavour, less about the ingredients for me. :P

________________________________
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus?on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is .?
?
?
?
________________________________
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music


-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Michael Jackson....

________________________________
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

________________________________
View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




________________________________
Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 
________________________________
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________________________________
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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 20:45:30 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 00:45:30 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <405961.37063.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
	<BLU112-W21ABCE9608D425589A18A7BE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W2991235B3F0109E7A7C149D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<BLU112-W12FFFAC30395CA3503A31FBE2E0@phx.gbl> 
	<405961.37063.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W27DEFDAB7BC94BEAA28571902F0@phx.gbl>


good post saul 

i particularly like spirit of radio and bastille day 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12:46 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke






Rush rocks; try them out. They have different 'periods' like KJ so if one isn't 
your taste there's a good chance another period may. And they have a singer 
who isn't afraid to get behind the damn keyboards and play *cough*Jaz*cough-cough*
 
analog kid: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pN0wijiUpBo
YYZ (instrumental) http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DeexiwWLDIM
thecameraeye: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o92nUObIWBI
la villa strangiato: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VbSWzK4nKQA
 

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:20:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I have never actually listened to a Kiss or Rush song, ever. 
Not even one song. 
 
 

 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:10:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



Someone who uses all the fundamental forms of music killing joke don't use, then. Have they played Country?
I think Kerrang may disagree with you on the Kiss and Rush observation ;)
It's more about the flavour, less about the ingredients for me. :P



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:59 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Wed Jul  1 20:45:32 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:45:32 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
Message-ID: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 20:54:15 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:54:15 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<397221.75881.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W1499FD9712ED1A985D5AAE90310@phx.gbl>
	<552909.41363.qm@web110208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

> in L A around 10 dec wanna meet ?

No problem at all.?We can have a Los Angeles Gathering with mutual baptisms in the local springs.
Also, if?you travel?Route 66 you can do a quick detour to the Las Vegas or Laughlin resorts. I think it's?about an?1 hour from those cities. 

?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:58:58 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

that's the idea 
hope i can achieve it 
hope to be in L A around 10 dec 
wanna meet ?
shan't be offended if you don't 
?
________________________________
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:47:00 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


I live in L.A. so, probably, unless i spend the end-of-year in Las Vegas at my brother's place.
A curious note, if you take Route 66 all the way til it ends here, you end up right in West Hollywood?and about 1/4mile from the Sunset Strip. "Get your kicks....." ~~ DM


... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 1:58:33 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

hi saul 
yes i'm planning to spend 4 months stateside 
been reading up and realizing i won't even scratch the surface [ oh well at least i'll have seen a bit of the u s ] 
planning to travel route 66 from chicago to?L A with a few detours along the way 
just looking at chicago looks like?i need to spend a week there? to really see what the city has to offer 
this itinery is gonna be a real balancing act?
thanks for interest shown ,are you anywhere near my travels ?
?
________________________________
Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:06:15 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


?? Are you on tour?? Is L A for Los Angeles or Louisiana??(cuz it seems L.A. would be waaaayy out of?the way?of those other cities...) And try and schedule your cities with wardrobe and weather in mind, like, the South is furiously hot in summer and the northern areas (Chi-Philly-Springfield) get cold and/or snowy in winter.
?? L.A. on the other is pleasant all year-round, and quite possibly on fire by the time you get here. 
Cheers!



... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers

hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 

________________________________
Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 

________________________________
Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now 

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From bettedillinger at live.com  Wed Jul  1 20:55:35 2009
From: bettedillinger at live.com (Bette Dillinger)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:55:35 -0400
Subject: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W63DF9994A373F7523D95D9D2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <LDEIJONOCOIOOPJOEADEAEAADBAA.bbarathy@btinternet.com>
	<8CBC5ED505A4461-1788-3A41@Webmail-mg11.sim.aol.com> 
	<BAY125-W2407A338E86CCB15BF06BC9D330@phx.gbl> 
	<SNT104-W1660363EEF964C850D6EE6BB310@phx.gbl> 
	<BAY125-W63DF9994A373F7523D95D9D2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W25321168A85DB43A9DEB8FBB2F0@phx.gbl>


Wow, ja, ja, ja, all those memories flooding back....I remember finding "Lindy's Party" for less than a dollar and then wondering what ever happened to them....there was a song on the album called "Can You Believe It?" and I would listen to it all day.  All these guys go to Florida...
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:34:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



Trevor Tanner. He's still busy. Mad as ever. Lives in Florida. :)



From: bettedillinger at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 19:40:15 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



The Bolshoi!  I used to love that band.  Trevor Whateverhislastnameis.......
Didn't Chris Cornell do a version in concert?  I do think it is on you tube.  Brendan might know, really, I am serious.  
 


From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:13:17 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



The Bolshoi covered it, also. 



To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 05:52:42 -0400
From: jpwhkj at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

What was the German punk band that covered Billie Jean?  I remember seeing it on TOTP2 and it rocked.  (Must be about 10 years ago, maybe more.)

Jamie 



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From bettedillinger at live.com  Wed Jul  1 21:01:30 2009
From: bettedillinger at live.com (Bette Dillinger)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 21:01:30 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl>


They were a good pop band that I enjoyed for a spell.....their first album....but then I heard the band that had more talent in its little finger than all of them combined:  Japan.  Japan really had substance as well as style.  I also still am mocked for my unwavering love of Mick Karn, so I am very biased.  

 


 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:45:32 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch




Duran Duran is a great pop band. I own several of their albums. Not ashamed of it.

 

Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 7:18 PM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 



 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
 
  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
 
 
 
 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 






Oh my god, where did you find this?
 
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



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From hollytree1961 at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 21:02:00 2009
From: hollytree1961 at hotmail.com (melinda grant)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:02:00 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BLU120-W1BDF319BDAE6A5F2AEB8BB82F0@phx.gbl>


i went to one of duran durans gigs,shepton mallet back in the early 80s not ashamed to admit that,simon lebon is alue ;)

 

miindafgrant
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:45:32 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch




Duran Duran is a great pop band. I own several of their albums. Not ashamed of it.

 

Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 7:18 PM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 



 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
 
  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
 
 
 
 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 






Oh my god, where did you find this?
 
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

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http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 



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From stephen.l at live.com  Wed Jul  1 21:05:50 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:05:50 +0000
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<397221.75881.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W1499FD9712ED1A985D5AAE90310@phx.gbl>
	<552909.41363.qm@web110208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W27AE348B29E981CCF44A2F902F0@phx.gbl>


i'll take a rain check if THAT is the kinda welcome you got planned 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:54:15 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers






> in L A around 10 dec wanna meet ?
 
No problem at all. We can have a Los Angeles Gathering with mutual baptisms in the local springs.

Also, if you travel Route 66 you can do a quick detour to the Las Vegas or Laughlin resorts. I think it's about an 1 hour from those cities. 

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:58:58 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



that's the idea 
hope i can achieve it 
hope to be in L A around 10 dec 
wanna meet ?
shan't be offended if you don't 
 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:47:00 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers






I live in L.A. so, probably, unless i spend the end-of-year in Las Vegas at my brother's place.
A curious note, if you take Route 66 all the way til it ends here, you end up right in West Hollywood and about 1/4mile from the Sunset Strip. "Get your kicks....." ~~ DM
 
 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 1:58:33 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



hi saul 
yes i'm planning to spend 4 months stateside 
been reading up and realizing i won't even scratch the surface [ oh well at least i'll have seen a bit of the u s ] 
planning to travel route 66 from chicago to L A with a few detours along the way 
just looking at chicago looks like i need to spend a week there  to really see what the city has to offer 
this itinery is gonna be a real balancing act 
thanks for interest shown ,are you anywhere near my travels ?
 


Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:06:15 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers






   Are you on tour?? Is L A for Los Angeles or Louisiana? (cuz it seems L.A. would be waaaayy out of the way of those other cities...) And try and schedule your cities with wardrobe and weather in mind, like, the South is furiously hot in summer and the northern areas (Chi-Philly-Springfield) get cold and/or snowy in winter.
   L.A. on the other is pleasant all year-round, and quite possibly on fire by the time you get here. 
Cheers!

 
 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers



hi to all U S gatherers 
i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
thank you for your time 



Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 



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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 21:07:47 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:07:47 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <1B33CB53304C42A8B9D5A2F336FAB8DF@edweil>
References: <E1MK3a0-0000vb-RI@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<LDEIJONOCOIOOPJOEADEAEAADBAA.bbarathy@btinternet.com>
	<COL118-W53ED732C06257B018FDDA7CC330@phx.gbl><65C5A072-C600-4F0A-A22C-3F6DBA95C1AA@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<008b01c9f802$2d749d50$885dd7f0$@com>
	<1B33CB53304C42A8B9D5A2F336FAB8DF@edweil>
Message-ID: <216099.7317.qm@web110209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

?? On a KJ related note, shouldn't Killing Joke be putting out a Singles album at this point? Only the singles from?the 90s to the Hossannas...single?since the previous era has already been done. But still, they have enough singles for maybe even two Singles discs. I am sure it would be a success.

Maybe for Christmas/Hannukkah/Ramadan?

?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 

From: Darren A. Peace 
>To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
>Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:07 AM
>Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>
>
>Oh Christ.
>>?
>>http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>?
>>Darren
>>Hungerford, UK
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


      
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From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Wed Jul  1 21:19:19 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:19:19 +0100
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W27AE348B29E981CCF44A2F902F0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<397221.75881.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W1499FD9712ED1A985D5AAE90310@phx.gbl>
	<552909.41363.qm@web110208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl>
	<54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W27AE348B29E981CCF44A2F902F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <61041540-DAE9-4787-91E3-296317E04448@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

If you do go, I'd be particularly interested to know whether you hear  
a symphony of lonely timpani.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 02:05, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:

> i'll take a rain check if THAT is the kinda welcome you got planned
>
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:54:15 -0700
> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> > in L A around 10 dec wanna meet ?
>
> No problem at all. We can have a Los Angeles Gathering with mutual  
> baptisms in the local springs.
> Also, if you travel Route 66 you can do a quick detour to the Las  
> Vegas or Laughlin resorts. I think it's about an 1 hour from those  
> cities.
>
>
> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>
> [looking at the current state of things..]
>
> 'Save me...
>   save me from Tomorrow..
>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>
>
>
> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:58:58 PM
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> that's the idea
> hope i can achieve it
> hope to be in L A around 10 dec
> wanna meet ?
> shan't be offended if you don't
>
> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:47:00 -0700
> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> I live in L.A. so, probably, unless i spend the end-of-year in Las  
> Vegas at my brother's place.
> A curious note, if you take Route 66 all the way til it ends here,  
> you end up right in West Hollywood and about 1/4mile from the Sunset  
> Strip. "Get your kicks....." ~~ DM
>
>
> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>
> [looking at the current state of things..]
>
> 'Save me...
>   save me from Tomorrow..
>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>
>
>
> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 1:58:33 AM
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> hi saul
> yes i'm planning to spend 4 months stateside
> been reading up and realizing i won't even scratch the surface [ oh  
> well at least i'll have seen a bit of the u s ]
> planning to travel route 66 from chicago to L A with a few detours  
> along the way
> just looking at chicago looks like i need to spend a week there  to  
> really see what the city has to offer
> this itinery is gonna be a real balancing act
> thanks for interest shown ,are you anywhere near my travels ?
>
> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:06:15 -0700
> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
>    Are you on tour?? Is L A for Los Angeles or Louisiana? (cuz it  
> seems L.A. would be waaaayy out of the way of those other cities...)  
> And try and schedule your cities with wardrobe and weather in mind,  
> like, the South is furiously hot in summer and the northern areas  
> (Chi-Philly-Springfield) get cold and/or snowy in winter.
>    L.A. on the other is pleasant all year-round, and quite possibly  
> on fire by the time you get here.
> Cheers!
>
>
> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>
> [looking at the current state of things..]
>
> 'Save me...
>   save me from Tomorrow..
>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>
>
>
> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
> Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> hi to all U S gatherers
> i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from  
> septmber till december
> any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO / 
> PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
> ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
> depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished
> thank you for your time
>
> Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find  
> out more.
>
>
> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 21:23:50 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:23:50 +0100
Subject: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W25321168A85DB43A9DEB8FBB2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <LDEIJONOCOIOOPJOEADEAEAADBAA.bbarathy@btinternet.com>	<8CBC5ED505A4461-1788-3A41@Webmail-mg11.sim.aol.com>
	<BAY125-W2407A338E86CCB15BF06BC9D330@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W1660363EEF964C850D6EE6BB310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W63DF9994A373F7523D95D9D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W25321168A85DB43A9DEB8FBB2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <014f01c9fab3$c213b050$463b10f0$@com>

Oh God. It'll be Kingmaker next.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Bette Dillinger
Sent: 02 July 2009 1:56 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

 

Wow, ja, ja, ja, all those memories flooding back....I remember finding
"Lindy's Party" for less than a dollar and then wondering what ever happened
to them....there was a song on the album called "Can You Believe It?" and I
would listen to it all day.  All these guys go to Florida...
 

  _____  

From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:34:31 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

Trevor Tanner. He's still busy. Mad as ever. Lives in Florida. :)

  _____  

From: bettedillinger at live.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 19:40:15 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

The Bolshoi!  I used to love that band.  Trevor Whateverhislastnameis.......
Didn't Chris Cornell do a version in concert?  I do think it is on you tube.
Brendan might know, really, I am serious.  
 

  _____  

From: folk.devil at hotmail.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:13:17 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

The Bolshoi covered it, also. 

  _____  

To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 05:52:42 -0400
From: jpwhkj at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead

What was the German punk band that covered Billie Jean?  I remember seeing
it on TOTP2 and it rocked.  (Must be about 10 years ago, maybe more.)

Jamie 

 

  _____  

Click here <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01>  to get the very
best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 

 

  _____  

Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the
<http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290>  PC that's
right for you.

  _____  

HotmailR has ever-growing storage! Don't worry about storage limits. Check
<http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutori
al_Storage_062009>  it out.

  _____  

Windows LiveT SkyDriveT: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get
<http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009>
it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.

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<http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009> 

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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 21:32:36 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:32:36 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com>

I still listen to the first DD album from time to time. Nothing wrong with
the next few either. "The Chauffeur" is a classic track.

 

But I must also acknowledge an abiding love for Japan. I first saw them
supporting Kiss (calm down Alex - freebie tickets from the record shop I
worked at) when they thought they were Hanoi Rocks (yes, I know, but you see
what I mean), and thought they were fantastic. Then Sylvian re-taught
himself to sing (and I'm sure he never heard a single Roxy Music album,
ever), and they turned into something even more marvellous. Favourite track?
Punter mix of "European Son". But "...Rhodesia", "Suburban Berlin", "Sons Of
Pioneers", the Nye "Taking Islands In Africa"...

 

Even better, it was Barbieri's involvement that caused me to investigate the
sublime Porcupine Tree, a band who have given me more regular pleasure in
the last few years than any other. Not like that.

 

Karn's beetle dace still freaks me out, though.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Bette Dillinger
Sent: 02 July 2009 2:02 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

 

They were a good pop band that I enjoyed for a spell.....their first
album....but then I heard the band that had more talent in its little finger
than all of them combined:  Japan.  Japan really had substance as well as
style.  I also still am mocked for my unwavering love of Mick Karn, so I am
very biased.  
 

 

  _____  

Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:45:32 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

Duran Duran is a great pop band. I own several of their albums. Not ashamed
of it.
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 7:18 PM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 

 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
 
  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
 
 
 
 
 

  _____  

Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also
wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 

Oh my god, where did you find this?

 

(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)


 

... ... ... ... ... ... 


[looking at the current state of things..]

 

'Save me...

  save me from Tomorrow..

    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   

 

 

 

  _____  

From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add
Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....

  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!
<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/> 

  _____  

Windows LiveT SkyDriveT: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get
<http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009>
it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 

_______________________________________________






Gathering mailing list






Gathering at misera.net






http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering







 

  _____  

Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com
<http://www.truveo.com/?ncid=emlweustruv00000001> . 

 

 

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!
<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  

 

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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 21:34:09 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:34:09 -0700
Subject: [kj] Michael Bolshoi
In-Reply-To: <014f01c9fab3$c213b050$463b10f0$@com>
References: <LDEIJONOCOIOOPJOEADEAEAADBAA.bbarathy@btinternet.com>
	<8CBC5ED505A4461-1788-3A41@Webmail-mg11.sim.aol.com>
	<BAY125-W2407A338E86CCB15BF06BC9D330@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W1660363EEF964C850D6EE6BB310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W63DF9994A373F7523D95D9D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<SNT104-W25321168A85DB43A9DEB8FBB2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<014f01c9fab3$c213b050$463b10f0$@com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W24BB409DC70A927B3E6EF99D2F0@phx.gbl>


As long as it isn't King :/
I actually enjoyed the Bolshoi. Especially 'Giants' and 'Friends'. Tanner's new stuff is a bit folky.
Ah need to find me spoons.

From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:23:50 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



















Oh God. It?ll be Kingmaker next.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 





From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Bette Dillinger

Sent: 02 July 2009 1:56 AM

To: gathering at misera.net

Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead





 

Wow, ja,
ja, ja, all those memories flooding back....I remember finding "Lindy's
Party" for less than a dollar and then wondering what ever happened to
them....there was a song on the album called "Can You
Believe It?" and I would listen to it all day.  All these
guys go to Florida...

 







From: folk.devil at hotmail.com

To: gathering at misera.net

Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 17:34:31 -0700

Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



Trevor Tanner. He's still busy. Mad as ever. Lives in Florida. :)







From:
bettedillinger at live.com

To: gathering at misera.net

Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 19:40:15 -0400

Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



The Bolshoi!  I used to love that band.  Trevor
Whateverhislastnameis.......

Didn't Chris Cornell do a version in concert?  I do think it is on you
tube.  Brendan might know, really, I am serious.  

 







From: folk.devil at hotmail.com

To: gathering at misera.net

Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 13:13:17 -0700

Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



The Bolshoi covered it, also. 







To:
gathering at misera.net

Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 05:52:42 -0400

From: jpwhkj at aol.com

Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead



What was the German punk band that covered Billie Jean?  I remember seeing
it on TOTP2 and it rocked.  (Must be about 10 years ago, maybe more.)



Jamie 



 







Click here
to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates
and email.




 







Lauren
found her dream laptop. Find the
PC that?s right for you.







Hotmail?
has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. Check
it out.







Windows
Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get
it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.







Windows
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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 21:37:48 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:37:48 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
References: <8CBC875A4EF87C4-13DC-1FE3@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><E1MM2Af-0007TH-NT@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>	<001d01c9fa66$c7a09d50$56e1d7f0$@com>
	<8CBC8AC20F5485C-13E0-1629@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <015901c9fab5$b510c710$1f325530$@com>

Heh!

 

Haven?t kept up enough to take sides, and that?s not really my style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.

 

Darre

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: 01 July 2009 10:44 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

Hey Brenda - I thought Darre was on your side?

Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

Jami




-----Original Message-----
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.

 

The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.

& nbsp;

This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of a better.

 

Although jousting has its merits.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net [ <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.

 

  _____  

From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net [ <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of  <mailto:jpwhkj at aol.com> jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
0ATo:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly <grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) < <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.
 
I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.
 
I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
 
I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
 
It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.
 
> Brendan,
> 
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
> 
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
> 
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
> 
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
> 
> Jamie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all thin
gs Killing Joke (the band!)'
> < <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
> 
> 
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
> 
> 
> From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net [ <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of  <mailto:jpwhkj at aol.com> jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Brendan,
> 
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>&
nbsp;
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
> 
> Jamie QC
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> < <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
> 
>> 
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>> 
>> didn't someone 
on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>> 
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>> 
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>> 
>> l liked a few of his songs
>> 
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>> 
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From:  <mailto:fluke1 at live.co.uk> fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________
> AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on the
> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
>  <mailto:Gathering at misera.net> Gathering at misera.net
>  <http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 
 
 
_______________________________________________
 
Gathering mailing list
 <mailto:Gathering at misera.net> Gathering at misera.net
 <http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 





  _____  



 
 
 
 
 <http://www.aol.co.uk/?ncid=acquktaglinehp01> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
 
 
 
 
 
 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
 <mailto:Gathering at misera.net> Gathering at misera.net
 <http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
 



 





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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 21:43:01 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:43:01 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>
	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <015e01c9fab6$6fa361a0$4eea24e0$@com>

That is the most horrible link I?ve yet seen posted to the list.

 

Well done.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of countessghoulita at aol.com
Sent: 01 July 2009 8:19 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....

  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  more!

  _____  

Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone. <http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009> = 

_______________________________________________






Gathering mailing list






Gathering at misera.net






http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering







 

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Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW <http://www.truveo.com/?ncid=emlweustruv00000001>  Truveo.com. 

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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 21:46:37 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:46:37 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W28F24A2188CDBC66E6AA2D9D2F0@phx.gbl>


Japan were a great band. Adolescent Sex and Tin Drum :)
As for DD, I bought Planet Earth, took it home, and wondered 'WTF?'
I prefer DDD:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77WbnLHHZBE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related




From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 02:32:36 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



















I still listen to the first DD album from time to time. Nothing
wrong with the next few either. ?The Chauffeur? is a classic track.

 

But I must also acknowledge an abiding love for Japan. I first
saw them supporting Kiss (calm down Alex ? freebie tickets from the
record shop I worked at) when they thought they were Hanoi Rocks (yes, I know,
but you see what I mean), and thought they were fantastic. Then Sylvian
re-taught himself to sing (and I?m sure he never heard a single Roxy
Music album, ever), and they turned into something even more marvellous.
Favourite track? Punter mix of ?European Son?. But ?...Rhodesia?,
?Suburban Berlin?, ?Sons Of Pioneers?, the Nye ?Taking
Islands In Africa?...

 

Even better, it was Barbieri?s involvement that caused me
to investigate the sublime Porcupine Tree, a band who have given me more
regular pleasure in the last few years than any other. Not like that.

 

Karn?s beetle dace still freaks me out, though.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live?: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
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From sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com  Wed Jul  1 22:18:09 2009
From: sandstorm_mg at yahoo.com (Michael Garcia)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 19:18:09 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography
In-Reply-To: <432AB07E185340AEBE15C7EE868E3C31@NickScottPC>
References: <EXCHL0201KU0Oc94wFP0050fd86@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com><20090630070635.3C0C610531@mailwash5.pair.com><EXCHL02010eg3eruQsL0051a048@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090630105026.0BE0310556@mailwash5.pair.com>
	<BAY132-W71791A66EB81A9614D26090310@phx.gbl>
	<432AB07E185340AEBE15C7EE868E3C31@NickScottPC>
Message-ID: <906790.70513.qm@web33004.mail.mud.yahoo.com>



Great show in San Francisco there. I was at the second night. Got to chat and have some drinks with the boys for about an hour after the show.


________________________________
From: Termite <npscott at blueyonder.co.uk>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 1:58:51 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT:The Chameleons Videos Discography

 
Hey Guys
 
I feel the need to post and correct a couple of issues 
here, after having seen The Chameleons on a number of occassions during their 
reformation and being fairly knowledgeable with their output I can assure that 
they NEVER played at The Gallery or The Hacienda in 2001.
 
Firstly, The Hacienda lost its entertainments license in 
June 1997, the last gig their being by Spirtualized, The Hacienda was 
demolished in September 2000.
 
Secondly the gigs from The Gallery (18th December 
1982) and Hacienda (date not listed on their gigography...strangely) DVD is 
actually poor quality, but documents well their early performances.
 
http://www.discogs.com/Chameleons-Live-At-The-Gallery-Club-The-Hacienda-Manchester/release/1492782
 
Other DVD releases from The Chameleons are as 
follows
 
Live At The Camden Palace/Arsenal DVD   Camden 
(13th October 1984)  Arsenal (Shot for Spanish TV documentary)
 
Live From London DVD - Camden (13th October 
1984)  -  This is not obviously as good value as the above DVD as it 
only has the Camden gig on it, doesn't also include the Arsenal Spanish 
documentary.
 
Ascension DVD 2002 - Filmed at The Great 
American Music Hall in San Francisco over 2 nights (16, 18th October 2002), 2 
DVD set.
 
Resurrection - VHS Only release, filmed at Manchester 
Academy 3rd June 2000, their first major large audience reformation gig 
after they reformed and performed 5 nights at The Witchwood in Ashton Under 
Lyme.....I am captured several times personally on celluloid.
 
 
 
From: Stephen Lawrence 
To: gathering at misera.net 
>Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:18 
>  AM
>Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited 
>  edition print.....
>
>hi mike 
>it's a coupla  manchester gigs in 2001 at th e 
>  gallery and the hacienda 
>hope this helps 
>more details if requested 
> 
>haven't got round to viewing yet 
>caught my eye and thought for 5 
>  pounds this is sale of the century material  
>________________________________
 >  Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 11:50:13 +0100
>From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
>To: gathering at misera.net
>Subject: Re: 
>  [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
>
> > 
>'fraid not, plenty of cds (studio, live & 
>  sessions) but nada visually.
>what show is featured?
> 
> 
>
>
________________________________
 From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
>  [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Stephen 
>  Lawrence
>Sent: 30 June 2009 11:05
>To: >  gathering at misera.net
>Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited 
>  edition print.....
>
>well said michael 
>have you got the reunion live dvd ?
>picked 
>  it up the other week 
> 
>________________________________
 >  Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 08:06:28 +0100
>From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
>To: 
>  gathering at misera.net
>Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition 
>  print.....
>
> > 
>and anybody judging this 'book' by its 
>  cover missed quite a treat. don't think anybody's matched the dual 
>  melodies of Smithies and Fieldings guitars since. 
> 
> 
>
>
________________________________
 From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
>  [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of ade
>Sent: >  29 June 2009 19:06
>To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the 
>  band!)
>Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition 
>  print.....
>
>
>I don't think they're particularly helpful to the 
>  cause...
>-----Original Message-----
>>From: >>    gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On 
>>    Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>Sent: 29 June 2009 
>>    19:01
>>To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the 
>>    band!)'
>>Subject: Re: [kj] OT:Reg Smithies limited edition 
>>    print.....
>>
>>
>>You 
>>    know, I think the reason I ignored the Chameleons for far too long was 
>>    because of the cutprice Fish-era Marillion sleeves.
>> 
>>Darren
>>Hungerford, 
>>    UK
>> 
>>From:>>    gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On 
>>    Behalf Of phatseanio
>>Sent: 29 June 2009 1:19 PM
>>To: >>    A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>Subject: [kj] 
>>    OT:Reg Smithies limited edition print.....
>> 
>>howdy......
>>guitarist of the chameleons artwork 
>>    print for sale....
>>
>>http://www.regoid.com/
>>
>>sean.
> 
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
>
>==============================================================================
>
>
>________________________________
 >  Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 
> 
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
>
>==============================================================================
>
>
>
>
________________________________
 >  View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn 
>  more! 
________________________________
 > _______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing 
>  list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


      
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From elipsis44 at hotmail.com  Wed Jul  1 23:28:01 2009
From: elipsis44 at hotmail.com (J Casavola)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:28:01 -0700
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BLU112-W19731E74C974FC74E2F293BE310@phx.gbl>
	<EXCHL0201dhsKMZy51M0051f81a@EXCHL0201.rtdom.com>
	<20090701072913.EF02210540@mailwash5.pair.com> 
	<24959.203.185.215.144.1246436395.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BLU112-W236CA5885B46F2F690F5EFBE2E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <COL106-W57F15C4F234D39512D9CA6B62F0@phx.gbl>


I honestly don't care for the "pop stuff" nor agreed with some of the stuff he's done... Probably right, he did get a shit deal. Especially from all the paparazi all these years and media. He had a lot of bad shit done to him too...

 

Of course, it does go both ways. Honestly, I did have a poor opinion of MJ for a long time, but caught some news stuff, covering all the suff he's done, and how he inspired a lot of people, just a few days ago. 

 

Having been through a lot of shit myself, I'm going to let some ill opions go. freakin sakes the guy has passed on. Whether we agree or disagree, the fact is, he has led a legacy in pop culture. He probably did some bad stuff too. Not once, but he was accused multiple times. So, maybe that is why my opinion lessened, because of all the media coverage and biased arguments. 

 

Hell, I was biased. 

 

Am I a fan of "General American Pop Music Culture"?, not really. Maybe even narrow, but in the last few days, I for one, will let some stuff go.  
 


From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 08:37:25 +0000
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion



"Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart."
 
  
   So, you would have preferred Michael Jackson if he had been Leonard Cohen ?
 
 
 
 
 
 
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:19:55 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> Walk into the nearest toilet, wind off two links of bog roll and write in
> biro:
> 
> Amateur Psychology Degree
> Conditional Pass
> Not to practise on humans or charge money
> 
> ;)
> 
> My honest feelings about MJ? Well despite my initial nasty comments, on
> reflection, to some extent I feel sorry for anyone under such pressure
> that they buckled like he did (surgery, overspending, reclusive / abberant
> behaviour, fascination with kids / childhood and whatever else
> happened...). Certainly sounds like he had a shit deal in a lot of ways.
> Would have preferred if he'd taken that pain and used it for something
> other than shit pop...like honest music from the heart. As opposed to
> hypocritical shitpop ("Black or White"...from a guy who blecahed his skin
> and otherwise changed his appearance to appear white...and all the Heal
> the World stuff while he concentrates on his personal financial
> empire...how seriously stinking rich do you have to be to outbid Paul
> McCartney for ANYTHING?)
> 
> Prognosis on Michael Jackson:
> 
> NOTHING TO SAY
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RdTJ5RFSncU
> 
> /waffle
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> > But you do care, otherwise you wouldn't have answered ;-)
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of Brendan
> > Sent: 30 June 2009 13:26
> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >
> > Don't care, don't care, don't care.
> >
> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >>
> >> What is your favourite song of his
> >>
> >> Is he really dead ?
> >>
> >> _________________________________________________________________
> >> With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
> >> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/______________________
> >> _________________________
> >> Gathering mailing list
> >> Gathering at misera.net
> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> > -----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The
> > Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of
> > which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
> >
> > ==============================================================================
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 00:33:00 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:33:00 +1000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com>
Message-ID: <E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>

Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I'd add Toto, the
Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.

 

Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.  Fie.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 

  _____  

To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add
Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....

  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

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View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!

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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 00:36:22 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:36:22 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <8CBC8AB7ADE41EC-13E0-15EB@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <E1MME24-0003O6-6A@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>

Jamie, what, exactly, is your problem? Alex sent off an email saying let it
rest etc (after I apologised to Stephen for getting his name wrong), so tell
me...do you really want to keep this up?
 
I was raised a catholic, okay, I know the message about forgiveness. If you
want to poke holes in everything I say and take part in someone else's
argument...well cool, let's do it. Let's go into your argument with the
other Jamie while we're at it shall we, seeing as it's open slather.

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 7:39 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


In which case, your comment about "you're not supposed to be dishing out
shit" is null and void, since presumably a "completely contradictory" book
would contain a justification for anything.

Another case of firing off an email without thinking about it first?


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:38
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> ] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most
translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning

the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running

off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)



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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 00:39:43 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:39:43 +1000
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <015901c9fab5$b510c710$1f325530$@com>
Message-ID: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>

Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond reasonable
doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I actually am (gasp),
but I don't see it that way. 

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion



Heh!

 

Haven't kept up enough to take sides, and that's not really my style anyway.
I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one thing Brenda said.
Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.

 

Darre

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: 01 July 2009 10:44 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

Hey Brenda - I thought Darre was on your side?

Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.

Jami




-----Original Message-----
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Sorry Brenda. Can't let that one pass.

 

The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is innocent.
The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the prosecution argument
to the extent that reasonable doubt is introduced. So you don't decide not
to convict, you decide to convict. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not
convicting is a given.

& nbsp;

This is not always an ideal situation, but I can't offhand think of a
better.

 

Although jousting has its merits.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net [
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

 

His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's simply
NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt present. You only
decide not to convict (against evidence strong enough to otherwise convict)
is if there is enough evidence to the contrary. "An element of doubt"
doesn't cut it for me, without qualification it never would, I don't buy the
context argument, that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has
to be as precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on, the more
it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.

 

  _____  

From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net [
<mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?> mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of  <mailto:jpwhkj at aol.com> jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
0ATo:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

Brendan,

He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread - that 

>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case

He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as soon as
there was an element of doubt".

If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read more
carefully.

Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries in the
world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.

For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended lightheartedly
<grin>

Jamie






-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <
<mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the piss,
believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being argumentative...fair
enough. I bite just like anyone else.
 
I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he made up
his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it reads to
me.
 
I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're right
in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the british.
I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
 
I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I can't
remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the point that
if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt (which is
exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either based
on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's generally
going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
 
It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of being
struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what I'd be
going for however.
 
> Brendan,
> 
> Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there was an
> element of doubt".
> 
> You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a judgement based
> on
> the weight of probability".
> 
> Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond reasonable
> doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of probability".? So,
> in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a juror;
> yours was not.
> 
> I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the middle of
> a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make him
> look stupid.? True or false?
> 
> Jamie
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all thin
gs Killing Joke (the band!)'
> < <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> there was an element of doubt?in the case
> 
> 
> That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of stuff. We
> have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal / civil
> cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not guilty
> as soon as there's an element of doubt?
> 
> 
> From:  <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net> gathering-bounces at misera.net
[ <mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net?>
mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of  <mailto:jpwhkj at aol.com> jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> To:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Hi Brendan,
> 
> In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable doubt".?
> Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>&
nbsp;
> So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and (b) the
> judge did explain it.
> 
> Jamie QC
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan < <mailto:bq at soundgardener.co.nz> bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> < <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> 
> 
> 
> I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe your job as
> a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about practically
> anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement based on
> the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence can result
> in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough etc.
> You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your mind
> that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge explain your
> role as a juror?
> 
>> 
>> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>> 
>> didn't someone 
on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> dad
>> made him do it for the money
>> 
>> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>> 
>> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element of doubt
>> in the case
>> 
>> l liked a few of his songs
>> 
>> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>> 
>> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From:  <mailto:fluke1 at live.co.uk> fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> To:  <mailto:gathering at misera.net> gathering at misera.net
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>>  What is your favourite song of his
>>  Is he really dead ?
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> ________________________________________________________________________
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> move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage today.
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> 
 
 
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From gregslawson at msn.com  Thu Jul  2 01:08:29 2009
From: gregslawson at msn.com (GREG SLAWSON)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:08:29 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com>
	<E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>


But there's so much other "music" that fits into the bankrupt category--ALL recent mainstream country, most 80s "new wave" top 40/New Romantic crap, 90s "alternative", ALL 70s arena rock, etc. etc. The yatch rock bands mentioned below only scratch the surface...

P.S. Pet peeve--so much "music" today is entirely electronically produced--even ethnic stuff like Afro Pop, reggae and Punjabi banghra music no longer uses musicians playing instruments, it's just programmed. MJ was probably one of the first to start this horrible trend--just listen to the awful electronic bass line that opens "Thriller". Don't get me wrong--synthesizers can be a real instrument, when used to sound like synths--a la Kraftwork, Devo, Cab Voltaire, etc. But when musicians are replaced by electronics just to save $ or for convenience, it not only is wrong but fucks up the whole feeling of music. One minor positive development--some rap groups have begun to use live backup bands instead of just samples and programming. But as a whole actual musicians are being replaced more and more by machines (starting to sound like an Isaac Asimov story)...
 


From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:33:00 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke






Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, the Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.
 
Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.  Fie.
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
 
I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 



To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 
-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



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Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 
 



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From stephen.l at live.com  Thu Jul  2 04:10:51 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:10:51 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <E1MME24-0003O6-6A@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <8CBC8AB7ADE41EC-13E0-15EB@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MME24-0003O6-6A@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W7393210DFFCA4B4808C74902F0@phx.gbl>


like fuck did you apologise 

and actually you should  be apologising to chris for bringing his name into the argument 

you know what really riles me is your arrogant attitude 

you pick holes in other peoples conversation but can't stand it when YOU are brought to task 
i requested you let it go and you STILL keep on 

YOU are the one with the problem 

the world doesn't revolve around YOU 

you don't bother to read mails properly by your own admission and there was no apology for that either 

just straight on the attack 

and for fuck sake dragging up stuff from months ago is hardly christian is it hypocrite 

know the message about forgiveness like hell you do  


From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:36:22 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


Jamie, what, exactly, is your problem? Alex sent off an email saying let it rest etc (after I apologised to Stephen for getting his name wrong), so tell me...do you really want to keep this up?
 
I was raised a catholic, okay, I know the message about forgiveness. If you want to poke holes in everything I say and take part in someone else's argument...well cool, let's do it. Let's go into your argument with the other Jamie while we're at it shall we, seeing as it's open slather.



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 7:39 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


In which case, your comment about "you're not supposed to be dishing out shit" is null and void, since presumably a "completely contradictory" book would contain a justification for anything.

Another case of firing off an email without thinking about it first?


-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:38
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit



Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.



From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


"I come not to bring peace but a sword."

The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most translations don't use that precise phrase).

Jamie



-----Original Message-----
From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead


You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)




Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip, lifestyles updates and email. 
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From bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net  Thu Jul  2 04:03:14 2009
From: bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net (B. Oliver Sheppard)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 03:03:14 -0500
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W28F24A2188CDBC66E6AA2D9D2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>	<SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl>
	<015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com>
	<BAY125-W28F24A2188CDBC66E6AA2D9D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <4A4C69C2.4010702@sbcglobal.net>

Anyone remember this Nestle 80s New Romantic style commercial for their 
white chocoalte candy bar?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V92wHNa1UvE





folk devil wrote:
> Japan were a great band. Adolescent Sex and Tin Drum :)
> As for DD, I bought Planet Earth, took it home, and wondered 'WTF?'
> I prefer DDD:
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77WbnLHHZBE
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related 
> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related>
>


From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 04:19:16 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 20:19:16 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <BAY132-W7393210DFFCA4B4808C74902F0@phx.gbl>
References: <8CBC8AB7ADE41EC-13E0-15EB@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MME24-0003O6-6A@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W7393210DFFCA4B4808C74902F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <41939.203.185.215.144.1246522756.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Email me offlist if you want to keep on blathering.

>
> like fuck did you apologise
>
> and actually you should  be apologising to chris for bringing his name
> into the argument
>
> you know what really riles me is your arrogant attitude
>
> you pick holes in other peoples conversation but can't stand it when YOU
> are brought to task
> i requested you let it go and you STILL keep on
>
> YOU are the one with the problem
>
> the world doesn't revolve around YOU
>
> you don't bother to read mails properly by your own admission and there
> was no apology for that either
>
> just straight on the attack
>
> and for fuck sake dragging up stuff from months ago is hardly christian is
> it hypocrite
>
> know the message about forgiveness like hell you do
>
>
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:36:22 +1000
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>
>
> Jamie, what, exactly, is your problem? Alex sent off an email saying let
> it rest etc (after I apologised to Stephen for getting his name wrong), so
> tell me...do you really want to keep this up?
>
> I was raised a catholic, okay, I know the message about forgiveness. If
> you want to poke holes in everything I say and take part in someone else's
> argument...well cool, let's do it. Let's go into your argument with the
> other Jamie while we're at it shall we, seeing as it's open slather.
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 7:39 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>
>
> In which case, your comment about "you're not supposed to be dishing out
> shit" is null and void, since presumably a "completely contradictory" book
> would contain a justification for anything.
>
> Another case of firing off an email without thinking about it first?
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:38
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>
>
>
> Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>
>
> "I come not to bring peace but a sword."
>
> The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most
> translations don't use that precise phrase).
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> <gathering at misera.net>
> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>
>
> You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
> the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
> off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>
>
>
>
> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip,
> lifestyles updates and email.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip,
> lifestyles updates and email.
> _________________________________________________________________
> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From stephen.l at live.com  Thu Jul  2 04:48:55 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:48:55 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <4A4C69C2.4010702@sbcglobal.net>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl>
	<015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com>
	<BAY125-W28F24A2188CDBC66E6AA2D9D2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<4A4C69C2.4010702@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W1156507E2316F99C0A3BDD902F0@phx.gbl>


nah 

must have been for the U S market only 

all we get is the milky bar kid 

U S wild west themed 
 
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 03:03:14 -0500
> From: bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
> 
> Anyone remember this Nestle 80s New Romantic style commercial for their 
> white chocoalte candy bar?
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V92wHNa1UvE
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> folk devil wrote:
> > Japan were a great band. Adolescent Sex and Tin Drum :)
> > As for DD, I bought Planet Earth, took it home, and wondered 'WTF?'
> > I prefer DDD:
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77WbnLHHZBE
> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related 
> > <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related>
> >
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

_________________________________________________________________
Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
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From stephen.l at live.com  Thu Jul  2 04:51:41 2009
From: stephen.l at live.com (Stephen Lawrence)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:51:41 +0000
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <41939.203.185.215.144.1246522756.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <8CBC8AB7ADE41EC-13E0-15EB@WEBMAIL-MY33.sysops.aol.com>
	<E1MME24-0003O6-6A@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<BAY132-W7393210DFFCA4B4808C74902F0@phx.gbl> 
	<41939.203.185.215.144.1246522756.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <BAY132-W8E5B291D0E5E476A1E3B0902F0@phx.gbl>


like all bullies 

a coward 

mustn't have it out in the open must we 

where others can point out who is in the wrong 
 
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 20:19:16 +1200
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
> 
> Email me offlist if you want to keep on blathering.
> 
> >
> > like fuck did you apologise
> >
> > and actually you should be apologising to chris for bringing his name
> > into the argument
> >
> > you know what really riles me is your arrogant attitude
> >
> > you pick holes in other peoples conversation but can't stand it when YOU
> > are brought to task
> > i requested you let it go and you STILL keep on
> >
> > YOU are the one with the problem
> >
> > the world doesn't revolve around YOU
> >
> > you don't bother to read mails properly by your own admission and there
> > was no apology for that either
> >
> > just straight on the attack
> >
> > and for fuck sake dragging up stuff from months ago is hardly christian is
> > it hypocrite
> >
> > know the message about forgiveness like hell you do
> >
> >
> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:36:22 +1000
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
> >
> >
> > Jamie, what, exactly, is your problem? Alex sent off an email saying let
> > it rest etc (after I apologised to Stephen for getting his name wrong), so
> > tell me...do you really want to keep this up?
> >
> > I was raised a catholic, okay, I know the message about forgiveness. If
> > you want to poke holes in everything I say and take part in someone else's
> > argument...well cool, let's do it. Let's go into your argument with the
> > other Jamie while we're at it shall we, seeing as it's open slather.
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> > Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 7:39 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
> >
> >
> > In which case, your comment about "you're not supposed to be dishing out
> > shit" is null and void, since presumably a "completely contradictory" book
> > would contain a justification for anything.
> >
> > Another case of firing off an email without thinking about it first?
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> > To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> > <gathering at misera.net>
> > Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 16:38
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
> >
> >
> >
> > Yes it does, it's completely contradictory.
> >
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> > Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:28 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
> >
> >
> > "I come not to bring peace but a sword."
> >
> > The bible contains plenty of encouragement to "dish out shit" (though most
> > translations don't use that precise phrase).
> >
> > Jamie
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> > <gathering at misera.net>
> > Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:32
> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
> >
> >
> > You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning
> > the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running
> > off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip,
> > lifestyles updates and email.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport, gossip,
> > lifestyles updates and email.
> > _________________________________________________________________
> > Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
> 
> 
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 05:19:51 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:19:51 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W2615C2875933A39665BEF1BE2F0@phx.gbl>


 

 But didn't Duran Duran produce the same shiny plastic pop as which M.J. produced that you  despise  so much ?

 


 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 20:45:32 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch




Duran Duran is a great pop band. I own several of their albums. Not ashamed of it.

 

Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 7:18 PM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 



 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
 
  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
 
 
 
 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 






Oh my god, where did you find this?
 
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


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_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 



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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 05:38:57 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:38:57 +0000
Subject: [kj] Ramadan release
In-Reply-To: <216099.7317.qm@web110209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <E1MK3a0-0000vb-RI@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<LDEIJONOCOIOOPJOEADEAEAADBAA.bbarathy@btinternet.com>
	<COL118-W53ED732C06257B018FDDA7CC330@phx.gbl><65C5A072-C600-4F0A-A22C-3F6DBA95C1AA@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<008b01c9f802$2d749d50$885dd7f0$@com>
	<1B33CB53304C42A8B9D5A2F336FAB8DF@edweil> 
	<216099.7317.qm@web110209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W20642B868B2CC1CB397249BE2F0@phx.gbl>


"Maybe for Christmas/Hannukkah/Ramadan?"

 

  Muslims do not give each other presents during Ramadan, so it would be pointless releasing it during Ramadan . 
 

 

 



Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:07:47 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead







   On a KJ related note, shouldn't Killing Joke be putting out a Singles album at this point? Only the singles from the 90s to the Hossannas...single since the previous era has already been done. But still, they have enough singles for maybe even two Singles discs. I am sure it would be a success.
 
Maybe for Christmas/Hannukkah/Ramadan?

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 



From: Darren A. Peace 
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead





Oh Christ.
 
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK




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From fluke1 at live.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 05:45:27 2009
From: fluke1 at live.co.uk (Floren Luke)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:45:27 +0000
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <18893346.1246362946131.JavaMail.root@elwamui-hound.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <18893346.1246362946131.JavaMail.root@elwamui-hound.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <BLU112-W196834B3D0001ED642F860BE2F0@phx.gbl>


"Is he really dead ? ------- I believe so, but I honestly wouldn't have put it past him to pull a stunt."
 

 

   I have a feeling that his funeral may be shown live on T.V. to a Worldwide audience of Billions  and just as his coffin is being lowered down to the crematorium, hes going to fling the lid open, jump up and shout "Who's bad" , then all the "mourners" and the priest, will then dance in the style of the Thriller video whilst Michael sings his new song .

 

 

 

 


Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 07:55:45 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion



 Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges   ---- Absolutely
 What is your favourite song of his ------  Honestly never had one.
 Is he really dead ? ------- I believe so, but I honestly wouldn't have put it past him to pull a stunt.




Alex in NYC



-----Original Message ----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jun 30, 2009 6:25 AM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion 



 
  Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
 What is your favourite song of his
 Is he really dead ?



Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 
_________________________________________________________________
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From Rob at westwoodassociates.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 05:48:06 2009
From: Rob at westwoodassociates.co.uk (Rob Horan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:48:06 +0100
Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <BLU112-W196834B3D0001ED642F860BE2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <18893346.1246362946131.JavaMail.root@elwamui-hound.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<BLU112-W196834B3D0001ED642F860BE2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <659B6598190BF74586E8DD03BBB85083CA0B72@Server1.HeadOffice.Westwood.local>

he's been dead a week so probably resembling the Thriller vid by
now......

________________________________

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
On Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 02 July 2009 10:45
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion


"Is he really dead ? ------- I believe so, but I honestly wouldn't have
put it past him to pull a stunt."
 
 
   I have a feeling that his funeral may be shown live on T.V. to a
Worldwide audience of Billions  and just as his coffin is being lowered
down to the crematorium, hes going to fling the lid open, jump up and
shout "Who's bad" , then all the "mourners" and the priest, will then
dance in the style of the Thriller video whilst Michael sings his new
song .
 
 
 
 

________________________________

Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 07:55:45 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion

 Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges   ---- Absolutely
 What is your favourite song of his ------  Honestly never had one.
 Is he really dead ? ------- I believe so, but I honestly wouldn't have
put it past him to pull a stunt. 




Alex in NYC




	-----Original Message ----- 
	From: Floren Luke 
	Sent: Jun 30, 2009 6:25 AM 
	To: gathering at misera.net 
	Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion 
	
	 
	  Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
	 What is your favourite song of his
	 Is he really dead ?
	
	
________________________________

	Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
Find out more. <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665375/direct/01/>  


________________________________

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From humanhybrid666 at gmail.com  Thu Jul  2 06:50:48 2009
From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com (bongo)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 22:50:48 +1200
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com> 
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>

exodus 32:19...
and lo . . .



 19 When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing, his
anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking them to
pieces at the foot of the mountain. 20 And he took the calf they had made
and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the
water and made the Israelites drink it.


"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
postponed indefinitely..."


On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com> wrote:

> you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to
> look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i mean
> moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the golden
> calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...
>
>
> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
> postponed indefinitely..."
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:
>
>>
>> Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the
>> land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that
>> Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
>> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>>
>>
>> you have a goat? thats very old testament!
>> =)
>>
>> why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's??
>> its a strange one...
>> will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>wrote:
>>
>> spot on jamie
>> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
>> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . .
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now<http://extras.uk.msn.com/internet-explorer-8/?ocid=T010MSN07A0716U>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>>
>
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From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 07:37:32 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:37:32 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <4F83C8AA-A02B-4F58-B428-50BB9D96EEB3@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

Heh! Wondered who'd defend The Dan.

I'll admit to a total irrationality so far as Steely Dan are  
concerned. My first exposure to them was at the hands of an utterly  
contemptible ass-wipe I used to work for. "Hey Darren," he'd say,  
doing a shitty little shoulder dance at unavoidable out-of-work social  
engagements. "Don't know how you can listen to that shit you call  
music when there's great stuff like this" - fondles Aja sleeve lewdly  
- "around. No, wait, I want to play you some Steve Miller Band next."  
Only point I managed to score was by calling them Fecker and Begin.

So I've dismissed them on the basis that I can't listen to then  
without thinking of that twat (who was also prone to make ridiculous  
physical passes at my then-wife, but that's another story), who  
actually, in hindsight, rather resembled the host with the most in  
"Eating Raoul".

Never mind. There are many bands of far greater consequence I should  
be spending my time on discovering.

Speaking of which, I'm thinking I should give Skinny Puppy another  
try. Recommendations on where to start?

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:33, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:

> Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, t 
> he Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.
>
>
>
> Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.   
> Fie.
>
>
>
> Darren
>
> Hungerford, UK
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
> Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>
> I would disagree.
> Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
> Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
> Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played  
> with MJ)
> Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is .
>
>
>
>
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
> From: countessghoulita at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> I agree.
>
> Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also  
> add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> Michael Jackson....
>
> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
> Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>   Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>
> Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it  
> on your BlackBerry or iPhone.=
>
> _______________________________________________
>
>
>
> Gathering mailing list
>
>
>
> Gathering at misera.net
>
>
>
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
>
> Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com.
>
>
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 07:48:39 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 23:48:39 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com> 
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
	<ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <36914.203.185.215.144.1246535319.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

"then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the
Israelites drink it."

Moses was a homeopath / apothecary?

> exodus 32:19...
> and lo . . .
>
>
>
>  19 When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing, his
> anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking them to
> pieces at the foot of the mountain. 20 And he took the calf they had made
> and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on
> the
> water and made the Israelites drink it.
>
>
> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
> postponed indefinitely..."
>
>
> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to
>> look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i mean
>> moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the
>> golden
>> calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...
>>
>>
>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the
>>> land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that
>>> Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
>>> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>>>
>>>
>>> you have a goat? thats very old testament!
>>> =)
>>>
>>> why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any
>>> idea's??
>>> its a strange one...
>>> will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered
>>> looking..
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence
>>> <stephen.l at live.com>wrote:
>>>
>>> spot on jamie
>>> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
>>> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . .
>>> .
>>>
>>>
>>> ------------------------------
>>> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download
>>> Now<http://extras.uk.msn.com/internet-explorer-8/?ocid=T010MSN07A0716U>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>>
>>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 07:48:16 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:48:16 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity on your  
part.

Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often  
wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable  
object.

The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little distasteful,  
though.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:

> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond  
> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I   
> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> Heh!
>
>
>
> Haven?t kept up enough to take sides, and that?s not really my  
> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one 
>  thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>
>
>
> Darre
>
> Hungerford, UK
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: 01 July 2009 10:44 PM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> Hey Brenda - I thought Darre was on your side?
>
> Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.
>
> Jami
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' <gathering at misera.net 
> >
> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> Sorry Brenda. Can?t let that one pass.
>
>
>
> The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is  
> innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the  
> prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is  
> introduced. So you don?t decide not to convict, you decide to convic 
> t. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.
>
> & nbsp;
>
> This is not always an ideal situation, but I can?t offhand think of  
> a better.
>
>
>
> Although jousting has its merits.
>
>
>
> Darren
>
> Hungerford, UK
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
> Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
> To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>
> His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's  
> simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt  
> present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong  
> enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the  
> contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without  
> qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument,  
> that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as  
> precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't  
> cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on,  
> the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
>
>
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
> 0ATo: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> Brendan,
>
> He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread  
> - that
>
> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element  
> of doubt
> >> in the case
>
> He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as  
> soon as there was an element of doubt".
>
> If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read  
> more carefully.
>
> Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries  
> in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.
>
> For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended  
> lightheartedly <grin>
>
> Jamie
>
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net 
> >
> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the  
> piss,
> believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being  
> argumentative...fair
> enough. I bite just like anyone else.
>
> I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he  
> made up
> his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it  
> reads to
> me.
>
> I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're  
> right
> in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the  
> british.
> I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
>
> I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I  
> can't
> remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the  
> point that
> if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt  
> (which is
> exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either  
> based
> on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's  
> generally
> going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
> overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
>
> It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of  
> being
> struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what  
> I'd be
> going for however.
>
> > Brendan,
> >
> > Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there  
> was an
> > element of doubt".
> >
> > You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a  
> judgement based
> > on
> > the weight of probability".
> >
> > Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
> > courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond  
> reasonable
> > doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of  
> probability".? So,
> > in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a  
> juror;
> > yours was not.
> >
> > I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the  
> middle of
> > a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make  
> him
> > look stupid.? True or false?
> >
> > Jamie
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> > To: 'A list about all thin
> gs Killing Joke (the band!)'
> > <gathering at misera.net>
> > Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> >
> >
> >
> > there was an element of doubt?in the case
> >
> >
> > That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of  
> stuff. We
> > have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal /  
> civil
> > cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not  
> guilty
> > as soon as there's an element of doubt?
> >
> >
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net]
> > On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
> > To: gathering at misera.net
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Brendan,
> >
> > In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable  
> doubt".?
> > Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
> >&
> nbsp;
> > So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and  
> (b) the
> > judge did explain it.
> >
> > Jamie QC
> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> > <gathering at misera.net>
> > Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >
> >
> >
> > I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe  
> your job as
> > a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about  
> practically
> > anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement  
> based on
> > the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence  
> can result
> > in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough  
> etc.
> > You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your  
> mind
> > that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge  
> explain your
> > role as a juror?
> >
> >>
> >> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
> >>
> >> didn't someone
> on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
> >> dad
> >> made him do it for the money
> >>
> >> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
> >>
> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element  
> of doubt
> >> in the case
> >>
> >> l liked a few of his songs
> >>
> >> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
> >>
> >> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
> >> To: gathering at misera.net
> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
> >> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
> >>  What is your favourite song of his
> >>  Is he really dead ?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  
> ________________________________________________________________________
 

> > AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on  
> the
> > move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage  
> today.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
>
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport,  
> gossip, lifestyles updates and email.
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport,  
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 07:53:33 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 23:53:33 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <36914.203.185.215.144.1246535319.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz> 
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com> 
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
	<ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
	<36914.203.185.215.144.1246535319.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <38429.203.185.215.144.1246535613.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Talking about homeopaths, read a funny quote the other day, asking why
water has an infinite memory for tiny amounts of, let's call it medicine,
but not turds ;)

(Disclaimer: Homeopathic / naturopathic remedies fixed my guts a couple
years back, when the doctor couldn't. Pulled me right out of ill health.
Not really sure what the potions were actually, there were a hell of a lot
of them...)

> "then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the
> Israelites drink it."
>
> Moses was a homeopath / apothecary?
>
>> exodus 32:19...
>> and lo . . .
>>
>>
>>
>>  19 When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing, his
>> anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking them to
>> pieces at the foot of the mountain. 20 And he took the calf they had
>> made
>> and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on
>> the
>> water and made the Israelites drink it.
>>
>>
>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to
>>> look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i
>>> mean
>>> moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the
>>> golden
>>> calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...
>>>
>>>
>>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the
>>>> land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that
>>>> Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
>>>> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> you have a goat? thats very old testament!
>>>> =)
>>>>
>>>> why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any
>>>> idea's??
>>>> its a strange one...
>>>> will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered
>>>> looking..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>>>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence
>>>> <stephen.l at live.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>> spot on jamie
>>>> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
>>>> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . .
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download
>>>> Now<http://extras.uk.msn.com/internet-explorer-8/?ocid=T010MSN07A0716U>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 08:06:46 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 00:06:46 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

I've never been called truculent before *beams*

Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats Brenda
tho)

> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity on your
> part.
>
> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
> object.
>
> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little distasteful,
> though.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>
>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>
>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>> Heh!
>>
>>
>>
>> Haven???t kept up enough to take sides, and that???s not really my
>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one
>>  thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>
>>
>>
>> Darre
>>
>> Hungerford, UK
>>
>>
>>
>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
>> Sent: 01 July 2009 10:44 PM
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>> Hey Brenda - I thought Darre was on your side?
>>
>> Looks increasingly like a majority verdict of "guilty" to me.
>>
>> Jami
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>> <gathering at misera.net
>> >
>> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:12
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>> Sorry Brenda. Can???t let that one pass.
>>
>>
>>
>> The absolute presumption, under English law, is that someone is
>> innocent. The only obligation defence council has is to rebut the
>> prosecution argument to the extent that reasonable doubt is
>> introduced. So you don???t decide not to convict, you decide to convic
>> t. Until or unless your mind is swayed, not convicting is a given.
>>
>> & nbsp;
>>
>> This is not always an ideal situation, but I can???t offhand think of
>> a better.
>>
>>
>>
>> Although jousting has its merits.
>>
>>
>>
>> Darren
>>
>> Hungerford, UK
>>
>>
>>
>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Brendan
>> Sent: 01 July 2009 4:56 PM
>> To: 'A list a bout all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>
>> His statement is unequivocal. There was an element of doubt. That's
>> simply NOT the criteria. There is very often an element of doubt
>> present. You only decide not to convict (against evidence strong
>> enough to otherwise convict) is if there is enough evidence to the
>> contrary. "An element of doubt" doesn't cut it for me, without
>> qualification it never would, I don't buy the context argument,
>> that's being too generous in my opinion. Legal speak has to be as
>> precise as possible, that's half the issue here. Stephen hasn't
>> cleared it up and in the eyes of the law the longer that goes on,
>> the more it creates a sense of implicit acceptance.
>>
>>
>>
>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 1:14 AM
>> 0ATo: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>> Brendan,
>>
>> He said - as you can read for yourself at the bottom of this thread
>> - that
>>
>> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element
>> of doubt
>> >> in the case
>>
>> He didn't say - as you allege below - that he "made up his mind as
>> soon as there was an element of doubt".
>>
>> If you did indeed read it like that, you need to slow down and read
>> more carefully.
>>
>> Wait - you're a hippy living in one of the most laid-back countries
>> in the world.  Don't slow down, your pulse rate would disappear.
>>
>> For the avoidance of doubt, the last two lines are intended
>> lightheartedly <grin>
>>
>> Jamie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> <gathering at misera.net
>> >
>> Sent: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 10:17
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>> I totally disagree, and I prefaced it by saing I wasn't taking the
>> piss,
>> believe that or don't, up to you. Perhaps I was being
>> argumentative...fair
>> enough. I bite just like anyone else.
>>
>> I'm guilty of taking things literally, and what I gathered was he
>> made up
>> his mind as soon as there was an element of doubt. That's how it
>> reads to
>> me.
>>
>> I've been involved in one each of civil and criminal cases, you're
>> right
>> in the distinction of course. NZ's legal system derives from the
>> british.
>> I think we can still appeal to the highest court in the UK as well.
>>
>> I was describing the conditions of a civil case (my most recent). I
>> can't
>> remember if he mentioned which kind, but it's irrelevant to the
>> point that
>> if you make up your mind as soon as there's an element of doubt
>> (which is
>> exactly how he described it), you're not judging the evidence either
>> based
>> on weight of probability or beyond a reasonable doubt. There's
>> generally
>> going to be doubt on both sides, short of a clear cut case with
>> overwhelming evidence or an admission of guilt.
>>
>> It's up to interpretation whether his comments would be worthy of
>> being
>> struck as a juror, if I was a lawyer on the other side that's what
>> I'd be
>> going for however.
>>
>> > Brendan,
>> >
>> > Stephen said that he opted for a not-guilty verdict?because "there
>> was an
>> > element of doubt".
>> >
>> > You?replied (see below) that he should have?been "making a
>> judgement based
>> > on
>> > the weight of probability".
>> >
>> > Given that we're on a Killing Joke mailing list rather than in a
>> > courtroom, I'd accept?his phrase as being equivalent to "beyond
>> reasonable
>> > doubt"; yours is clearly equivalent to "the balance of
>> probability".? So,
>> > in short, his comment was in line with the requirement for being a
>> juror;
>> > yours was not.
>> >
>> > I rather suspect that you picked up on it because you're in the
>> middle of
>> > a disagreement with him, and it looked like an opportunity to make
>> him
>> > look stupid.? True or false?
>> >
>> > Jamie
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>> > To: 'A list about all thin
>> gs Killing Joke (the band!)'
>> > <gathering at misera.net>
>> > Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 15:50
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > there was an element of doubt?in the case
>> >
>> >
>> > That's my point. There's an element of doubt to an awful lot of
>> stuff. We
>> > have the same distinction with weight of evidence in criminal /
>> civil
>> > cases here, less is required for Civil. You can't just decide not
>> guilty
>> > as soon as there's an element of doubt?
>> >
>> >
>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>> bounces at misera.net]
>> > On Behalf Of jpwhkj at aol.com
>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 12:02 AM
>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > Hi Brendan,
>> >
>> > In the UK criminal charges have to be proved "beyond reasonable
>> doubt".?
>> > Civil cases rest on "the balance of probability".
>> >&
>> nbsp;
>> > So it sounds like (a) Steve did indeed do his job as a juror, and
>> (b) the
>> > judge did explain it.
>> >
>> > Jamie QC
>> >
>> >
>> > -----Original Message-----
>> > From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>> > <gathering at misera.net>
>> > Sent: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 13:32
>> > Subject: Re: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > I'm not taking the piss, but is that HONESTLY what you believe
>> your job as
>> > a juror is? A good lawyer can create an element of doubt about
>> practically
>> > anything, it's about weighing the evidence and making a judgement
>> based on
>> > the weight of probability. As such even circumstantial evidence
>> can result
>> > in convictions, in criminal and civil cases, if it's strong enough
>> etc.
>> > You can't see a single crack in a case and instantly make up your
>> mind
>> > that there's doubt so can be no conviction? Didn't the judge
>> explain your
>> > role as a juror?
>> >
>> >>
>> >> personally i think the truth has not been revealed
>> >>
>> >> didn't someone
>> on here say that the kid who accused him said that his
>> >> dad
>> >> made him do it for the money
>> >>
>> >> so in my opinion if there is an element of doubt
>> >>
>> >> when i did jury service i voted against as there was an element
>> of doubt
>> >> in the case
>> >>
>> >> l liked a few of his songs
>> >>
>> >> out of my life /dirty diana /beat it / earth song /black or white
>> >>
>> >> i suppose an elvis type conspiracy may rear it's head
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 10:25:12 +0000
>> >> Subject: [kj] MJ Conclusion
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>   Do you feel that he was guilty of the charges
>> >>  What is your favourite song of his
>> >>  Is he really dead ?
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> ________________________________________________________________________
>
>
>> > AOL Email goes Mobile! You can now read your AOL Emails whilst on
>> the
>> > move. Sign up for a free AOL Email account with unlimited storage
>> today.
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Gathering mailing list
>> > Gathering at misera.net
>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>> >
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>>
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport,
>> gossip, lifestyles updates and email.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Click here to get the very best of AOL, including news, sport,
>> gossip, lifestyles updates and email.
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> _______________________________________________
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> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 08:21:24 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 13:21:24 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <36914.203.185.215.144.1246535319.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
	<ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
	<36914.203.185.215.144.1246535319.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <2AA11DE8-1C37-4AAE-9C02-7D15377E90E7@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

First account of pica in fiction.

Moses had problems with hairballs too, I understand.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 12:48, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:

> "then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the
> Israelites drink it."
>
> Moses was a homeopath / apothecary?
>
>> exodus 32:19...
>> and lo . . .
>>
>>
>>
>> 19 When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing,  
>> his
>> anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking  
>> them to
>> pieces at the foot of the mountain. 20 And he took the calf they  
>> had made
>> and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered  
>> it on
>> the
>> water and made the Israelites drink it.
>>
>>
>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com>  
>> wrote:
>>
>>> you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you  
>>> want to
>>> look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton,  
>>> i mean
>>> moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the
>>> golden
>>> calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...
>>>
>>>
>>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing  
>>>> on the
>>>> land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope  
>>>> that
>>>> Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
>>>> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> you have a goat? thats very old testament!
>>>> =)
>>>>
>>>> why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any
>>>> idea's??
>>>> its a strange one...
>>>> will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered
>>>> looking..
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been
>>>> postponed indefinitely..."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence
>>>> <stephen.l at live.com>wrote:
>>>>
>>>> spot on jamie
>>>> but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek
>>>> i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL  
>>>> retaliate . .
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------
>>>> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download
>>>> Now<http://extras.uk.msn.com/internet-explorer-8/?ocid=T010MSN07A0716U 
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 08:37:25 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 13:37:25 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

Nice try, but you'll always be Brenda to me.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 13:06, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:

> I've never been called truculent before *beams*
>
> Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats  
> Brenda
> tho)
>
>> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity on  
>> your
>> part.
>>
>> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
>> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
>> object.
>>
>> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little distasteful,
>> though.
>>
>> Darren
>> Hungerford, UK
>>
>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>>
>>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>>
>>> Heh!
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Haven???t kept up enough to take sides, and that???s not  
>>> really my
>>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one
>>> thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>>
>>>

From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 08:53:08 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 00:53:08 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Yes but this Brenda doens't give enigmatic strangers in capes clandestine
rides in Minis to the tunes of experimental mid-eighties synth pop,
dropping them off to "visit their mother' (!)

And if you'd seen me you'd agree that I'd make an exceptionally ugly
Brenda (there's a joke in there about cutting the end off...can't quite
make it fit...so to speak).

I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).

> Nice try, but you'll always be Brenda to me.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> On 2 Jul 2009, at 13:06, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>
>> I've never been called truculent before *beams*
>>
>> Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats
>> Brenda
>> tho)
>>
>>> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity on
>>> your
>>> part.
>>>
>>> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
>>> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
>>> object.
>>>
>>> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little distasteful,
>>> though.
>>>
>>> Darren
>>> Hungerford, UK
>>>
>>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>>>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>>>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>>>
>>>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>>>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>>>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>>>
>>>> Heh!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Haven????????t kept up enough to take sides, and that????????s not
>>>> really my
>>>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one
>>>> thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>>>
>>>>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Thu Jul  2 09:10:48 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:10:48 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <021e01c9fb16$85258250$8f7086f0$@com>

I have a lot of time for Glenn Close a an actress, but I do find her
singularly unattractive. "Fatal Attraction", apart from being a poorer
remake of the excellent "Play Misty For Me", failed on the very basic level
that GC was so unappealing. The tight perm didn't help. I'm sure the
argument could be made that FA was making the point that men are so shit
that they'll ravish anything showing even the vaguest interest, but that
doesn't really work as a thesis.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 02 July 2009 1:53 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion

I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).


From MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com  Thu Jul  2 09:48:47 2009
From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com (MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:48:47 +0100
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <EXCHL0202rydfiPKtKE002fbb67@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
References: <EXCHL0202rydfiPKtKE002fbb67@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
Message-ID: <20090702134901.268E010565@mailwash5.pair.com>

"the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product." 

Wow, we've seen a lot of things being levelled at Wacko, but soulless???? 


-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Alex Smith
Sent: 01 July 2009 14:41
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


Boys,....

Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?

Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 

Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.

Just my two cents.
Alex in NYC





-----Original Message-----
>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
><gathering at misera.net>
>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>
>>
>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>
>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>
>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>
>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>
>> you ignored it
>
>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>
>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>
>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I 
>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into 
>someone saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a 
>discussion about bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>
>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>
>So stop replying then...
>
>> i have better things to do
>
>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>
>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>
>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be 
>turning the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are 
>you running off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>
>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>
>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most 
>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>
>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>
>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth 
>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in 
>our arguments.
>
>>
>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>
>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I 
>don't know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>
>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good 
>> band
>on the planet
>
>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>
>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and 
>ones I don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to 
>in jokes and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete 
>quickly, I vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>
>
>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>
>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>
>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>
>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>
>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>
>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>> regarding
>>> > jury service
>>>
>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how 
>>> would you know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>
>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence 
>>> > case
>>> >
>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>
>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you 
>>> decided based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what 
>>> you originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. 
>>> That was my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the 
>>> other and make up your mind then and there without hearing the rest 
>>> of the evidence.
>>>
>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>> haven't
>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>
>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>> else's mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>
>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>
>>> When are you not?
>>>
>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>
>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>> that.
>>> >
>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>> > Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his 
>>> > english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint 
>>> > praise or
>>> whatever,
>>> > but hey..
>>> >
>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing or get some new 
>>> > glasses testing the statement you made SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person 
>>> > mentioned
>>> >
>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >>
>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>> >>
>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the 
>>> >> chin when someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending 
>>> >> that you're
>>> holier
>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite 
>>> >> you are...sorry.
>>> >>
>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>> >>
>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in 
>>> >> it
>>> with
>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>> >>
>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>> >>
>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>> >>
>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>> sarcasm?
>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>> >>
>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>> pete
>>> >> west"
>>> >>
>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion 
>>> >> between
>>> you
>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse 
>>> >> than
>>> he
>>> >> is
>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>> >> gets going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>> >>
>>> >> >
>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>> >> >
>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > get over it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>> >> >
>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such 
>>> >> > rubbish
>>> >> written
>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that 
>>> >> > unless i dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the 
>>> >> > kingdom onearth
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>> around
>>> >> me
>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>> >> >
>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>> >> >
>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of 
>>> >> > persona
>>> in
>>> >> order
>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>> >> >
>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>> >> >
>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>> >> >
>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in 
>>> >> > real
>>> life
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>> >> > throats
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe 
>>> >> > to
>>> the
>>> >> > cult of personality
>>> >> >
>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been 
>>> >> > in
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>> >> >
>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>> >> heartbreaks
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask 
>>> >> > if
>>> i'm
>>> >> not
>>> >> > sure
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>> kindness
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up 
>>> >> > the
>>> past
>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i 
>>> >> > was
>>> pete
>>> >> west
>>> >> >
>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>> minds
>>> >> or
>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white 
>>> >> > thinking...negative
>>> >> thoughts
>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>> remark
>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>> >> > think
>>> >> you
>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your 
>>> >> > collective
>>> >> imaginary
>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>> incidence
>>> >> of
>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with 
>>> >> > supernatural
>>> >> promises
>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set 
>>> >> > of
>>> >> options.
>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>> >> > 100%
>>> >> chance
>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into 
>>> >> > your
>>> >> nervous
>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the 
>>> >> > existing
>>> >> model..
>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>> imply
>>> >> some
>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me i do not 
>>> >> > recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of regarding a 
>>> >> > boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>> walked
>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>> approval
>>> >> > from anyone
>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech i have never tried ''to fit in 
>>> >> > ''
>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it 
>>> >> > is fashionable i occaisionally pay homage to a particular 
>>> >> > vernacular because it
>>> >> raises a
>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it 
>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own 
>>> >> > personal
>>> space
>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with 
>>> >> > someone [
>>> >> except
>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>> omission)?
>>> >> A
>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or 
>>> >> > comment
>>> >> that
>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed 
>>> >> > along
>>> >> with
>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave 
>>> >> > face
>>> >> when
>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>> >> > when
>>> >> being
>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like 
>>> >> > a
>>> >> tougher
>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to 
>>> >> > give
>>> a
>>> >> shit
>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be 
>>> >> > interested
>>> when
>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>> Heaped
>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the 
>>> >> > right reasons?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>> >> > when
>>> >> you're
>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't 
>>> >> > like
>>> for
>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>> retrospect
>>> >> and
>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>> >> > particular
>>> >> way to
>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your 
>>> >> > representative on
>>> a
>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was 
>>> >> > around
>>> >> before
>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>> they
>>> >> have
>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 
>>> >> > 'fit
>>> in'?
>>> >> Or
>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on 
>>> >> > a
>>> date?
>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>> >> Tried
>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>> disgusts
>>> >> you?
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL 
>>> >> > OF
>>> >> SHIT.
>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, 
>>> >> > f*?k
>>> it!
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>> >> >
>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>> >> alternative
>>> >> >> set
>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>> what
>>> >> >> I've
>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>>> >> the
>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>> >> want.
>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>> feel
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>> >> >> fashionable
>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>> comments
>>> >> >> with
>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>> >> doing
>>> >> >> my
>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>> >> actually
>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>> >> about
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>> real
>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>> >> death
>>> >> >> (so
>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>> >> have a
>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>>> >> been
>>> >> >> > settled.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>> about
>>> >> any
>>> >> >> or
>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>> >> also
>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>> bloody
>>> >> >> circus
>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>> >> >> activities. I
>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>> >> pieces
>>> >> >> of
>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>> >> >> multi-million
>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>> come
>>> >> was
>>> >> >> a
>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>> >> problems"..
>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>> >> makes
>>> >> >> it
>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>> >> little
>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>> >> >> half-decent
>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>> we
>>> >> all
>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>> >> offends
>>> >> >> > someone?
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>> inane
>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>> >> abused
>>> >> >> word
>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>> >> downloads
>>> >> >> etc
>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>> >> smells
>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Darren
>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>> Find
>>> >> out
>>> >> >> > more.
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >> >
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>> out
>>> >> > more.
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >> >
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>> > more.
>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>> >
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>
>
>_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 09:58:57 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 01:58:57 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] Glenn Close
In-Reply-To: <021e01c9fb16$85258250$8f7086f0$@com>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<021e01c9fb16$85258250$8f7086f0$@com>
Message-ID: <8006.203.185.215.144.1246543137.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

She's only worked in one genre as far as I'm concerned - horror. ("The
horror...the horror...")

I never watched Fatal Attraction for that very reason (it also looked like
a bag of shit on its own merits I have to say, but I wouldn't actually
know...), suspension of disbelief that MD would actually have been able to
shag her with a straight...um, face.

She's not actually that bad, just so poorly cast in that movie because
she's NOT that attractive...MD is hardly gonna be missing the good old
days when he worked with actresses of her calibre (.38 snubnose), now he's
stuck at home with frumpy old Catherine Zeta Jones...

I'm sure that the perm was totally violating the manifesto even at the
time...

And just to be fair, I have to point out that I happily watch movies with
Danny DeVito and Ron Perlman and think they're both great. But then I'm
not in the habit off shagging guys, that's my excuse at least.

> I have a lot of time for Glenn Close a an actress, but I do find her
> singularly unattractive. "Fatal Attraction", apart from being a poorer
> remake of the excellent "Play Misty For Me", failed on the very basic
> level
> that GC was so unappealing. The tight perm didn't help. I'm sure the
> argument could be made that FA was making the point that men are so shit
> that they'll ravish anything showing even the vaguest interest, but that
> doesn't really work as a thesis.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On
> Behalf Of Brendan
> Sent: 02 July 2009 1:53 PM
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
> ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>



From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 10:02:27 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 02:02:27 +1200 (NZST)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <20090702134901.268E010565@mailwash5.pair.com>
References: <EXCHL0202rydfiPKtKE002fbb67@EXCHL0202.rtdom.com>
	<20090702134901.268E010565@mailwash5.pair.com>
Message-ID: <9130.203.185.215.144.1246543347.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>

Okay i think I can do better (worse) than MJ. I'm gonna throw it out
there, see if we can plumb the bottom of the barrel.

Tiffany.

> "the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless,
> meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product."
>
> Wow, we've seen a lot of things being levelled at Wacko, but soulless????
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On Behalf Of Alex Smith
> Sent: 01 July 2009 14:41
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); A list about all
> things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
>
>
> Boys,....
>
> Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request --
> can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting
> enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more
> revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
>
> Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or
> not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke
> to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic
> offal that was Michael Jackson's product.
>
> Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind.
> Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.
>
> Just my two cents.
> Alex in NYC
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)"
>><gathering at misera.net>
>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>>
>>>
>>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>>
>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>>
>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>>
>>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>>
>>> you ignored it
>>
>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>>
>>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>>
>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I
>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into
>>someone saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a
>>discussion about bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single
>> thing I say...
>>
>>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>>
>>So stop replying then...
>>
>>> i have better things to do
>>
>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>>
>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>>
>>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be
>>turning the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are
>>you running off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>>
>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>>
>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most
>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>>
>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>>
>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth
>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in
>>our arguments.
>>
>>>
>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>>
>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I
>>don't know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>>
>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good
>>> band
>>on the planet
>>
>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>>
>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and
>>ones I don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to
>>in jokes and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete
>>quickly, I vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but
>> didn't click.
>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>>
>>
>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>>
>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>>
>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>>
>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>>
>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>>> regarding
>>>> > jury service
>>>>
>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how
>>>> would you know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>>
>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence
>>>> > case
>>>> >
>>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>>
>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you
>>>> decided based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what
>>>> you originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case.
>>>> That was my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the
>>>> other and make up your mind then and there without hearing the rest
>>>> of the evidence.
>>>>
>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>>> haven't
>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>>
>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone
>>>> else's mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>>
>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>>
>>>> When are you not?
>>>>
>>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>>
>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>>> that.
>>>> >
>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to
>>>> > Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his
>>>> > english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint
>>>> > praise or
>>>> whatever,
>>>> > but hey..
>>>> >
>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing or get some new
>>>> > glasses testing the statement you made SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person
>>>> > mentioned
>>>> >
>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the
>>>> >> chin when someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending
>>>> >> that you're
>>>> holier
>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite
>>>> >> you are...sorry.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in
>>>> >> it
>>>> with
>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>>> sarcasm?
>>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion
>>>> >> between
>>>> you
>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse
>>>> >> than
>>>> he
>>>> >> is
>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he
>>>> >> gets going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > get over it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such
>>>> >> > rubbish
>>>> >> written
>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that
>>>> >> > unless i dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the
>>>> >> > kingdom onearth
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>>> around
>>>> >> me
>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of
>>>> >> > persona
>>>> in
>>>> >> order
>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in
>>>> >> > real
>>>> life
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others
>>>> >> > throats
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe
>>>> >> > to
>>>> the
>>>> >> > cult of personality
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been
>>>> >> > in
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>>> >> heartbreaks
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask
>>>> >> > if
>>>> i'm
>>>> >> not
>>>> >> > sure
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>>> kindness
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up
>>>> >> > the
>>>> past
>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i
>>>> >> > was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>>> minds
>>>> >> or
>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white
>>>> >> > thinking...negative
>>>> >> thoughts
>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>>> remark
>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you
>>>> >> > think
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your
>>>> >> > collective
>>>> >> imaginary
>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>>> incidence
>>>> >> of
>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with
>>>> >> > supernatural
>>>> >> promises
>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set
>>>> >> > of
>>>> >> options.
>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a
>>>> >> > 100%
>>>> >> chance
>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into
>>>> >> > your
>>>> >> nervous
>>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the
>>>> >> > existing
>>>> >> model..
>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>>> imply
>>>> >> some
>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me i do not
>>>> >> > recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of regarding a
>>>> >> > boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>>> walked
>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>>> approval
>>>> >> > from anyone
>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech i have never tried ''to fit in
>>>> >> > ''
>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it
>>>> >> > is fashionable i occaisionally pay homage to a particular
>>>> >> > vernacular because it
>>>> >> raises a
>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it
>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own
>>>> >> > personal
>>>> space
>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with
>>>> >> > someone [
>>>> >> except
>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>>> omission)?
>>>> >> A
>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or
>>>> >> > comment
>>>> >> that
>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed
>>>> >> > along
>>>> >> with
>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave
>>>> >> > face
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> being
>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like
>>>> >> > a
>>>> >> tougher
>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to
>>>> >> > give
>>>> a
>>>> >> shit
>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be
>>>> >> > interested
>>>> when
>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>>> Heaped
>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the
>>>> >> > right reasons?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> you're
>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't
>>>> >> > like
>>>> for
>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>>> retrospect
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a
>>>> >> > particular
>>>> >> way to
>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your
>>>> >> > representative on
>>>> a
>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was
>>>> >> > around
>>>> >> before
>>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>>> they
>>>> >> have
>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to
>>>> >> > 'fit
>>>> in'?
>>>> >> Or
>>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on
>>>> >> > a
>>>> date?
>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>>> >> Tried
>>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>>> disgusts
>>>> >> you?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL
>>>> >> > OF
>>>> >> SHIT.
>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey,
>>>> >> > f*?k
>>>> it!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk
>>>> bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>>> >> alternative
>>>> >> >> set
>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>>> what
>>>> >> >> I've
>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes
>>>> to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>>> >> want.
>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>>> feel
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>>> >> >> fashionable
>>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>>> comments
>>>> >> >> with
>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else
>>>> said
>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm
>>>> just
>>>> >> doing
>>>> >> >> my
>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>>> >> actually
>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk
>>>> bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>>> real
>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic
>>>> accidental
>>>> >> death
>>>> >> >> (so
>>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think
>>>> they'll
>>>> >> have a
>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases
>>>> have
>>>> >> been
>>>> >> >> > settled.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>>> about
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> or
>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if
>>>> they've
>>>> >> also
>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>>> bloody
>>>> >> >> circus
>>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>>> >> >> activities. I
>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>>> >> pieces
>>>> >> >> of
>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>>> >> >> multi-million
>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>>> come
>>>> >> was
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>>> >> problems"..
>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>>> >> makes
>>>> >> >> it
>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst
>>>> a
>>>> >> little
>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>>> >> >> half-decent
>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies
>>>> do
>>>> we
>>>> >> all
>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>>> >> offends
>>>> >> >> > someone?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>>> inane
>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>>> >> abused
>>>> >> >> word
>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>>> >> downloads
>>>> >> >> etc
>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load.
>>>> Somethings
>>>> >> smells
>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Darren
>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>>> Find
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> >> > more.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> >> > more.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> > more.
>>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
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>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
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> Gathering mailing list
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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:06:56 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:06:56 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
Message-ID: <17284185.1246543617591.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
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From bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net  Thu Jul  2 10:10:49 2009
From: bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net (B. Oliver Sheppard)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 09:10:49 -0500
Subject: [kj] Glenn Close
In-Reply-To: <8006.203.185.215.144.1246543137.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>	<52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>	<021e01c9fb16$85258250$8f7086f0$@com>
	<8006.203.185.215.144.1246543137.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
Message-ID: <4A4CBFE9.5060706@sbcglobal.net>

She is not bad at playing sinister roles. In Dangerous Liaisons she did 
sport a nice rack all crushed up against that bodice.


-Oliver




Brendan wrote:
> She's only worked in one genre as far as I'm concerned - horror. ("The
> horror...the horror...")


From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:15:31 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:15:31 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
Message-ID: <26750741.1246544131714.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 10:17:04 2009
From: jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk (Jim Harper)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:17:04 +0000 (GMT)
Subject: [kj] Glenn Close
Message-ID: <973108.53521.qm@web25905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>

Fatal Attraction failed for me, not least because of the ending. The original script featured Alex (Close) committing suicide, leaving the guilt with Michael Douglas. John Carpenter was offered the chance to direct, and he thought the script was fine- but turned it down because he felt there was no chance that the original ending would remain unchanged. Sure enough, before the script was offered to another director the ending had been altered to the sanctimonious cop-out ending that was filed, essentially letting Michael Douglas off the hook because Close turned out to be a nutjob.
?
I've no doubt many people here have already seen it, but one of the films that got almost entirely ignored while Fatal Attraction was making millions at the box office was Joseph Ruben's The Stepfather, a scary, brutal, smart thriller that also takes a look at modern family life, but hits the mark a hell of a lot better than Fatal Attraction. If you haven't seen it yet, track it down before the remake hits theatres in October. It's a first-rate cult classic and one of the best unsung heroes of 1980s horror.
?
Sorry for the rant there!
?
Jim.

--- On Thu, 2/7/09, Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:


She's only worked in one genre as far as I'm concerned - horror. ("The
horror...the horror...")

I never watched Fatal Attraction for that very reason (it also looked like
a bag of shit on its own merits I have to say, but I wouldn't actually
know...), suspension of disbelief that MD would actually have been able to
shag her with a straight...um, face.

She's not actually that bad, just so poorly cast in that movie because
she's NOT that attractive...MD is hardly gonna be missing the good old
days when he worked with actresses of her calibre (.38 snubnose), now he's
stuck at home with frumpy old Catherine Zeta Jones...

I'm sure that the perm was totally violating the manifesto even at the
time...

And just to be fair, I have to point out that I happily watch movies with
Danny DeVito and Ron Perlman and think they're both great. But then I'm
not in the habit off shagging guys, that's my excuse at least.

> I have a lot of time for Glenn Close a an actress, but I do find her
> singularly unattractive. "Fatal Attraction", apart from being a poorer
> remake of the excellent "Play Misty For Me", failed on the very basic
> level
> that GC was so unappealing. The tight perm didn't help. I'm sure the
> argument could be made that FA was making the point that men are so shit
> that they'll ravish anything showing even the vaguest interest, but that
> doesn't really work as a thesis.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
> On
> Behalf Of Brendan
> Sent: 02 July 2009 1:53 PM
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
> ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



      
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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:17:14 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:17:14 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
Message-ID: <8946981.1246544234752.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:19:21 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:19:21 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:20:54 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:20:54 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
Message-ID: <24944948.1246544454665.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>

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From vassifer at earthlink.net  Thu Jul  2 10:25:02 2009
From: vassifer at earthlink.net (Alex Smith)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:25:02 -0400 (GMT-04:00)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
Message-ID: <2362780.1246544703247.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>


I was talking about his music, not him as a person, but I don't really think he was all that great as a *soul* either.

I personally don't hear a great deal of depth or soul or substance in bullshit like "Dirty Diana" or "PYT," do you? 


Alex in NYC


-----Original Message-----
>From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
>Sent: Jul 2, 2009 9:48 AM
>To: vassifer at earthlink.net, gathering at misera.net
>Subject: RE: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
>
>"the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product." 
>
>Wow, we've seen a lot of things being levelled at Wacko, but soulless???? 
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Alex Smith
>Sent: 01 July 2009 14:41
>To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
>
>
>Boys,....
>
>Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
>
>Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 
>
>Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.
>
>Just my two cents.
>Alex in NYC
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>><gathering at misera.net>
>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead
>>
>>>
>>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>>
>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>>
>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>>
>>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>>
>>> you ignored it
>>
>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>>
>>> i am not going to explain  myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>>
>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I 
>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into 
>>someone saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a 
>>discussion about bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>>
>>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>>
>>So stop replying then...
>>
>>> i have better things to do
>>
>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>>
>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>>
>>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be 
>>turning the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are 
>>you running off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>>
>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>>
>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most 
>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>>
>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>>
>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth 
>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in 
>>our arguments.
>>
>>>
>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>>
>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I 
>>don't know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>>
>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good 
>>> band
>>on the planet
>>
>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>>
>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and 
>>ones I don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to 
>>in jokes and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete 
>>quickly, I vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>>
>>
>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>>
>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>>
>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>>
>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>>
>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>>> regarding
>>>> > jury service
>>>>
>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how 
>>>> would you know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>>
>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence 
>>>> > case
>>>> >
>>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>>
>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you 
>>>> decided based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what 
>>>> you originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. 
>>>> That was my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the 
>>>> other and make up your mind then and there without hearing the rest 
>>>> of the evidence.
>>>>
>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>>> haven't
>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>>
>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>>> else's mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>>
>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>>
>>>> When are you not?
>>>>
>>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>>
>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>>> that.
>>>> >
>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>>> > Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his 
>>>> > english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint 
>>>> > praise or
>>>> whatever,
>>>> > but hey..
>>>> >
>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing or get some new 
>>>> > glasses testing the statement you made SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person 
>>>> > mentioned
>>>> >
>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the 
>>>> >> chin when someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending 
>>>> >> that you're
>>>> holier
>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite 
>>>> >> you are...sorry.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in 
>>>> >> it
>>>> with
>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>>> sarcasm?
>>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion 
>>>> >> between
>>>> you
>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse 
>>>> >> than
>>>> he
>>>> >> is
>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>>> >> gets going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > get over it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such 
>>>> >> > rubbish
>>>> >> written
>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that 
>>>> >> > unless i dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the 
>>>> >> > kingdom onearth
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>>> around
>>>> >> me
>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of 
>>>> >> > persona
>>>> in
>>>> >> order
>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in 
>>>> >> > real
>>>> life
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>>> >> > throats
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe 
>>>> >> > to
>>>> the
>>>> >> > cult of personality
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been 
>>>> >> > in
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>>> >> heartbreaks
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask 
>>>> >> > if
>>>> i'm
>>>> >> not
>>>> >> > sure
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>>> kindness
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up 
>>>> >> > the
>>>> past
>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i 
>>>> >> > was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>>> minds
>>>> >> or
>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white 
>>>> >> > thinking...negative
>>>> >> thoughts
>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>>> remark
>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>>> >> > think
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your 
>>>> >> > collective
>>>> >> imaginary
>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>>> incidence
>>>> >> of
>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with 
>>>> >> > supernatural
>>>> >> promises
>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set 
>>>> >> > of
>>>> >> options.
>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>>> >> > 100%
>>>> >> chance
>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into 
>>>> >> > your
>>>> >> nervous
>>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the 
>>>> >> > existing
>>>> >> model..
>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>>> imply
>>>> >> some
>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me i do not 
>>>> >> > recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of regarding a 
>>>> >> > boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>>> walked
>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>>> approval
>>>> >> > from anyone
>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech i have never tried ''to fit in 
>>>> >> > ''
>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it 
>>>> >> > is fashionable i occaisionally pay homage to a particular 
>>>> >> > vernacular because it
>>>> >> raises a
>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it 
>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own 
>>>> >> > personal
>>>> space
>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with 
>>>> >> > someone [
>>>> >> except
>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>>> omission)?
>>>> >> A
>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or 
>>>> >> > comment
>>>> >> that
>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed 
>>>> >> > along
>>>> >> with
>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave 
>>>> >> > face
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> being
>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like 
>>>> >> > a
>>>> >> tougher
>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to 
>>>> >> > give
>>>> a
>>>> >> shit
>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be 
>>>> >> > interested
>>>> when
>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>>> Heaped
>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the 
>>>> >> > right reasons?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> you're
>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't 
>>>> >> > like
>>>> for
>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>>> retrospect
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>>> >> > particular
>>>> >> way to
>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your 
>>>> >> > representative on
>>>> a
>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was 
>>>> >> > around
>>>> >> before
>>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>>> they
>>>> >> have
>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 
>>>> >> > 'fit
>>>> in'?
>>>> >> Or
>>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on 
>>>> >> > a
>>>> date?
>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>>> >> Tried
>>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>>> disgusts
>>>> >> you?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL 
>>>> >> > OF
>>>> >> SHIT.
>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, 
>>>> >> > f*?k
>>>> it!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>>> >> alternative
>>>> >> >> set
>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>>> what
>>>> >> >> I've
>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>>> >> want.
>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>>> feel
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>>> >> >> fashionable
>>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>>> comments
>>>> >> >> with
>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>>> >> doing
>>>> >> >> my
>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>>> >> actually
>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>>> real
>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>>> >> death
>>>> >> >> (so
>>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>>> >> have a
>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>>>> >> been
>>>> >> >> > settled.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>>> about
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> or
>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>>> >> also
>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>>> bloody
>>>> >> >> circus
>>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>>> >> >> activities. I
>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>>> >> pieces
>>>> >> >> of
>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>>> >> >> multi-million
>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>>> come
>>>> >> was
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>>> >> problems"..
>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>>> >> makes
>>>> >> >> it
>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>>> >> little
>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>>> >> >> half-decent
>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>>> we
>>>> >> all
>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>>> >> offends
>>>> >> >> > someone?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>>> inane
>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>>> >> abused
>>>> >> >> word
>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>>> >> downloads
>>>> >> >> etc
>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>>> >> smells
>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Darren
>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>>> Find
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> >> > more.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> >> > more.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>>> > more.
>>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free.
>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
>>Gathering at misera.net
>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> 
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
>
>==============================================================================
>


From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 10:24:53 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 15:24:53 +0100
Subject: [kj] Glenn Close
In-Reply-To: <973108.53521.qm@web25905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
References: <973108.53521.qm@web25905.mail.ukl.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <D350B9DA-B6E8-4116-95F8-06E6106616E4@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

Original FA ending is on the SE DVD, and is as preferable an ending as  
Cary Grant posting his dead wife's incriminating letter in Hitchcock's  
"Suspicion".

FFS! They're remaking The Stepfather? One of my favourite 80s films,  
and Terry Quinn's towering performance. "Who am I here?" Incredible! I  
don't have it on DVD though. Is there a decent release?

What's next? Remaking Friedkin's excellent "Rampage", another  
forgotten classic? Clearly I can't wait for the "Suspiria" remake.

Bah.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 15:17, Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

> Fatal Attraction failed for me, not least because of the ending. The  
> original script featured Alex (Close) committing suicide, leaving  
> the guilt with Michael Douglas. John Carpenter was offered the  
> chance to direct, and he thought the script was fine- but turned it  
> down because he felt there was no chance that the original ending  
> would remain unchanged. Sure enough, before the script was offered  
> to another director the ending had been altered to the sanctimonious  
> cop-out ending that was filed, essentially letting Michael Douglas  
> off the hook because Close turned out to be a nutjob.
>
> I've no doubt many people here have already seen it, but one of the  
> films that got almost entirely ignored while Fatal Attraction was  
> making millions at the box office was Joseph Ruben's The Stepfather,  
> a scary, brutal, smart thriller that also takes a look at modern  
> family life, but hits the mark a hell of a lot better than Fatal  
> Attraction. If you haven't seen it yet, track it down before the  
> remake hits theatres in October. It's a first-rate cult classic and  
> one of the best unsung heroes of 1980s horror.
>
> Sorry for the rant there!
>
> Jim.
>
> --- On Thu, 2/7/09, Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
> She's only worked in one genre as far as I'm concerned - horror. ("The
> horror...the horror...")
>
> I never watched Fatal Attraction for that very reason (it also  
> looked like
> a bag of shit on its own merits I have to say, but I wouldn't actually
> know...), suspension of disbelief that MD would actually have been  
> able to
> shag her with a straight...um, face.
>
> She's not actually that bad, just so poorly cast in that movie because
> she's NOT that attractive...MD is hardly gonna be missing the good old
> days when he worked with actresses of her calibre (.38 snubnose),  
> now he's
> stuck at home with frumpy old Catherine Zeta Jones...
>
> I'm sure that the perm was totally violating the manifesto even at the
> time...
>
> And just to be fair, I have to point out that I happily watch movies  
> with
> Danny DeVito and Ron Perlman and think they're both great. But then  
> I'm
> not in the habit off shagging guys, that's my excuse at least.
>
> > I have a lot of time for Glenn Close a an actress, but I do find her
> > singularly unattractive. "Fatal Attraction", apart from being a  
> poorer
> > remake of the excellent "Play Misty For Me", failed on the very  
> basic
> > level
> > that GC was so unappealing. The tight perm didn't help. I'm sure the
> > argument could be made that FA was making the point that men are  
> so shit
> > that they'll ravish anything showing even the vaguest interest,  
> but that
> > doesn't really work as a thesis.
> >
> > Darren
> > Hungerford, UK
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net]
> > On
> > Behalf Of Brendan
> > Sent: 02 July 2009 1:53 PM
> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> > Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
> >
> > I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
> > ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Gathering mailing list
> > Gathering at misera.net
> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 11:19:21 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 16:19:21 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <33196012.1246544362256.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <33196012.1246544362256.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <C63B0C4C-FFF4-4FD5-9778-90E3CFAF7372@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

God, if no virtuoso could be musically bankrupt we'd all be raving  
about Dream Theater.

By musically bankrupt, I mean specifically that they have nothing  
inspirational to impart through their music. I regard Clapton,  
Knopfler, vai, Malmsteen &c. as having nothing to offer me. However,  
there are virtuosi who do; Fripp, Belew, Gill, Geordie and McGeogh  
spring immediately to mind.

In my view, being a consummate musician signifies precisely nothing  
other than you practice a lot. It's what you choose to do with your  
skills that counts.

Widdly fret-wankery doesn't impress me much, hence the fact that the  
only Eddie Van Halen guitar I possess is on a Thomas Dolby album.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 15:19, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:

> Steely Dan are many things, but muscially bankrupt? No way. I'd  
> rather listen to badgers bugger each other, but Steely Dan are  
> nothing if not consummate musicians. Boring, but certainly  
> accomplished.
>
>
>
> Alex in NYC
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: GREG SLAWSON
> Sent: Jul 2, 2009 1:08 AM
> To: gathering
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> But there's so much other "music" that fits into the bankrupt  
> category--ALL recent mainstream country, most 80s "new wave" top 40/ 
> New Romantic crap, 90s "alternative", ALL 70s arena rock, etc. etc.  
> The yatch rock bands mentioned below only scratch the surface...
> P.S. Pet peeve--so much "music" today is entirely electronically  
> produced--even ethnic stuff like Afro Pop, reggae and Punjabi  
> banghra music no longer uses musicians playing instruments, it's  
> just programmed. MJ was probably one of the first to start this  
> horrible trend--just listen to the awful electronic bass line that  
> opens "Thriller". Don't get me wrong--synthesizers can be a real  
> instrument, when used to sound like synths--a la Kraftwork, Devo,  
> Cab Voltaire, etc. But when musicians are replaced by electronics  
> just to save $ or for convenience, it not only is wrong but fucks up  
> the whole feeling of music. One minor positive development--some rap  
> groups have begun to use live backup bands instead of just samples  
> and programming. But as a whole actual musicians are being replaced  
> more and more by machines (starting to sound like an Isaac Asimov  
> story)...
>
> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:33:00 +1000
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, t 
> he Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.
>
> Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.   
> Fie.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering- 
> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
> Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> I would disagree.
> Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
> Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
> Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played  
> with MJ)
> Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is .
>
>
>
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
> From: countessghoulita at aol.com
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> I agree.
>
> Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also  
> add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
> http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> Michael Jackson....
>
> From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
> Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>   Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
> Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it  
> on your BlackBerry or iPhone.=
> _______________________________________________
>
>
>
> Gathering mailing list
>
>
>
> Gathering at misera.net
>
>
>
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>
>
>
> Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com.
>
> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>
> Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it  
> on your BlackBerry or iPhone.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From bq at soundgardener.co.nz  Thu Jul  2 11:54:49 2009
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz (Brendan)
Date: Fri, 3 Jul 2009 01:54:49 +1000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <17284185.1246543617591.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>

Truckload of Michael Jackson...coming right up.
 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6TJJ7amXV0
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6TJJ7amXV0&feature=channel>
&feature=channel
 

  _____  

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of Alex Smith
Sent: Friday, 3 July 2009 12:07 AM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



Michael Jackson made entirely vaccuous pop music devoid of any meaningful
message. Moreover, despite efforts to the contrary, it desperately tried on
occassion to rock, but failed miserably.

 

Kiss have no meaningful message either, other than hedonism and avarice.
That said, they rocked.

 

Rush are nothing if not entirely meaningful and rock mightily. You may not
like it, but you're free to treat your eardrums like urinals if you so
choose.

 

Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: Floren Luke 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 4:19 PM 
To: gathering at misera.net 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke 

I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
 
 
 

  _____  

To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add
Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music



-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Michael Jackson....


  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn more!

  _____  

Windows LiveT SkyDriveT: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your
BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________


Gathering mailing list


Gathering at misera.net


http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering





  _____  

Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place - Learn
<http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/> more! 

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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 12:09:44 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 09:09:44 -0700
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com> 
	<BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl> 
	<SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W21C9888E0B8ABC842A3E929D2F0@phx.gbl>


He could check out the new Sears' glass balcony :)



http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/us_sears_tower_ledge;_ylt=AmQSy9nlw7DlOPKw.PAHFstsaMYA


From: gregslawson at msn.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers



I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San Francisco and Boston!
 


_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage.
http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009
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From scotgothwitch at sky.com  Thu Jul  2 12:18:59 2009
From: scotgothwitch at sky.com (Pagan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 17:18:59 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <26750741.1246544131714.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <68672383611A41E1BC1623747F3B1071@armstrong>

Would agree with Alex on VIVIsectVI.  Try "The Singles Collect" and then you can decide from there any albums you'd like to investigate further.  Skinny Puppy can be a bit hit or miss at times i.e. Digital Brap (no doubt someone will disagree on that one).

Claire
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Alex Smith 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) ; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Cc: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 3:15 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Skinny Puppy: My faves are CLEASNE, FOLD & MANIPULATE, VIVIsectVI and RABIES. 



  Steely Dan -- I respect them, but christ don't make me listen to them. Pretentious crap.



  Alex in NYC




    -----Original Message----- 
    From: "Darren A. Peace" 
    Sent: Jul 2, 2009 7:37 AM 
    To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
    Cc: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke 


    Heh! Wondered who'd defend The Dan.


    I'll admit to a total irrationality so far as Steely Dan are concerned. My first exposure to them was at the hands of an utterly contemptible ass-wipe I used to work for. "Hey Darren," he'd say, doing a shitty little shoulder dance at unavoidable out-of-work social engagements. "Don't know how you can listen to that shit you call music when there's great stuff like this" - fondles Aja sleeve lewdly - "around. No, wait, I want to play you some Steve Miller Band next." Only point I managed to score was by calling them Fecker and Begin.


    So I've dismissed them on the basis that I can't listen to then without thinking of that twat (who was also prone to make ridiculous physical passes at my then-wife, but that's another story), who actually, in hindsight, rather resembled the host with the most in "Eating Raoul".


    Never mind. There are many bands of far greater consequence I should be spending my time on discovering.


    Speaking of which, I'm thinking I should give Skinny Puppy another try. Recommendations on where to start?


    Darren
    Hungerford, UK

    On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:33, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:


      Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
      Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
      To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


      Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, the Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.

       

      Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.  Fie.

       

      Darren

      Hungerford, UK

       

      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
      Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

       

      I would disagree.
      Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
      Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
      Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
      Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
       
       
       


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      To: gathering at misera.net
      Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
      From: countessghoulita at aol.com
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

      I agree.

      Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
      http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

       

       

      -----Original Message-----
      From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

      Michael Jackson....


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
      Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

       
        Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 

_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

 


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

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--------------------------------------------------------------------------

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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Thu Jul  2 12:26:43 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:26:43 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <4F83C8AA-A02B-4F58-B428-50BB9D96EEB3@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
References: <E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<4F83C8AA-A02B-4F58-B428-50BB9D96EEB3@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <8CBC94904E62ECF-8B0-70E@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>


 As far as Skinny Puppy are concerned, I love "Remission", "Bites" and "Rabies". Enjoy, Darren!


 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Cc: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2009 4:37 am
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke










Heh! Wondered who'd defend The Dan.




I'll admit to a total irrationality so far as Steely Dan are concerned. My first exposure to them was at the hands of an utterly contemptible ass-wipe I used to work for. "Hey Darren," he'd say, doing a shitty little shoulder dance at unavoidable out-of-work social engagements. "Don't know how you can listen to that shit you call music when there's great stuff like this" - fondles Aja sleeve lewdly - "around. No, wait, I want to play you some Steve Miller Band next." Only point I managed to score was by calling them Fecker and Begin.




So I've dismissed them on the basis that I can't listen to then without thinking of that twat (who was also prone to make ridiculous physical passes at my then-wife, but that's another story), who actually, in hindsight, rather resembled the host with the most in "Eating Raoul".




Never mind. There are many bands of far greater consequence I should be spending my time on discovering.




Speaking of which, I'm thinking I should give Skinny Puppy another try. Recommendations on 
where to start?




Darren

Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:33, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:









Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? 
Pfagh.







From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. 
Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
To: 'A list about 
all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of 
Killing Joke









Yacht 
rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, the Doobie 
Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.


?


Musically, 
spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.? 
Fie.


?


Darren


Hungerford, 
UK


?






From: 
gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf 
Of Floren Luke
Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
To: 
gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing 
Joke




?


I 
would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are 
influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ 
focus?on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) 
have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of 
Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is .?
?
?
?









To: 
gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: 
countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing 
Joke




I agree.

Among 
the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago=2
0and 
their abuse of Bauhaus 
t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





?





?



-----Original 
Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: 
gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] 
Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael 
Jackson....









From: 
fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 
+0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

?
? Who would you say 
that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?









View your Twitter 
and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!









Windows Live? 
SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or 
iPhone.= 




_______________________________________________





Gathering mailing list





Gathering at misera.net





http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering









?









Finding 
the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 




?









View your Twitter 
and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn 
more!






_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


=


 





_______________________________________________
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http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



 

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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Thu Jul  2 12:30:22 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:30:22 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl><BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl><8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
	<102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CBC9498790186D-8B0-750@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>


A friend of mine (a long-time punk) is in the video. I had to mute the sound right away, and resisted to the moment I saw the singer wearing that Bauhaus t-shirt..*growl*


 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 3:27 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch














Oh my god, where did you find this?


?


(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)



?


... ... ... ... ... ... 



[looking at the current?state of things..]


?


'Save me...


? save me?from Tomorrow..


??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 


?













From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music









-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke





Michael Jackson....





From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] An
tithesis of Killing Joke



?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?





View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!




Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 



_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering










Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 








      
 





_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Thu Jul  2 12:31:49 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 12:31:49 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net><BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <8CBC949BBF7D2B0-8B0-76A@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>


 


 I like the pre-"Dare" Human League. "The Dignity of Labour" is inspired by Kraftwerk, I like it quite a lot.


 

-----Original Message-----
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 4:51 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch














> ...Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?



A few: their first "D.D.", Rio, and some other one I forget, plus? some of their more current singles. 


Next (just now in fact)?I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar vintage?Visage 


to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv nation,?covenant,?etc.)


?


?



?


... ... ... ... ... ... 



[looking at the current?state of things..]


?


'Save me...


? save me?from Tomorrow..


??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 


?













From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:18:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
?
? So he was. How did you know this, ?Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
?
?
?
?
?




Date: Wed, 
1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
?
Alex in NYC





-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 










Oh my god, where did you find this?


?


(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)



?


... ... ... ... ... ... 



[looking at the current?state of things..]


?


'Save me...


? save me?from Tomorrow..


??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 


?













From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music









-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke





Michael Jackson....





From: fluke1 at live.
co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?





View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!




Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 



_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering










Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 










View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! 







      
 





_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



 

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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Thu Jul  2 12:52:35 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 17:52:35 +0100
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W21C9888E0B8ABC842A3E929D2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl>
	<SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W21C9888E0B8ABC842A3E929D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <028701c9fb35$8025f720$8071e560$@com>

Good God. I did something similar in San Francisco, and nearly barfed on
both my espadrilles and those of my companions.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK 

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On
Behalf Of folk devil
Sent: 02 July 2009 5:10 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

 

He could check out the new Sears' glass balcony :)
 A general view of cars driving on Wacker Drive is seen through ...
<http://d.yimg.com/a/p/rids/20090701/i/r3800073608.jpg?x=400&y=240&q=85&sig=
gVOuutUft8hM.YEp.X2F0Q--> 
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/us_sears_tower_ledge;_ylt=AmQSy9nlw7DlOPKw
.PAHFstsaMYA

  _____  

From: gregslawson at msn.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San
Francisco and Boston!
 

  _____  

 

  _____  

Windows LiveT SkyDriveT: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your
BlackBerry or iPhone.
<http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009> 

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From scotgothwitch at sky.com  Thu Jul  2 12:51:12 2009
From: scotgothwitch at sky.com (Pagan)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 17:51:12 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net><BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <4B93AE37F2F944579621F23D606BAE8C@armstrong>

>Next (just now in fact) I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar >vintage Visage to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv >nation, covenant, etc.)

I'd be interested to hear those mixes.

Claire
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: sade1 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 12:51 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch


  > ...Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?

  A few: their first "D.D.", Rio, and some other one I forget, plus  some of their more current singles. 
  Next (just now in fact) I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar vintage Visage 
  to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv nation, covenant, etc.)



   
  ... ... ... ... ... ... 

  [looking at the current state of things..]

  'Save me...
    save me from Tomorrow..
      I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:18:17 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

   
  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
   
    So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
  Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
  Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
   
   
   
   
   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
  From: vassifer at earthlink.net
  To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

  I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
   
  Alex in NYC




    -----Original Message----- 
    From: sade1 
    Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
    To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 


    Oh my god, where did you find this?

    (someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

     
    ... ... ... ... ... ... 

    [looking at the current state of things..]

    'Save me...
      save me from Tomorrow..
        I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    I agree.

    Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





    -----Original Message-----
    From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    Michael Jackson....


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
    Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

     
      Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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------------------------------------------------------------------------------


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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 13:05:44 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:05:44 -0700
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com><BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl><SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl><BAY125-W21C9888E0B8ABC842A3E929D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<028701c9fb35$8025f720$8071e560$@com>
Message-ID: <F5453616760B40429ADD5E120FFF6BED@edweil>

Whoa ... guess I missed that one. 


k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Darren A. Peace 
  To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 9:52 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


  Good God. I did something similar in San Francisco, and nearly barfed on both my espadrilles and those of my companions.

   

  Darren

  Hungerford, UK 

   

  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of folk devil
  Sent: 02 July 2009 5:10 PM
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

   

  He could check out the new Sears' glass balcony :)

  http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/us_sears_tower_ledge;_ylt=AmQSy9nlw7DlOPKw.PAHFstsaMYA


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

  From: gregslawson at msn.com
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
  Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

  I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San Francisco and Boston!
   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   


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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 13:16:09 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:16:09 -0700
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <028701c9fb35$8025f720$8071e560$@com>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl>
	<481435.9693.qm@web33002.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
	<BAY132-W5FF56A3F2704A94B15A73902E0@phx.gbl>
	<SNT109-W45A7256CC1AA0C0D5D62AAA92E0@phx.gbl>
	<BAY125-W21C9888E0B8ABC842A3E929D2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<028701c9fb35$8025f720$8071e560$@com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W18F58D9C5C5FBC585600509D2F0@phx.gbl>


It's because you know it's man made..trust issues..

 

Where in SF?
 


From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 17:52:35 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers







Good God. I did something similar in San Francisco, and nearly barfed on both my espadrilles and those of my companions.
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK 
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of folk devil
Sent: 02 July 2009 5:10 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
 
He could check out the new Sears' glass balcony :)

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap_travel/us_sears_tower_ledge;_ylt=AmQSy9nlw7DlOPKw.PAHFstsaMYA



From: gregslawson at msn.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:22:55 -0400
Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

I'd cut the Chicago trip to 3 or 4 days and make sure to get to San Francisco and Boston!
 



 



Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.
_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. 
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009
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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 13:17:23 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:17:23 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <8CBC949BBF7D2B0-8B0-76A@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net><BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> 
	<8CBC949BBF7D2B0-8B0-76A@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W20425A4794E03CF08CFAFC9D2F0@phx.gbl>


Reproduction and Travelogue are great albums! :D
 


To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:31:49 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch




I like the pre-"Dare" Human League. "The Dignity of Labour" is inspired by Kraftwerk, I like it quite a lot.


-----Original Message-----
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 4:51 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch







> ...Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?

A few: their first "D.D.", Rio, and some other one I forget, plus  some of their more current singles. 
Next (just now in fact) I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar vintage Visage 
to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv nation, covenant, etc.)
 
 

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:18:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
 
  So he was. How did you know this,  Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
 
 
 
 
 


Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
 
Alex in NYC




-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 






Oh my god, where did you find this?
 
(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 






From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoul ita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music




-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke




Michael Jackson....



From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing=2 0Joke



 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?



View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!


Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________



Gathering mailing list



Gathering at misera.net



http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering







Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 



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_______________________________________________

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Gathering at misera.net

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Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 
_________________________________________________________________
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From countessghoulita at aol.com  Thu Jul  2 13:25:56 2009
From: countessghoulita at aol.com (countessghoulita at aol.com)
Date: Thu, 02 Jul 2009 13:25:56 -0400
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <BAY125-W20425A4794E03CF08CFAFC9D2F0@phx.gbl>
References: <25899323.1246488707933.JavaMail.root@mswamui-thinleaf.atl.sa.earthlink.net><BLU112-W15B856CCB78F75AFCA6E6FBE2E0@phx.gbl><9025.94119.qm@web110205.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<8CBC949BBF7D2B0-8B0-76A@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY125-W20425A4794E03CF08CFAFC9D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <8CBC9514B433A5A-8B0-AFA@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>


 They are, indeed :)


 


 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Thu, Jul 2, 2009 10:17 am
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch













Reproduction and Travelogue are great albums! :D
?




To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:31:49 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch







I like the pre-"Dare" Human League. "The Dignity of Labour" is inspired by Kraftwerk, I like it quite a lot.





-----Original Message-----
From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 4:51 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch












> ...Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?



A few: their first "D.D.", Rio, and some other one I forget, plus? some of their more current singles. 


Next (just now in fact)?I'm raiding the Human League pre-'80 archives, and some similar vintage?Visage 


to mix with some current sacrilegious stuff (fwiw: projekt pitchfork, vnv nation,?covenant,?etc.)


?


?



?


... ... ... ... ... ... 



[looking at the current?state of things..]


?


'Save me...


? save me?from Tomorrow..


??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 


?














From: Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 4:18:17 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xteqZMheSeU
?
? So he was. How did you know this, ?Alex?
Someone dreamt of doing the Moonwalk, Alex is a NKOTB Fan.
Anyone want to confess to buying a Duran Duran album ?
?
?
?
?
?




Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:51:47 -0400
From: vassifer at earthlink.net
To: gathering at misera.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch



I'm sure it was their stylist's idea. One of the New Kids on the Block also wears one in the video for "The Right Stuff."
?
Alex in NYC





-----Original Message----- 
From: sade1 
Sent: Jul 1, 2009 6:27 PM 
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch 










Oh my god, where did you find this?


?


(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)



?


... ... ... ... ... ... 



[looking at the current?state of things..]


?


'Save me...


? save me?from Tomorrow..


??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 


?













From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoul ita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj]
 Antithesis of Killing Joke



I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music









-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke





Michael Jackson....





From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing=2 0Joke



?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?





View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!




Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 



_______________________________________________



Gathering mailing list



Gathering at misera.net



http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering












Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 










View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! 







_______________________________________________

Gathering mailing list

Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering










Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 



Lauren found her dream laptop.  Find the PC that?s right for you.=


 





_____________
__________________________________
Gathering mailing list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



 

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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 13:28:56 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:28:56 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl><BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl><8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com><102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<8CBC9498790186D-8B0-750@webmail-db04.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <EE5F426054FF4384B5710715849B1EAB@edweil>

No words can even describe this atrocity ... really. 

k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: countessghoulita at aol.com 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 9:30 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch


  A friend of mine (a long-time punk) is in the video. I had to mute the sound right away, and resisted to the moment I saw the singer wearing that Bauhaus t-shirt..*growl*





  -----Original Message-----
  From: sade1 <saulomar1 at yahoo.com>
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 3:27 pm
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch


  Oh my god, where did you find this?

  (someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)

   
  ... ... ... ... ... ... 

  [looking at the current state of things..]

  'Save me...
    save me from Tomorrow..
      I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  I agree.

  Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
  http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





  -----Original Message-----
  From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotm ail.com>
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Michael Jackson....


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
  Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

   
    Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= < /div> 
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Gathering at misera.net

http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



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0A


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com. 


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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 13:37:58 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com>
	<E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

> ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are replaced...?just to save $ or 
> for convenience,?it..fucks up the whole?feeling of music. 

That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is?that they brought in the electronic 
element beautifully without compromising the human element.?All this machinery 
making modern?music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly charted, it's really 
just a question of your honesty.(Rush quote)


couldn't resist that last part. =)


... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: GREG SLAWSON <gregslawson at msn.com>
To: gathering <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 10:08:29 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

But?there's so much other "music" that?fits into the bankrupt category--ALL recent mainstream country, most 80s "new wave" top 40/New Romantic crap,?90s "alternative", ALL 70s arena rock, etc. etc. The yatch rock bands mentioned below only?scratch the surface...
P.S. Pet peeve--so much "music"?today is entirely electronically produced--even ethnic stuff like Afro Pop, reggae?and Punjabi banghra music no?longer uses musicians playing instruments, it's just programmed. MJ was?probably one?of the first to start this horrible trend--just listen to the awful electronic bass line?that opens "Thriller". Don't get me wrong--synthesizers can be a real instrument, when used to sound like synths--a la Kraftwork, Devo, Cab Voltaire, etc. But when musicians are replaced by electronics?just to save $ or for convenience,?it?not only is wrong but fucks up the whole?feeling of music. One minor positive development--some rap groups have begun to use live backup bands instead of just?samples and programming. But as a?whole actual musicians are being replaced more and?more by machines (starting to?sound like an Isaac Asimov story)...
?
________________________________
From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:33:00 +1000
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.


________________________________
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, the Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.
?
Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.? Fie.
?
Darren
Hungerford, UK
?
From:gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
?
I would disagree.
Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
Both KJ and MJ focus?on environmental issues in their lyrics
Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is .?
?
?
?

________________________________

To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
From: countessghoulita at aol.com
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music
?
?
-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
Michael Jackson....

________________________________

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

?
? Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

________________________________

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!

________________________________

Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone.= 
_______________________________________________




Gathering mailing list




Gathering at misera.net




http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering




?

________________________________

Finding the best videos just got easier. Try the NEW Truveo.com.
?

________________________________

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
________________________________
Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone. 


      
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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 13:52:04 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:52:04 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com>
	<E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>
	<SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl> 
	<983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W2956E34B36E5ECF1B77ACB9D2F0@phx.gbl>


It's like that stupid phrase 'drum machines have no soul'. Nor do drums!

You don't need a drummer, you only need a soul :P
 


Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke






> ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are replaced... just to save $ or 
> for convenience, it..fucks up the whole feeling of music. 
 
That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is that they brought in the electronic 
element beautifully without compromising the human element. All this machinery 
making modern music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly charted, it's really 
just a question of your honesty. (Rush quote)
 
 
couldn't resist that last part. =)
 
 
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current state of things..]
 
'Save me...
  save me from Tomorrow..
    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   
 



 
_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 13:56:11 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:56:11 -0700
Subject: [kj] Movieland
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au>	<DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk>	<41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk><52817.203.185.215.144.1246539188.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<021e01c9fb16$85258250$8f7086f0$@com>
Message-ID: <4537B1FEA0F14C1280278DE8D7E9A146@edweil>

Interesting point on the movie, which I never cared for -- and found to be 
debasing to both genders (yes, I know what some of you will say:  "it's only 
a movie," etc. -- but this film was a huge hit in the States, stirring a lot 
of debate at the time, but it really added nothing to America's already 
twisted sexual pollitics landscape. The whole thing just grated on my 
nerves).
To be fair, Close didn't rise to the top of her field based on looks --  
which I always found refreshing.. I think she's been great in a lot of 
films.
And that's my 3 cents here, as the holiday weekend looms. Back to copy 
editing.

Cheers,

KW
the States
(or former Colonies, for my U.K. Gathering friends)




----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Darren A. Peace" <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: "'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 6:10 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


>I have a lot of time for Glenn Close a an actress, but I do find her
> singularly unattractive. "Fatal Attraction", apart from being a poorer
> remake of the excellent "Play Misty For Me", failed on the very basic 
> level
> that GC was so unappealing. The tight perm didn't help. I'm sure the
> argument could be made that FA was making the point that men are so shit
> that they'll ravish anything showing even the vaguest interest, but that
> doesn't really work as a thesis.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] 
> On
> Behalf Of Brendan
> Sent: 02 July 2009 1:53 PM
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
> I'm talking UGLY. I'd give Glen Close a run for her money. (She'd
> ultimately win, heading me off in the swimsuit round).
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 


From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 13:57:27 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:57:27 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com><E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>
	<983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY125-W2956E34B36E5ECF1B77ACB9D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>

I like drumming -- and having a soul. ; ) 

Smile, 

KW
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: folk devil 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 10:52 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  It's like that stupid phrase 'drum machines have no soul'. Nor do drums!
  You don't need a drummer, you only need a soul :P
   

------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700
  From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  > ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are replaced... just to save $ or 
  > for convenience, it..fucks up the whole feeling of music. 

  That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is that they brought in the electronic 
  element beautifully without compromising the human element. All this machinery 
  making modern music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly charted, it's really 
  just a question of your honesty. (Rush quote)


  couldn't resist that last part. =)


  ... ... ... ... ... ... 

  [looking at the current state of things..]

  'Save me...
    save me from Tomorrow..
      I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   




   


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 


------------------------------------------------------------------------------


  _______________________________________________
  Gathering mailing list
  Gathering at misera.net
  http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:01:39 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:01:39 -0700
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk><41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <AB0FC605865C43E88C0ADDEE8B16A060@edweil>

Beats "Pollyana," no?  ; )

k.w.
SoCal
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Darren A. Peace" <dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Cc: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 5:37 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


> Nice try, but you'll always be Brenda to me.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> On 2 Jul 2009, at 13:06, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>
>> I've never been called truculent before *beams*
>>
>> Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats 
>> Brenda
>> tho)
>>
>>> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity on  your
>>> part.
>>>
>>> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
>>> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
>>> object.
>>>
>>> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little distasteful,
>>> though.
>>>
>>> Darren
>>> Hungerford, UK
>>>
>>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>>>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>>>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>>>
>>>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>>>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>>>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>>>
>>>> Heh!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Haven???t kept up enough to take sides, and that???s not  really my
>>>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of one
>>>> thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>>>
>>>>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 


From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 14:10:06 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 19:10:06 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com><E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>
	<983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY125-W2956E34B36E5ECF1B77ACB9D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>
Message-ID: <55C43F47-5AB5-429A-A8D1-728F1197FFAF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

I also like drumming. However, a cornerstone album for me is John  
Foxx's Metamatic, which ranks among the most instrumentally sterile I  
own. Deeply majestic.

I am pleased he's reverted to performing it as "Underpass". He told me  
it was changed to "Overpass" live for years because he was fed up of  
people shouting out "Underpants" during the chorus. Oops.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 18:57, "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com> wrote:

> I like drumming -- and having a soul. ; )
>
> Smile,
>
> KW
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: folk devil
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 10:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> It's like that stupid phrase 'drum machines have no soul'. Nor do  
> drums!
> You don't need a drummer, you only need a soul :P
>
> Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700
> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
> To: gathering at misera.net
> Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
> > ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are  
> replaced... just to save $ or
> > for convenience, it..fucks up the whole feeling of music.
>
> That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is that they brought in  
> the electronic
> element beautifully without compromising the human element. All this  
> machinery
> making modern music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly  
> charted, it's really
> just a question of your honesty. (Rush quote)
>
>
> couldn't resist that last part. =)
>
>
> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>
> [looking at the current state of things..]
>
> 'Save me...
>   save me from Tomorrow..
>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>
>
>
>
>
> Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:10:42 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:10:42 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <33196012.1246544362256.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<C63B0C4C-FFF4-4FD5-9778-90E3CFAF7372@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <8AE95C93B9D544F791AD6E3057CD19F1@edweil>

Oh, but didn't you hear? "Clapton is God."  ; ) 


kw
USA
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Darren A. Peace 
  To: Alex Smith ; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Cc: gathering 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 8:19 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  God, if no virtuoso could be musically bankrupt we'd all be raving about Dream Theater.


  By musically bankrupt, I mean specifically that they have nothing inspirational to impart through their music. I regard Clapton, Knopfler, vai, Malmsteen &c. as having nothing to offer me. However, there are virtuosi who do; Fripp, Belew, Gill, Geordie and McGeogh spring immediately to mind.


  In my view, being a consummate musician signifies precisely nothing other than you practice a lot. It's what you choose to do with your skills that counts.


  Widdly fret-wankery doesn't impress me much, hence the fact that the only Eddie Van Halen guitar I possess is on a Thomas Dolby album.


  Darren
  Hungerford, UK

  On 2 Jul 2009, at 15:19, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:


    Steely Dan are many things, but muscially bankrupt? No way. I'd rather listen to badgers bugger each other, but Steely Dan are nothing if not consummate musicians. Boring, but certainly accomplished.



    Alex in NYC




      -----Original Message----- 
      From: GREG SLAWSON 
      Sent: Jul 2, 2009 1:08 AM 
      To: gathering 
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke 

      But there's so much other "music" that fits into the bankrupt category--ALL recent mainstream country, most 80s "new wave" top 40/New Romantic crap, 90s "alternative", ALL 70s arena rock, etc. etc. The yatch rock bands mentioned below only scratch the surface...
      P.S. Pet peeve--so much "music" today is entirely electronically produced--even ethnic stuff like Afro Pop, reggae and Punjabi banghra music no longer uses musicians playing instruments, it's just programmed. MJ was probably one of the first to start this horrible trend--just listen to the awful electronic bass line that opens "Thriller". Don't get me wrong--synthesizers can be a real instrument, when used to sound like synths--a la Kraftwork, Devo, Cab Voltaire, etc. But when musicians are replaced by electronics just to save $ or for convenience, it not only is wrong but fucks up the whole feeling of music. One minor positive development--some rap groups have begun to use live backup bands instead of just samples and programming. But as a whole actual musicians are being replaced more and more by machines (starting to sound like an Isaac Asimov story)...
       

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:33:00 +1000
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


      Steely Dan?! Musically bankrupt? Pfagh.



--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
      Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 6:36 AM
      To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


      Yacht rock bands. Chicago are clearly monstrous, but I?d add Toto, the Doobie Brothers, Steely Dan, Kenny Loggins, Air Supply et al.



      Musically, spiritually and emotionally bankrupt, the lot of them.  Fie.



      Darren

      Hungerford, UK



      From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Floren Luke
      Sent: 01 July 2009 9:20 PM
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke



      I would disagree.
      Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
      Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
      Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
      Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
       
       
       


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      To: gathering at misera.net
      Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
      From: countessghoulita at aol.com
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

      I agree.

      Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
      http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





      -----Original Message-----
      From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

      Michael Jackson....


--------------------------------------------------------------------------

      From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
      Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

       
        Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


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From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 14:11:00 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 19:11:00 +0100
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
In-Reply-To: <AB0FC605865C43E88C0ADDEE8B16A060@edweil>
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk><41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<AB0FC605865C43E88C0ADDEE8B16A060@edweil>
Message-ID: <E9B5E485-DB35-4805-BB65-7AA7B594CBBB@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

That video should be banned.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 19:01, "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com> wrote:

> Beats "Pollyana," no?  ; )
>
> k.w.
> SoCal
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren A. Peace" <dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk 
> >
> To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net 
> >
> Cc: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net 
> >
> Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 5:37 AM
> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>
>
>> Nice try, but you'll always be Brenda to me.
>>
>> Darren
>> Hungerford, UK
>>
>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 13:06, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>
>>> I've never been called truculent before *beams*
>>>
>>> Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats  
>>> Brenda
>>> tho)
>>>
>>>> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity  
>>>> on  your
>>>> part.
>>>>
>>>> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
>>>> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
>>>> object.
>>>>
>>>> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little  
>>>> distasteful,
>>>> though.
>>>>
>>>> Darren
>>>> Hungerford, UK
>>>>
>>>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>>>>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>>>>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>>>>
>>>>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>>>>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>>>>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>>>>
>>>>> Heh!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Haven???t kept up enough to take sides, and that???s  
>>>>> not  really my
>>>>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of  
>>>>> one
>>>>> thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 14:14:55 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:14:55 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com><E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl>
	<983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<BAY125-W2956E34B36E5ECF1B77ACB9D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>
Message-ID: <17564.96505.qm@web110215.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

> I like drumming -- and having a soul. ; ) 


Yeah, "Warrior" Soul.? 
Hmm, what's the tie-in? ;)

?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Karen Weil <karen.weil at sddt.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 10:57:27 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


I like drumming -- and having a soul. ; ) 
?
Smile, 
?
KW
----- Original Message ----- 
>From: folk devil 
>To: gathering at misera.net 
>Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 10:52 AM
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>It's like that stupid phrase 'drum machines have no soul'. Nor do drums!
>You don't need a drummer, you only need a soul :P
>?
>________________________________
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700
>From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
>To: gathering at misera.net
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>> ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are replaced...?just to save $ or 
>> for convenience,?it..fucks up the whole?feeling of music. 
>
>That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is?that they brought in the electronic 
>element beautifully without compromising the human element.?All this machinery 
>making modern?music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly charted, it's really 
>just a question of your honesty.(Rush quote)
>
>
>couldn't resist that last part. =)
>
>
>... ... ... ... ... ... 
>
>[looking at the current?state of things..]
>?
>'Save me...
>? save me?from Tomorrow..
>??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 
>
>
>
>
>?
>________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you. 
________________________________
_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>


      
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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 14:16:03 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:16:03 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
In-Reply-To: <ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl>
	<BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl>
	<16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl>
	<39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz>
	<8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com>
	<BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com>
	<BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl>
	<ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com>
	<ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <294122.33345.qm@web110212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

> burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the Israelites drink it.

Hence golden showers?
?
?

?
... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 3:50:48 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

exodus 32:19... 

and lo . . .




?19?When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing, his anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking them to pieces at the foot of the mountain.?20?And he took the calf they had made and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the Israelites drink it.


"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."



On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com> wrote:

you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i mean moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the golden calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...? 
>
>
>
>"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."
>
>
>
>On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:
>
>?
>>Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
>>?
>>?
>>?
>>________________________________
From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
>>Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
>>To: gathering at misera.net
>>Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit 
>>
>>
>>you have a goat? thats very old testament! 
>>
>>
>>=)
>>
>>
>>why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's?? its a strange one...
>>will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>"due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:
>>
>>spot on jamie 
>>>but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek 
>>>i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . .?
>>
________________________________
Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
>>Gathering at misera.net
>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>>
>



      
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:21:24 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:21:24 -0700
Subject: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
References: <E1MME5J-0003d9-3Y@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><DC5201D6-9641-4D99-B32B-8165DB9CA434@suspiria.demon.co.uk><41622.203.185.215.144.1246536406.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz><4B988F05-333F-48DE-BBC0-923D260660BF@suspiria.demon.co.uk><AB0FC605865C43E88C0ADDEE8B16A060@edweil>
	<E9B5E485-DB35-4805-BB65-7AA7B594CBBB@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <3B977EDB6936409DB29D9FE44E571A65@edweil>

Heh. I think it has been in my home state. ; )

k.w.
the States

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Darren A. Peace" <dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Cc: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion


> That video should be banned.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> On 2 Jul 2009, at 19:01, "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com> wrote:
>
>> Beats "Pollyana," no?  ; )
>>
>> k.w.
>> SoCal
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Darren A. Peace" 
>> <dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>> >
>> To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>> <gathering at misera.net
>> >
>> Cc: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>> <gathering at misera.net
>> >
>> Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 5:37 AM
>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>
>>
>>> Nice try, but you'll always be Brenda to me.
>>>
>>> Darren
>>> Hungerford, UK
>>>
>>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 13:06, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've never been called truculent before *beams*
>>>>
>>>> Thank you Dazza. (I'm officially Brendo in Aussie it seems...beats 
>>>> Brenda
>>>> tho)
>>>>
>>>>> No, the fault in understanding was mine, rather than ambiguity  on 
>>>>> your
>>>>> part.
>>>>>
>>>>> Personally, I think you're both being truculent now, but I often
>>>>> wonder what happens when an irresistable force meets an immovable
>>>>> object.
>>>>>
>>>>> The tribal Lord Of The Flies thing going on is a little  distasteful,
>>>>> though.
>>>>>
>>>>> Darren
>>>>> Hungerford, UK
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2 Jul 2009, at 05:39, "Brendan" <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Comes down to this. "An element of doubt" does not equal "beyond
>>>>>> reasonable doubt"...that's my point. Happy to admit I'm wrong if I
>>>>>> actually am (gasp), but I don't see it that way.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-
>>>>>> bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Darren A. Peace
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, 2 July 2009 11:38 AM
>>>>>> To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)'
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT - MJ Conclusion
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Heh!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Haven???t kept up enough to take sides, and that???s  not  really my
>>>>>> style anyway. I was merely trying to clarify my understanding of  one
>>>>>> thing Brenda said. Not tremendously effectively, as it turns out.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 


From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:22:23 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:22:23 -0700
Subject: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit
References: <BAY132-W19DC135D44B0D2AB6CC32190310@phx.gbl><BAY132-W24073A42CF470BDD64216B902E0@phx.gbl><16413.203.185.215.144.1246448849.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz><BAY132-W3F43A1C456A1FD1F5FB42902E0@phx.gbl><39365.203.185.215.144.1246455155.squirrel@mail.orcon.net.nz><8CBC8779628764D-13DC-20D5@webmail-me13.sysops.aol.com><BAY132-W20C4C230CFCEE32370FA1E902E0@phx.gbl><ce16091e0907011330o25b9967cyde74e18569695744@mail.gmail.com><BLU112-W2619BE55722DCA01CEC8FEBE2E0@phx.gbl><ce16091e0907011406v4d16effrdf6beb21a8eea76a@mail.gmail.com><ce16091e0907020350j7cbbe1aaicb3f34b31763e2e2@mail.gmail.com>
	<294122.33345.qm@web110212.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <E0E15C7EDD4B4EB580F53E157CC24A6B@edweil>

Umm... am I back in my Methodist Church's Bible study?  ; ) 
If so, I'm in  a lot of trouble.

Cheers,

kw

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: sade1 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 11:16 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit


  > burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the Israelites drink it.

  Hence golden showers?



   
  ... ... ... ... ... ... 

  [looking at the current state of things..]

  'Save me...
    save me from Tomorrow..
      I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com>
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 3:50:48 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit

  exodus 32:19... 


  and lo . . .






   19 When Moses approached the camp and saw the calf and the dancing, his anger burned and he threw the tablets out of his hands, breaking them to pieces at the foot of the mountain. 20 And he took the calf they had made and burned it in the fire; then he ground it to powder, scattered it on the water and made the Israelites drink it.


  "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."



  On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 9:06 AM, bongo <humanhybrid666 at gmail.com> wrote:

    you just wait... i'll find it... (going to work now, but if you want to look for yourself, i think its in exodus... or its when charlton, i mean moses, comes back down the mountain and see's them worshipping the golden calf... just after he orders it to be melted down and INJESTED...  



    "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."



    On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 8:48 AM, Floren Luke <fluke1 at live.co.uk> wrote:


      Johny: If the Cops ever discover those marijuana plants growing on the land adjacent to your house..................you had better hope that Brendan isnt sitting on the Jury
       
       
       

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.com
      Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 08:30:20 +1200
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Subject: Re: [kj] OT: the bible and dishing out shit 


      you have a goat? thats very old testament! 


      =)


      why do you think moses had those dudes EAT the golden calf? any idea's?? its a strange one...
      will provide chapter and verse after work if i can be bothered looking..








      "due to a lack of trained trumpeters, the end of the world has been postponed indefinitely..."







      On Thu, Jul 2, 2009 at 4:33 AM, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:

        spot on jamie 
        but we are quite rightly encouraged to turn the other cheek 
        i am far from perfect and if someone gets my goat i WILL retaliate . . . 



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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Thu Jul  2 14:46:21 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 19:46:21 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <68672383611A41E1BC1623747F3B1071@armstrong>
References: <26750741.1246544131714.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<68672383611A41E1BC1623747F3B1071@armstrong>
Message-ID: <02f201c9fb45$64b4de60$2e1e9b20$@com>

Thanks all. Homework in place.

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Pagan
Sent: 02 July 2009 5:19 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

Would agree with Alex on VIVIsectVI.  Try "The Singles Collect" and then you can decide from there any albums you'd like to investigate further.  Skinny Puppy can be a bit hit or miss at times i.e. Digital Brap (no doubt someone will disagree on that one).

 

Claire

----- Original Message ----- 

From: Alex Smith <mailto:vassifer at earthlink.net>  

To: A <mailto:gathering at misera.net>  list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) ; A list about <mailto:gathering at misera.net>  all things Killing Joke (the band!) 

Cc: A <mailto:gathering at misera.net>  list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 

Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 3:15 PM

Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

Skinny Puppy: My faves are CLEASNE, FOLD & MANIPULATE, VIVIsectVI and RABIES. 

 

Steely Dan -- I respect them, but christ don't make me listen to them. Pretentious crap.

 

Alex in NYC



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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:48:16 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:48:16 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <007601c9fa8b$9cdf2e40$d69d8ac0$@com><E1MMDyp-00038Q-08@smtp.po.exetel.com.au><SNT109-W452C997B8F3C51952CCA74A92F0@phx.gbl><983593.94009.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY125-W2956E34B36E5ECF1B77ACB9D2F0@phx.gbl><1927F87AE2124199AF387885CE6D257C@edweil>
	<55C43F47-5AB5-429A-A8D1-728F1197FFAF@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <4F35F31F1DE04109B23D7366B7B44103@edweil>

I'm listening to some of his demo music. Very, very moody. Would be great in a horror film, I think.

k.w. 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Darren A. Peace 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Cc: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 11:10 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  I also like drumming. However, a cornerstone album for me is John Foxx's Metamatic, which ranks among the most instrumentally sterile I own. Deeply majestic.


  I am pleased he's reverted to performing it as "Underpass". He told me it was changed to "Overpass" live for years because he was fed up of people shouting out "Underpants" during the chorus. Oops.


  Darren
  Hungerford, UK

  On 2 Jul 2009, at 18:57, "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com> wrote:


    I like drumming -- and having a soul. ; ) 

    Smile, 

    KW
      ----- Original Message ----- 
      From: folk devil 
      To: gathering at misera.net 
      Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 10:52 AM
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


      It's like that stupid phrase 'drum machines have no soul'. Nor do drums!
      You don't need a drummer, you only need a soul :P
       

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
      Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 10:37:58 -0700
      From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
      To: gathering at misera.net
      Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


      > ...synthesizers can be a real instrument...but when musicians are replaced... just to save $ or 
      > for convenience, it..fucks up the whole feeling of music. 

      That's one thing I like about earlier Rush, is that they brought in the electronic 
      element beautifully without compromising the human element. All this machinery 
      making modern music can still be open-hearted. Not so coldly charted, it's really 
      just a question of your honesty. (Rush quote)


      couldn't resist that last part. =)


      ... ... ... ... ... ... 

      [looking at the current state of things..]

      'Save me...
        save me from Tomorrow..
          I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   




       


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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Thu Jul  2 14:48:06 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 19:48:06 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <8AE95C93B9D544F791AD6E3057CD19F1@edweil>
References: <33196012.1246544362256.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>	<C63B0C4C-FFF4-4FD5-9778-90E3CFAF7372@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<8AE95C93B9D544F791AD6E3057CD19F1@edweil>
Message-ID: <02f701c9fb45$a3cc24f0$eb646ed0$@com>

Well, if he is, I am even happier declaring myself a militant atheist. God with a neatly-clipped beard. Does that make Kenny Loggins a blasphemy? Oh, wait...

 

Darren

Hungerford, UK

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Karen Weil
Sent: 02 July 2009 7:11 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 

Oh, but didn't you hear? "Clapton is God."  ; ) 

 

 

kw

USA

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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:49:11 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:49:11 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>
Message-ID: <C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil>

Oh, gee -- thanks ...

k.w.
the States 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Brendan 
  To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 8:54 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Truckload of Michael Jackson...coming right up.

  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6TJJ7amXV0&feature=channel




------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Alex Smith
  Sent: Friday, 3 July 2009 12:07 AM
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); gathering at misera.net
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Michael Jackson made entirely vaccuous pop music devoid of any meaningful message. Moreover, despite efforts to the contrary, it desperately tried on occassion to rock, but failed miserably.



  Kiss have no meaningful message either, other than hedonism and avarice. That said, they rocked.



  Rush are nothing if not entirely meaningful and rock mightily. You may not like it, but you're free to treat your eardrums like urinals if you so choose.



  Alex in NYC




    -----Original Message----- 
    From: Floren Luke 
    Sent: Jul 1, 2009 4:19 PM 
    To: gathering at misera.net 
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke 

    I would disagree.
    Both KJ and MJ are influenced by dance music
    Both KJ and MJ focus on environmental issues in their lyrics
    Both KJ and MJ (sometimes) have grinding guitars (Slash has played with MJ)
    Kiss/Rush are moreso of Killing jokes antitheses, moreso then MJ is . 
     
     
     

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 15:19:09 -0400
    From: countessghoulita at aol.com
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    I agree.

    Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
    http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music





    -----Original Message-----
    From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    Michael Jackson....


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
    Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

     
      Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?


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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 14:50:09 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:50:09 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
References: <33196012.1246544362256.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>	<C63B0C4C-FFF4-4FD5-9778-90E3CFAF7372@suspiria.demon.co.uk><8AE95C93B9D544F791AD6E3057CD19F1@edweil>
	<02f701c9fb45$a3cc24f0$eb646ed0$@com>
Message-ID: <D1561DAA799847E09C6C0FAD09DF54B5@edweil>

No, Kenny Loggins' music is an  abomination. 
See you at the athiest's meeting.  ; ) 

k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Darren A. Peace 
  To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 11:48 AM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


  Well, if he is, I am even happier declaring myself a militant atheist. God with a neatly-clipped beard. Does that make Kenny Loggins a blasphemy? Oh, wait...

   

  Darren

  Hungerford, UK

   

  From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Karen Weil
  Sent: 02 July 2009 7:11 PM
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
  Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

   

  Oh, but didn't you hear? "Clapton is God."  ; ) 

   

   

  kw

  USA



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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 15:03:01 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:03:01 -0700
Subject: [kj] Skinny Puppy
In-Reply-To: <02f201c9fb45$64b4de60$2e1e9b20$@com>
References: <26750741.1246544131714.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<68672383611A41E1BC1623747F3B1071@armstrong> 
	<02f201c9fb45$64b4de60$2e1e9b20$@com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W25F8CC22E6EB54F3CF3D159D2F0@phx.gbl>


'Mind: The Perpetual Intercourse'

The wondeful 'God's gift maggot' is on this one :D

'Bites'

& 'Remission'..

In that order :)
 


From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 19:46:21 +0100
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke





Thanks all. Homework in place.
 
Darren
Hungerford, UK
 


From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Pagan
Sent: 02 July 2009 5:19 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
 

Would agree with Alex on VIVIsectVI.  Try "The Singles Collect" and then you can decide from there any albums you'd like to investigate further.  Skinny Puppy can be a bit hit or miss at times i.e. Digital Brap (no doubt someone will disagree on that one).

 

Claire


----- Original Message ----- 

From: Alex Smith 

To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) ; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 

Cc: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 

Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 3:15 PM

Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
Skinny Puppy: My faves are CLEASNE, FOLD & MANIPULATE, VIVIsectVI and RABIES. 

 

Steely Dan -- I respect them, but christ don't make me listen to them. Pretentious crap.

 

Alex in NYC


_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live?: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 15:24:47 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:24:47 -0700
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
References: <3322175.1246495532397.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net>	<SNT104-W4850BCCE9A36A568FDBAF3BB2F0@phx.gbl><015401c9fab4$fac3c100$f04b4300$@com><BAY125-W28F24A2188CDBC66E6AA2D9D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<4A4C69C2.4010702@sbcglobal.net>
Message-ID: <DE53089F66294E64A9D1DACDED07C8E5@edweil>

I do! It's already frightening me ...
Thanks for the flashback, though!


k.w.
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "B. Oliver Sheppard" <bigblackhair at sbcglobal.net>
To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
<gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 1:03 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch


> Anyone remember this Nestle 80s New Romantic style commercial for their 
> white chocoalte candy bar?
>
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V92wHNa1UvE
>
>
>
>
>
> folk devil wrote:
>> Japan were a great band. Adolescent Sex and Tin Drum :)
>> As for DD, I bought Planet Earth, took it home, and wondered 'WTF?'
>> I prefer DDD:
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=77WbnLHHZBE
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related 
>> <http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-eGLhkpqssU&feature=related>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> 


From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 15:25:43 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 12:25:43 -0700
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl><397221.75881.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W1499FD9712ED1A985D5AAE90310@phx.gbl><552909.41363.qm@web110208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl><54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W27AE348B29E981CCF44A2F902F0@phx.gbl>
	<61041540-DAE9-4787-91E3-296317E04448@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
Message-ID: <AC08F3C1E4F44D68A68C4676F10110BC@edweil>

Laughlin is further than 1 hour away from Vegas, if I remember correctly. 
You'd be better off staying in L.V. 

Cheers,

k.w. 
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Darren A. Peace 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Cc: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 6:19 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


  If you do go, I'd be particularly interested to know whether you hear a symphony of lonely timpani.


  Darren
  Hungerford, UK

  On 2 Jul 2009, at 02:05, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:


    i'll take a rain check if THAT is the kinda welcome you got planned 
     

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:54:15 -0700
    From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


    > in L A around 10 dec wanna meet ?

    No problem at all. We can have a Los Angeles Gathering with mutual baptisms in the local springs.
    Also, if you travel Route 66 you can do a quick detour to the Las Vegas or Laughlin resorts. I think it's about an 1 hour from those cities. 

     
    ... ... ... ... ... ... 

    [looking at the current state of things..]

    'Save me...
      save me from Tomorrow..
        I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
    To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
    Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:58:58 PM
    Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

    that's the idea 
    hope i can achieve it 
    hope to be in L A around 10 dec 
    wanna meet ?
    shan't be offended if you don't 
     

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:47:00 -0700
    From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


    I live in L.A. so, probably, unless i spend the end-of-year in Las Vegas at my brother's place.
    A curious note, if you take Route 66 all the way til it ends here, you end up right in West Hollywood and about 1/4mile from the Sunset Strip. "Get your kicks....." ~~ DM


    ... ... ... ... ... ... 

    [looking at the current state of things..]

    'Save me...
      save me from Tomorrow..
        I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
    To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
    Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 1:58:33 AM
    Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers

    hi saul 
    yes i'm planning to spend 4 months stateside 
    been reading up and realizing i won't even scratch the surface [ oh well at least i'll have seen a bit of the u s ] 
    planning to travel route 66 from chicago to L A with a few detours along the way 
    just looking at chicago looks like i need to spend a week there  to really see what the city has to offer 
    this itinery is gonna be a real balancing act 
    thanks for interest shown ,are you anywhere near my travels ?
     

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:06:15 -0700
    From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
    To: gathering at misera.net
    Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers


       Are you on tour?? Is L A for Los Angeles or Louisiana? (cuz it seems L.A. would be waaaayy out of the way of those other cities...) And try and schedule your cities with wardrobe and weather in mind, like, the South is furiously hot in summer and the northern areas (Chi-Philly-Springfield) get cold and/or snowy in winter.
       L.A. on the other is pleasant all year-round, and quite possibly on fire by the time you get here. 
    Cheers!



    ... ... ... ... ... ... 

    [looking at the current state of things..]

    'Save me...
      save me from Tomorrow..
        I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   






----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
    To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
    Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
    Subject: [kj] U S gatherers

    hi to all U S gatherers 
    i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from septmber till december 
    any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO /PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
    ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
    depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished 
    thank you for your time 


----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out more. 



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now 



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! 



----------------------------------------------------------------------------
    View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! 
    _______________________________________________
    Gathering mailing list
    Gathering at misera.net
    http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



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From dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 15:35:41 2009
From: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 20:35:41 +0100
Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
In-Reply-To: <AC08F3C1E4F44D68A68C4676F10110BC@edweil>
References: <BAY132-W27C26B75D0427BA3821B5890330@phx.gbl><397221.75881.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W1499FD9712ED1A985D5AAE90310@phx.gbl><552909.41363.qm@web110208.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W2205C6E948C4D01E1CE4DD902E0@phx.gbl><54102.42726.qm@web110210.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><BAY132-W27AE348B29E981CCF44A2F902F0@phx.gbl>
	<61041540-DAE9-4787-91E3-296317E04448@suspiria.demon.co.uk>
	<AC08F3C1E4F44D68A68C4676F10110BC@edweil>
Message-ID: <302D8E95-FB91-44D1-9846-09125D33D033@suspiria.demon.co.uk>

Are you alluding to the Talent Quest finals? Alex, at least, will be  
able to identify the Stranglers lyric I was quoting.

Darren
Hungerford, UK

On 2 Jul 2009, at 20:25, "Karen Weil" <karen.weil at sddt.com> wrote:

> Laughlin is further than 1 hour away from Vegas, if I remember  
> correctly.
> You'd be better off staying in L.V.
>
> Cheers,
>
> k.w.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Darren A. Peace
> To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
> Cc: gathering at misera.net
> Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 6:19 PM
> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>
> If you do go, I'd be particularly interested to know whether you  
> hear a symphony of lonely timpani.
>
> Darren
> Hungerford, UK
>
> On 2 Jul 2009, at 02:05, Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com> wrote:
>
>> i'll take a rain check if THAT is the kinda welcome you got planned
>>
>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 17:54:15 -0700
>> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>> > in L A around 10 dec wanna meet ?
>>
>> No problem at all. We can have a Los Angeles Gathering with mutual  
>> baptisms in the local springs.
>> Also, if you travel Route 66 you can do a quick detour to the Las  
>> Vegas or Laughlin resorts. I think it's about an 1 hour from those  
>> cities.
>>
>>
>> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>
>> [looking at the current state of things..]
>>
>> 'Save me...
>>   save me from Tomorrow..
>>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
>> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 5:58:58 PM
>> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>> that's the idea
>> hope i can achieve it
>> hope to be in L A around 10 dec
>> wanna meet ?
>> shan't be offended if you don't
>>
>> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 16:47:00 -0700
>> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>> I live in L.A. so, probably, unless i spend the end-of-year in Las  
>> Vegas at my brother's place.
>> A curious note, if you take Route 66 all the way til it ends here,  
>> you end up right in West Hollywood and about 1/4mile from the  
>> Sunset Strip. "Get your kicks....." ~~ DM
>>
>>
>> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>
>> [looking at the current state of things..]
>>
>> 'Save me...
>>   save me from Tomorrow..
>>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
>> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
>> Sent: Tuesday, June 30, 2009 1:58:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>> hi saul
>> yes i'm planning to spend 4 months stateside
>> been reading up and realizing i won't even scratch the surface [ oh  
>> well at least i'll have seen a bit of the u s ]
>> planning to travel route 66 from chicago      to L A with a few  
>> detours along the way
>> just looking at chicago looks like i need to spend a week there  to  
>> really see what the city has to offer
>> this itinery is gonna be a real balancing act
>> thanks for interest shown ,are you anywhere near my travels ?
>>
>> Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 15:06:15 -0700
>> From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
>> To: gathering at misera.net
>> Subject: Re: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>>    Are you on tour?? Is L A for Los Angeles or Louisiana? (cuz it  
>> seems L.A. would be waaaayy out of the way of those other  
>> cities...) And try and schedule your cities with      wardrobe and  
>> weather in mind, like, the South is furiously hot in summer and the  
>> northern areas (Chi-Philly-Springfield) get cold and/or snowy in  
>> winter.
>>    L.A. on the other is pleasant all year-round, and quite possibly  
>> on fire by the time you get here.
>> Cheers!
>>
>>
>> ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>
>> [looking at the current state of things..]
>>
>> 'Save me...
>>   save me from Tomorrow..
>>     I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>
>>
>>
>> From: Stephen Lawrence <stephen.l at live.com>
>> To: "gathering at misera.net" <gathering at misera.net>
>> Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 4:22:48 AM
>> Subject: [kj] U S gatherers
>>
>> hi to all U S gatherers
>> i wi ll be travelling through your green and pleasant land from  
>> septmber till december
>> any gatherers living at the following locations CHICAGO / 
>> PHILADELPHIA /ST LOUIS /ORLANDO /OKLAHOMA      /SPRINGFIELD /L A /
>> ALBERQUERQUE/HOUSTON ????
>> depending on response a more detailed itinery will be furnished
>> thank you for your time
>>
>> Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find  
>> out more.
>>
>>
>> Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>
>>
>> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>>
>>
>> View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more!
>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Gathering mailing list
>> Gathering at misera.net
>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
> _______________________________________________
> Gathering mailing list
> Gathering at misera.net
> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 16:31:44 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 13:31:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
In-Reply-To: <02f201c9fb45$64b4de60$2e1e9b20$@com>
References: <26750741.1246544131714.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<68672383611A41E1BC1623747F3B1071@armstrong>
	<02f201c9fb45$64b4de60$2e1e9b20$@com>
Message-ID: <320362.52105.qm@web110209.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Some?I like from Ski.Pup. are Deep Down Trauma Hounds, Spasmolytic, 
and a fun little lite-hearted one called?Far Too Frail. 
?



... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Darren A. Peace <dpeace at bigfoot.com>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 11:46:21 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


Thanks all. Homework in place.
?
Darren
Hungerford, UK
?
From:gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Pagan
Sent: 02 July 2009 5:19 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
?
Would agree with Alex on VIVIsectVI.? Try "The Singles Collect" and then you can decide from there any albums you'd like to investigate further.? Skinny Puppy can be a bit hit or miss at times i.e. Digital Brap (no doubt someone will disagree on that one).
?
Claire
----- Original Message ----- 
>From:Alex Smith 
>To:A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) ; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
>Cc:A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
>Sent:Thursday, July 02, 2009 3:15 PM
>Subject:Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>?
>Skinny Puppy: My faves are CLEASNE, FOLD & MANIPULATE, VIVIsectVI and RABIES. 
>?
>Steely Dan -- I respect them, but christ don't make me listen to them. Pretentious crap.
>?
>Alex in NYC
>
>


      
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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 17:38:44 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:38:44 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj]  Fox wishes this 4th of July
In-Reply-To: <C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil>
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au>
	<C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil>
Message-ID: <359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Glenn Beck wants to blow u.s. up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auQJVhNH99c


From: Brendan 
>To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
>Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 8:54 AM
>Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke
>
>
>Truckload of Michael Jackson...coming right up.
>?
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6TJJ7amXV0&feature=channel


      
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From jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk  Thu Jul  2 17:44:02 2009
From: jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk (jo)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 22:44:02 +0100
Subject: [kj] Widow of Murdered Fly Seeks White House Apology (Dodgy grammar)
Message-ID: <00a101c9fb5e$36e73730$0700000a@jo>


>
> Widow of Murdered Fly Seeks White House Apology
>
> Grieving widow
> Grieving widow faces uphill legal
> Battle against President
>
> WASHINGTON -- The widow of the housefly murdered by Barack Obama
> During a recent CNBC television interview announced this morning
> That she would be filing a wrongful death suit against the
> President in federal district court. The plaintiff brief -- citing
> Pain, suffering and loss of income -- seeks a formal apology and
> Compensatory damages, including an unspecified quantity of manure.
>
> "Bob was a wonderful husband and provider," said the widow, Mrs.
> Vivian Vvzzvzwwzzz, wiping tears from her compound eyes. "Even
> Though he was always busy at the Rose Garden turd pile, he always
> Flew home in time to tuck in our maggots."
> The 17-day old widow said the grieving process since the murder has
> Taken its toll.
> "Although it's been nearly 48 hours, I still get an empty feeling
> In my thorax everytime I think about it," she said. "I feel like
> I've aged an entire week. Mating season is over, and here I am,
> Stuck trying to raise 532 larvae on my own."
>
> Vvzzvzwwzzz described the "abdomen-wrenching horror" she
> Experienced while watching the President casually assassinate her
> Husband during the live broadcast.
>
> "It was just before supper time and I was predigesting the evening
> Shit for the kids," she recalled. "When I looked up at the TV I saw Bob
> there, and of course I was pretty excited. He started waving at
> Me, and then, all of a sudden, SLAP! My whole world, my life, layed
> Smashed across the back of Obama's left hand. And with 360 degree
> Peripheral vision and hundreds of eye facets, it was impossible to
> Look away."
>
> Ever since the incident, Mrs. Vvzzvzwwzzz said she had been trying
> To piece her life back together.
>
> "I just get paralyzed wondering how I'm going to raise my larvae
> For the next six days, alone, without any kind of support," she
> Said. "Most days I just end up on the ceiling, numb
> And crying, eating a rancid bowl of Ben & Jerry's."
>
> Breaking down, an emotionally distraught Vvzzvzwwzzz was comforted
> By PETA President Ingrid Newkirk and ACLU President Nadine
> Strossen. The two groups announced they will file an amicus brief
> In the case and file a separate class action suit against the
> Insecticide, flyswatter and pest strip industries, seeking over 1
> Million metric tons of compensatory manure on behalf of 200 billion
> Fly-Americans.
>
> "The President's treatment of the Fly community has been extremely
> Disappointing, " said Newkirk. "He almost seemed to relish his
> Bloodthirsty attack on Mr. Vvzzvzwwzzz. It's obvious he's in the
> Pocket of Big Manure."
> University of Tennessee law professor Glenn Reynolds said
> Vvzzvzwwzzz v. Obama is likely to raise several thorny
> Constitutional issues.
> "The courts have a lot of questions to sort out here," he said.
> "For example, can a sitting president be forced to testify in a
> Civil suit? Can he give himself immunity? How does this effect the
> Rights of cooties and crab lice? Also, just how completely insane is 
> PETA?"
>
> Despite the prospect of facing a challenge from the President's
> Formidable legal team, Vvzzvzwwzzz said she was prepared to pursuit
> It all the way to the Supreme Court.
>
> "If Mr. Obama thinks he can shoo me away with his legal briefs and
> His rolled-up New York Times, then he is sadly mistaken," said an
> Angry Vvzzvzwwzzz. "He has no idea how persistent and annoying I
> Can be. I'm in this for the long haul. All the way till July, if
> I'm still alive."
>
> Reynolds cautioned that no matter how determined the plaintiff,
> Such a prolonged legal battle against the President could prove
> Prohibitively expensive.
> "Mrs. Vvzzvzwwzzz is likely to end up spending millions in legal
> Fees, with an unknown probability of success. Even if she prevails,
> The ACLU and PETA lawyers will eat 40% of her settlement in
> Contingency fees," he said.
>
> Vvzzvzwwzz said she would be establishing a legal fund to help
> Defray the cost of the suit, and appealed to the public for
> Contributions.
> "PETA has been very generous in relocating my family to a welcoming
> New neighborhood filled with filthy, stoned, slow-reflexed vegans,
> But we still need money for court costs," she said. "Help meee-eee!
> Help meee-ee-eee- eee!"


From karen.weil at sddt.com  Wed Jul  1 17:49:12 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:49:12 -0700
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net><32093ED84AFE4CFFAE0AC9F3B83C8347@edweil>
	<8CBC896FC6FA298-1010-80B@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
Message-ID: <065813AC6F744144AE5C83CAB1537E90@edweil>

He does -- just don't call him the King of Pop! ; ) 
Glad to see the lovely Countess posting here, btw. 

Cheers,

KW
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: countessghoulita at aol.com 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:12 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


  Alex, you rule! 

  CG







  -----Original Message-----
  From: Karen Weil <karen.weil at sddt.com>
  To: Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>; A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
  Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 10:17 am
  Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


  Thanks, Alex. Best thing I've read all day. 
   
  k.w. 
   
  ----- Original Message ----- From: "Alex Smith" <vassifer at earthlink.net> 
  To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>; "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net> 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 6:41 AM 
  Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!! 
   
  > 
  > Boys,.... 
  > 
  > Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- > can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting > enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more > revisionist shite about that20slavishly overrated bag of filth? 
  > 
  > Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or > not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke > to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic > offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 
  > 
  > Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. > Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further. 
  > 
  > Just my two cents. 
  > Alex in NYC 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > 
  > -----Original Message----- 
  >>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz> 
  >>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM 
  >>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" >><gathering at misera.net> 
  >>Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >> 
  >>> 
  >>> do i have to spell it out to you ? 
  >>> 
  >>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS 
  >> 
  >>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out. 
  >> 
  >>> other gatherers pointed this out 
  >>> 
  >>> you ignored it 
  >> 
  >>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.  >> 
  >>> i am not going to explain myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes 
  >> 
  >>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I 
  >>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into someone 
  >>saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a discussion about 
  >>bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say... 
  >> 
  >>> and frankly i can't be bothered 
  >> 
  >>So stop replying then... 
  >> 
  >>> i have better things to do 
  >> 
  >>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim. 
  >> 
  >>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it 
  >> 
  >>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be turning 
  >>the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are you running 
  >>off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;) 
  >> 
  >>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ? 
  >> 
  >>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most 
  >>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them. 
  >> 
  >>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me 
  >> 
  &g t;>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth 
  >>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in 
  >>our arguments. 
  >> 
  >>> 
  >>> but then again you are pretty blinkered 
  >> 
  >>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I don't 
  >>know fuck all. Next stupid comment please. 
  >> 
  >>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good band 
  >>on the planet 
  >> 
  >>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :) 
  >> 
  >>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and ones I 
  >>don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to in jokes 
  >>and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete quickly, I 
  >>vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click. 
  >>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal. 
  >> 
  >> 
  >>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200 
  >>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> 
  >>&g t;> err STILL not reading what you have written 
  >>>> 
  >>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair. 
  >>>> 
  >>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you 
  >>>> 
  >>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually. 
  >>>> 
  >>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made 
  >>>> regarding 
  >>>> > jury service 
  >>>> 
  >>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how would 
  >>>> you 
  >>>> know when you're not reading my posts? 
  >>>> 
  >>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence case 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > i was not the only one voting against 
  >>>> 
  >>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you decided 
  >>>> based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what you 
  >>>> originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. That 
  >>>> was 
  >>>> my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the other and make 
  >>>> up 
  >>>> your mind then and there without hearing the rest of the evidence.&n bsp;
  >>>> 
  >>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i 
  >>>> haven't 
  >>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet '' 
  >>>> 
  >>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone >>>> else's 
  >>>> mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point. 
  >>>> 
  >>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life 
  >>>> 
  >>>> When are you not? 
  >>>> 
  >>>> > police never lie do they ? 
  >>>> 
  >>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police. 
  >>>> 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000 
  >>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use 
  >>>> that. 
  >>>> > 
  >>>>=2 0> Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to >>>> > Pete 
  >>>> > West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his english 
  >>>> > favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint praise or 
  >>>> whatever, 
  >>>> > but hey.. 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
  >>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] 
  >>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence 
  >>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM 
  >>>> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing 
  >>>> > or get some new glasses 
  >>>> > testing the statement you made 
  >>>> > SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!! 
  >>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are 
  >>>> > i suggest you read wha t you last wrote and apologise to the person 
  >>>> > mentioned 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200 
  >>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris. 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the chin 
  >>>> >> when 
  >>>> >> someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending that you're 
  >>>> holier 
  >>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite you 
  >>>> >> are...sorry. 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live" 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in it 
  >>>> with 
  >>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course. 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou" 
  >>>> >> 
  >>& gt;> >> Yes, you do. 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> "i await the usual one word response" 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of 
  >>>> sarcasm? 
  >>>> >> That's not positive now is it? 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was 
  >>>> pete 
  >>>> >> west" 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion between 
  >>>> you 
  >>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse than 
  >>>> he 
  >>>> >> is 
  >>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he >>>> >> gets 
  >>>> >> going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore. 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > awww poor brendan 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ? 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > get over it 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully  ;
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such rubbish 
  >>>> >> written 
  >>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ] 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that unless i 
  >>>> >> > dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the kingdom >>>> >> > onearth 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death 
  >>>> around 
  >>>> >> me 
  >>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > unlike o thers on the internet i do not adopt some sort of persona 
  >>>> in 
  >>>> >> order 
  >>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard '' 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > some gatherers have met me 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ] 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in real 
  >>>> life 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others >>>> >> > throats 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe to 
  >>>> the 
  >>>> >> > cult of personality 
  >>& gt;> >> > 
  >>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been in 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of 
  >>>> >> heartbreaks 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask if 
  >>>> i'm 
  >>>> >> not 
  >>>> >> > sure 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i await the usual one word response 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a 
  >>>> kindness 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up the 
  >>>> past 
  >>&g t;> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was 
  >>>> pete 
  >>>> >> west 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000 
  >>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's 
  >>>> minds 
  >>>> >> or 
  >>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white thinking...negative 
  >>>> >> thoughts 
  >>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do... 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging 
  >>>> remark 
  >>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just t hat. What you >>>> >> > think 
  >>>> >> you 
  >>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your collective 
  >>>> >> imaginary 
  >>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high 
  >>>> incidence 
  >>>> >> of 
  >>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with supernatural 
  >>>> >> promises 
  >>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set of 
  >>>> >> options. 
  >>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity. 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a >>>> >> > 100% 
  >>>> >> chance 
  >>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into your 
  >>>> >> nervous 
  >>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the existing 
  >>>> >> model.. 
  >>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd 
  >>>> imply 
  >>>> >> some 
  >>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way! 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
  >>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] 
  >>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence 
  >>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM 
  >>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering 
  >>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me 
  >>>> >> > i do not recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of 
  >>>> >> > regarding a boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and 
  >>>> walked 
  >>>> >> > i will NOT take shit 
  >>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek 
  >>>> approval 
  >>>> >> > from anyone 
  >>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech 
  >>>> >> > i have never tried ''to fit in '' 
  > >>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it is 
  >>>> >> > fashionable 
  >>>> >> > i occaisionally pay homage to a particular vernacular because it 
  >>>> >> raises a 
  >>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it 
  >>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own personal 
  >>>> space 
  >>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with someone [ 
  >>>> >> except 
  >>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ] 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000 
  >>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by 
  >>>> omission)? 
  >>>> >> A 
  >> ;>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or comment 
  >>>> >> that 
  >>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed along 
  >>>> >> with 
  >>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave face 
  >>>> >> when 
  >>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy >>>> >> > when 
  >>>> >> being 
  >>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like a 
  >>>> >> tougher 
  >>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to give 
  >>>> a 
  >>>> >> shit 
  >>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be interested 
  >>>> when 
  >>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you? 
  >>>> Heaped 
  >>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the right 
  >>>> >> > reasons? 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do >>>> >> > when 
  >>>> >> you're  
  >>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't like 
  >>>> for 
  >>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in 
  >>>> retrospect 
  >>>> >> and 
  >>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a >>>> >> > particular 
  >>>> >> way to 
  >>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your representative >>>> >> > on 
  >>>> a 
  >>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was around 
  >>>> >> before 
  >>>> >> > picking your nose? 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because 
  >>>> they 
  >>>> >> have 
  >>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 'fit 
  >>>> in'? 
  >>>> >> Or 
  >>>> >> > to not fit in... 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on a 
  >>>> date? 
  >>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's20feelings...? 
  >>>> >> Tried 
  >>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who 
  >>>> disgusts 
  >>>> >> you? 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL OF 
  >>>> >> SHIT. 
  >>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;) 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
  >>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] 
  >>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin 
  >>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM 
  >>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > actually I DON'T 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, f*?k 
  >>>& gt; it! 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Jelly...... melting 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com 
  >>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000 
  >>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > actually I DON'T 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200 
  >>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> 
  >>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not. 
  >>>> >> >> 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face? 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling... 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults. 
  >>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored 
  >>>> >> >> > Think. Act. Transform Lives. 
  >>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz 
  >>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  & gt;>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad 
  >>>> >> about 
  >>>> >> >> a 
  >>>> >> >> > dead person 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an 
  >>>> >> alternative 
  >>>> >> >> set 
  >>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From 
  >>>> what 
  >>>> >> >> I've 
  >>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes >>>> >> >> > to 
  >>>> >> the 
  >>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they 
  >>>> >> want. 
  >>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't 
  >>>> feel 
  >>>> >> any 
  >>>> >> >> > compunctions either way. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > It doesn't generall y apply to enemies 
  >>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently 
  >>>> >> >> fashionable 
  >>>> >> >> > to dislike 
  >>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your 
  >>>> comments 
  >>>> >> >> with 
  >>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else >>>> >> >> > said 
  >>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us" 
  >>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks. 
  >>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything... 
  >>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want 
  >>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just 
  >>>> >> doing 
  >>>> >> >> my 
  >>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the 
  >>>> >> >> tabloids I 
  >>>> >> >> > just make them... 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3 DUUXBCdt5IPg 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] 
  >>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1 
  >>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM 
  >>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read 
  >>>> >> actually 
  >>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements... 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad 
  >>>> & gt;> about 
  >>>> >> >> a 
  >>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in 
  >>>> real 
  >>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental 
  >>>> >> death 
  >>>> >> >> (so 
  >>>> >> >> > they're saying). 
  >>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll 
  >>>> >> have a 
  >>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases >>>> >> >> > have 
  >>>> >> been 
  >>>> >> >> > settled. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all 
  >>>> about 
  >>>> >> any 
  >>>> >> >> or 
  >>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ... 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>& gt;> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..] 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 'Save me... 
  >>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow.. 
  >>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...' 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk> 
  >>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  >>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net> 
  >>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are ok ay if they've 
  >>>> >> also 
  >>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole 
  >>>> bloody 
  >>>> >> >> circus 
  >>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational 
  >>>> >> >> activities. I 
  >>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing 
  >>>> >> pieces 
  >>>> >> >> of 
  >>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and 
  >>>> >> >> multi-million 
  >>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have 
  >>>> come 
  >>>> >> was 
  >>>> >> >> a 
  >>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal 
  >>>> >> problems".. 
  >>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That 
  >>>> >> makes 
  >>>> >> >> it 
  >>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a 
  >>>> >> little 
  >>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion.. 
  >>>&g t; >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some 
  >>>> >> >> half-decent 
  >>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do 
  >>>> we 
  >>>> >> all 
  >>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it 
  >>>> >> offends 
  >>>> >> >> > someone? 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Jim. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote: 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this 
  >>>> inane 
  >>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most 
  >>>> >> abused 
  >>>> >> >> word 
  >>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap. 
  >>>> >> ; >> > I'm sick of it. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > -----Original Message----- 
  >>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin 
  >>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM 
  >>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk 
  >>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> ; >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's, 
  >>>> >> downloads 
  >>>> >> >> etc 
  >>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings 
  >>>> >> smells 
  >>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse! 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Jelly. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com 
  >>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100 
  >>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Oh Christ. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Darren 
  >>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. 
  >>>> Find 
  >>>> >> out 
  >>>> >> >> > more. 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows----- 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> >> >> > 
  >>>> >> >> 
  >>>> >> >> 
  >>>> >> >> _______________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find 
  >>>> out 
  >>>> >> > more. 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn more! 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> > Upgrade to=2 0Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now 
  >>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile 
  >>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> > Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> >> > 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> 
  >>>> >> _______________________________________________ 
  >>>> >> Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> >> Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> > Beyond Hotmail ? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out 
  >>>> > more. 
  >>>> > _________________________________________________________________ 
  >>>> > With Windows Live, you ca n organise, edit, and share your photos. 
  >>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________ 
  >>>> > Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> > Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>> > 
  >>>> 
  >>>> 
  >>>> _______________________________________________ 
  >>>> Gathering mailing list 
  >>>> Gathering at misera.net 
  >>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>> 
  >>> _________________________________________________________________ 
  >>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos ? Free. 
  >>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________ 
  >>> Gathering mailing list 
  >>> Gathering at misera.net 
  >>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >>>&n bsp;
  >> 
  >> 
  >>_______________________________________________ 
  >>Gathering mailing list 
  >>Gathering at misera.net 
  >>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  > 
  > _______________________________________________ 
  > Gathering mailing list 
  > Gathering at misera.net 
  > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering 
  >  
  _______________________________________________ 
  Gathering mailing list 
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From dpeace at bigfoot.com  Wed Jul  1 20:40:34 2009
From: dpeace at bigfoot.com (Darren A. Peace)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 01:40:34 +0100
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch
In-Reply-To: <102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <BLU112-W26EBEF9AB5261D06701EFCBE2E0@phx.gbl>	<BAY125-W9627C6031732D7DD304C49D2E0@phx.gbl>	<8CBC897F17E5079-1010-887@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com>
	<102968.3034.qm@web110206.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <011b01c9faad$b6971290$23c537b0$@com>

Image

 

From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of sade1
Sent: 01 July 2009 11:28 PM
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke -- good catch

 

Oh my god, where did you find this?

 

(someone should've lit that shirt on fire while he was still wearing it)


 

... ... ... ... ... ... 


[looking at the current state of things..]

 

'Save me...

  save me from Tomorrow..

    I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'   

 

 

 

  _____  

From: "countessghoulita at aol.com" <countessghoulita at aol.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wednesday, July 1, 2009 12:19:09 PM
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

I agree.

Among the gazillion of bands that are antithetical to KJ, I'd also add Chicago and their abuse of Bauhaus t-shirts:
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1w80f_chicago-youre-the-inspiration_music

 

 

-----Original Message-----
From: folk devil <folk.devil at hotmail.com>
To: gathering at misera.net
Sent: Wed, Jul 1, 2009 12:09 pm
Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

Michael Jackson....

  _____  

From: fluke1 at live.co.uk
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 18:33:53 +0000
Subject: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke

 
  Who would you say that Killing Jokes antithesis was/is ?

  _____  

View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place ? Learn <http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/137984870/direct/01/>  more!

  _____  

Windows Live? SkyDrive?: Get 25 GB of free online storage. Get it on your BlackBerry or iPhone. <http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009> = 

_______________________________________________






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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 14:08:24 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:08:24 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <2362780.1246544703247.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
References: <2362780.1246544703247.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <524059.27904.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

That all said, there is still, also, some trippy, bizzare african?and even?ambient-ish music out there with no conventionally recognizable "quality" but it will still zone you out into a much better place and leave you grateful 
for it.?Michael's music did that, or something like it,?for a lot of people out there, as?can be seen; he was doing
something right, if distasteful or unappealing to many others as well.


In other newz, Michael was found to have spent $48,000 a month on prescription drugs from a Beverly Hills pharmacist (wtf?!), and now the Authorities are looking for someone to charge?manslaughter due to?the extreme
nature of one of those drugs (a surgery room-only?anaesthetic or something like that). Plus there will prolly be an official memorial held for MJ outdoors in L.A. at the Staples Center, our (now usual) local epicenter for rioting.

... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>
To: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com; gathering at misera.net
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 7:25:02 AM
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!


I was talking about his music, not him as a person, but I don't really think he was all that great as a *soul* either.

I personally don't hear a great deal of depth or soul or substance in bullshit like "Dirty Diana" or "PYT," do you? 


Alex in NYC


-----Original Message-----
>From: MichaelHead at HBOSplc.com
>Sent: Jul 2, 2009 9:48 AM
>To: vassifer at earthlink.net, gathering at misera.net
>Subject: RE: [kj] FW:? Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
>
>"the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product." 
>
>Wow, we've seen a lot of things being levelled at Wacko, but soulless???? 
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net] On Behalf Of Alex Smith
>Sent: 01 July 2009 14:41
>To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!); A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
>
>
>Boys,....
>
>Can we just let this die already? Also -- and this is just my request -- can we drop the whole Michael Jackson discussion? Aren't you all getting enough of that bullshit elsewhere? Aren't we already inundated with more revisionist shite about that slavishly overrated bag of filth?
>
>Personally speaking, I was NEVER a fan of MJ -- be he a child molester or not (he was, by the way, just admit it!) Growing up, the music that spoke to me served as the ANTIDOTE to the slick, soulless, meaningless sonic offal that was Michael Jackson's product. 
>
>Michael Jackson is the veritable antithesis of Killing Joke, in my mind. Let's not lower our standards by discussing him further.
>
>Just my two cents.
>Alex in NYC
>
>
>
>
>
>-----Original Message-----
>>From: Brendan <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>
>>Sent: Jul 1, 2009 9:32 AM
>>To: "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" 
>><gathering at misera.net>
>>Subject: Re: [kj] FW:? Michael Jackson dead
>>
>>>
>>> do i have to spell it out to you ?
>>>
>>> YOU WERE CALLING ME CHRIS
>>
>>I was only trying to get you closer to Christ, sheesh, chill out.
>>
>>> other gatherers pointed this out
>>>
>>> you ignored it
>>
>>Don't call other gatherers it, they have names.
>>
>>> i am not going to explain? myself as i am a bullshitter in your eyes
>>
>>My point was that everyone is a bullshitter in a sense, actually, and I 
>>don't believe people who say they aren't. Don't read too much into 
>>someone saying "bullshit" to you on the internets either, in a 
>>discussion about bullshit (?!). I can't put a smiley on every single thing I say...
>>
>>> and frankly i can't be bothered
>>
>>So stop replying then...
>>
>>> i have better things to do
>>
>>Fair enough, start doing them, with gusto, verve and vim.
>>
>>> i notice you like to give shit but can't take it
>>
>>You're not supposed to be dishing out shit, your'e supposed to be 
>>turning the other cheek and forgiving...what version of the bible are 
>>you running off? Not the one I grew up with (and defaced ;)
>>
>>> ever heard the glass houses proverb ?
>>
>>Yeah, ever heard the one about the...oh, I can't tell that one. Or most 
>>others I know...they've all got priests or nuns in them.
>>
>>> i don't recall many gatherers [ if any ] defending your attack on me
>>
>>I'm not looking for anyone to defend my opinion. For what it's worth 
>>though Darren saw my point. But we really shouldn't involve the kids in 
>>our arguments.
>>
>>>
>>> but then again you are pretty blinkered
>>
>>You have the universe all wrapped up already, I openly state that I 
>>don't know fuck all. Next stupid comment please.
>>
>>> don't wanna burst your bubble but soundgarden are NOT the only good 
>>> band
>>on the planet
>>
>>Now that's just funny, esp after I accidentally called you Chris :)
>>
>>Look, sorry for getting your name wrong, I blitz through emails and 
>>ones I don't understand at a glance (there's a lot on this list, due to 
>>in jokes and regional references and bands I don't know etc) I delete 
>>quickly, I vaguely remember someone pointing out something about it but didn't click.
>>Or I did click but on the delete button. Big deal.
>>
>>
>>>> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 23:47:29 +1200
>>>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>>
>>>> err STILL not reading what you have written
>>>>
>>>> Indeed. But you still comment on it, how fair.
>>>>
>>>> other gatherers pointed it out to you
>>>>
>>>> Other gatherers ventured their opinion on both sides, actually.
>>>>
>>>> > but i also noticed how you ignored other gatherers points made
>>>> regarding
>>>> > jury service
>>>>
>>>> What points did I ignore, I thought I answered in full. But how 
>>>> would you know when you're not reading my posts?
>>>>
>>>> > i can't be bothered to go into the details of the minor offence 
>>>> > case
>>>> >
>>>> > i was not the only one voting against
>>>>
>>>> You still haven't said what kind of case it was and whether you 
>>>> decided based on evidence or as soon as you had doubt, which is what 
>>>> you originally said, and haven't corrected, so I assume is the case. 
>>>> That was my whole point. You can't sniff doubt on one side or the 
>>>> other and make up your mind then and there without hearing the rest 
>>>> of the evidence.
>>>>
>>>> > a juror reminds me of you when stating '' i wanna vote guilty as i
>>>> haven't
>>>> > been on a case where that was unanimous yet ''
>>>>
>>>> Don't understand you or the comment, and putting words in someone 
>>>> else's mouth isn't a legitimite way to argue a point.
>>>>
>>>> > never mind the fact you are dealing with a person's life
>>>>
>>>> When are you not?
>>>>
>>>> > police never lie do they ?
>>>>
>>>> You obviously haven't read my posts about the police.
>>>>
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 13:55:02 +1000
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Check who you are dissing or get some new glasses...I'm gonna use
>>>> that.
>>>> >
>>>> > Yes STFU means what you think it does. And I'm not apologising to 
>>>> > Pete West, esp not after complimenting his SOH and comparing his 
>>>> > english favourably to yours...I know that's damning with faint 
>>>> > praise or
>>>> whatever,
>>>> > but hey..
>>>> >
>>>> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7-NOZU2iPA8
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> > Sent: Wednesday, 1 July 2009 9:27 AM
>>>> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > all i'm gonna say is check who you are dissing or get some new 
>>>> > glasses testing the statement you made SHUT THE FUCK UP !!!!!!!
>>>> > sorry ??? like fuck you are
>>>> > i suggest you read what you last wrote and apologise to the person 
>>>> > mentioned
>>>> >
>>>> >> Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 00:24:45 +1200
>>>> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Christ you waffle a load of shit Chris.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Your first lines belie your 'nice' nature. I can take it on the 
>>>> >> chin when someone tells me to STFU or whatever, but pretending 
>>>> >> that you're
>>>> holier
>>>> >> than thou, when you demonstrate in your email what a hypocrite 
>>>> >> you are...sorry.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Actually you did and got shouted down and told to put a sock in 
>>>> >> it
>>>> with
>>>> >> the religious crap. Sigh...go on and deny it now of course.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Yes, you do.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "i await the usual one word response"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Two emails out of hundreds doesn't constitute usual. touch of
>>>> sarcasm?
>>>> >> That's not positive now is it?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> "when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west"
>>>> >>
>>>> >> Obviously how? What are you on about now? The only confusion 
>>>> >> between
>>>> you
>>>> >> and Pete West is in the hopeless english, you're actually worse 
>>>> >> than
>>>> he
>>>> >> is
>>>> >> as a matter of fact. Well done. Pete West is quite witty when he 
>>>> >> gets going too, I don't bite when he pops up anymore.
>>>> >>
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > awww poor brendan
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > hurt your feelings did i ?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > get over it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > you come across as an opinionated bully
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unless it fits in with your world view
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it must me torn down and stomped on
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > never on this forum have i TOLD anyone how to live
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i HAVE defended what the bible teaches ,after seeing such 
>>>> >> > rubbish
>>>> >> written
>>>> >> > about it [ or parts taken out of context ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT consider myself hoilier than thou as i KNOW that 
>>>> >> > unless i dramatically change my lifestyle i will NOT see the 
>>>> >> > kingdom onearth
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i like life as it is even with all the pain suffering and death
>>>> around
>>>> >> me
>>>> >> > and try to alleviate it in some small way
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > NO i am not seeking your approval
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > it would be interesting to see if you walk it like you talk it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others on the internet i do not adopt some sort of 
>>>> >> > persona
>>>> in
>>>> >> order
>>>> >> > to feel '' big behind the keyboard ''
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > some gatherers have met me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i leave them to give a hopefully honest appraiseal of me
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > if they don't i shan't castigate them for it
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > unlike others i admit to my faults
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i know i expect too much of others [ even of myself sometimes ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i DO endeavour to make my word my bond
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy violent video games but would never perpetrate it in 
>>>> >> > real
>>>> life
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i enjoy many types of music but do not force it down others 
>>>> >> > throats
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not see artists as someone to worship and do NOT prescribe 
>>>> >> > to
>>>> the
>>>> >> > cult of personality
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > they are people just like me with good and bad points
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i stand by my statement regarding the scenarios i have NOT been 
>>>> >> > in
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have obviously lead a different life to you
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > possibly charmed n some instances but it has had it's share of
>>>> >> heartbreaks
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do NOT seek sympathy from anyone
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i WILL seek guidance from friends and am not too proud to ask 
>>>> >> > if
>>>> i'm
>>>> >> not
>>>> >> > sure
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i await the usual one word response
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh and intially i defended my view of killing joke
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i have learnt to respond only when needed or to acknowledge a
>>>> kindness
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i do not bear grudges and am surprised that you would drag up 
>>>> >> > the
>>>> past
>>>> >> > when obviously the initial hostility was due to the belief i 
>>>> >> > was
>>>> pete
>>>> >> west
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > oh well whatever floats your boat
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 14:41:31 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > You're a great example of either what religion does to people's
>>>> minds
>>>> >> or
>>>> >> > who is attracted to religion. Black and white 
>>>> >> > thinking...negative
>>>> >> thoughts
>>>> >> > are BAD, ergo I don't have any. Oh but you do...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > In one of your first posts on this list you made a disparaging
>>>> remark
>>>> >> > about me, so all of your blather below is just that. What you 
>>>> >> > think
>>>> >> you
>>>> >> > should be. Because a bunch of representatives of your 
>>>> >> > collective
>>>> >> imaginary
>>>> >> > friend, who I might point out have a disproportionately high
>>>> incidence
>>>> >> of
>>>> >> > molesting children, tell you is right, enforced with 
>>>> >> > supernatural
>>>> >> promises
>>>> >> > and threats. Choose me or choose eternal flame...hrm, nice set 
>>>> >> > of
>>>> >> options.
>>>> >> > Sounds like a plausible offer from a sane omnipotent entity.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > And if you're like the typical religious idiot there's about a 
>>>> >> > 100%
>>>> >> chance
>>>> >> > that any evidence to the contrary will be refused entry into 
>>>> >> > your
>>>> >> nervous
>>>> >> > system or twisted in such a way that it somehow fits the 
>>>> >> > existing
>>>> >> model..
>>>> >> > No chance of challenging those convictions, that faith. That'd
>>>> imply
>>>> >> some
>>>> >> > form of honesty and fallibility. God doesn't work that way!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of Stephen Lawrence
>>>> >> > Sent: Tuesday, 30 June 2009 4:47 AM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > i don't know why i'm bothering
>>>> >> > but half the things you speak of do NOT apply to me i do not 
>>>> >> > recall being in any of the scenarios you speak of regarding a 
>>>> >> > boss i disliked i just told him what i thought and
>>>> walked
>>>> >> > i will NOT take shit
>>>> >> > if i like something i say so and vice versa and i do not seek
>>>> approval
>>>> >> > from anyone
>>>> >> > i have never delivered a speech i have never tried ''to fit in 
>>>> >> > ''
>>>> >> > i wear something because it is pleasing to me ,NOT because it 
>>>> >> > is fashionable i occaisionally pay homage to a particular 
>>>> >> > vernacular because it
>>>> >> raises a
>>>> >> > laugh [ usually at my expense ] but i don't lose sleep over it 
>>>> >> > i'll admit picking my nose in my own time and in my own 
>>>> >> > personal
>>>> space
>>>> >> > i have never laughed AT someone but prefer to laugh with 
>>>> >> > someone [
>>>> >> except
>>>> >> > in the instance of comedy ]
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:57:16 +1000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Never had a boss you weren't honest about disliking (lie by
>>>> omission)?
>>>> >> A
>>>> >> > friend / partner / family member make a stupid decision or 
>>>> >> > comment
>>>> >> that
>>>> >> > you smiled and bit your tongue to? A stupid joke you laughed 
>>>> >> > along
>>>> >> with
>>>> >> > for reasons of social cohesion / subservience? Put on a brave 
>>>> >> > face
>>>> >> when
>>>> >> > you wanted to cry or scream? Did your best not to look unhappy 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> being
>>>> >> > teased or laughed at? Smiled and posed for a photo? Looked like 
>>>> >> > a
>>>> >> tougher
>>>> >> > version of yourself when walking past thugs? Pretended not to 
>>>> >> > give
>>>> a
>>>> >> shit
>>>> >> > when someone said something that hurt? Pretended to be 
>>>> >> > interested
>>>> when
>>>> >> > someone you like or thought worthy of respect was boring you?
>>>> Heaped
>>>> >> > praise on mediocre performance for what you thought were the 
>>>> >> > right reasons?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Do you present the same way when delivering a speech as you do 
>>>> >> > when
>>>> >> you're
>>>> >> > getting pissed with your mates? Do you wear clothes you don't 
>>>> >> > like
>>>> for
>>>> >> > business or other reasons, to fit in? Never looked back in
>>>> retrospect
>>>> >> and
>>>> >> > thought you were an idiot for trying to come across in a 
>>>> >> > particular
>>>> >> way to
>>>> >> > impress someone else? Presented someone with your 
>>>> >> > representative on
>>>> a
>>>> >> > date, as opposed to the real you? Waited until no one was 
>>>> >> > around
>>>> >> before
>>>> >> > picking your nose?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever found yourslf picking up someone else's vernacular because
>>>> they
>>>> >> have
>>>> >> > a strong personality? Bought clothes or music or gadgets to 
>>>> >> > 'fit
>>>> in'?
>>>> >> Or
>>>> >> > to not fit in...
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Ever talked shit for an hour straight at a job interview or on 
>>>> >> > a
>>>> date?
>>>> >> > Stifled laughter in order to not hurt someone else's feelings...?
>>>> >> Tried
>>>> >> > not to look physically disgusted at something / someone who
>>>> disgusts
>>>> >> you?
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Hrm...by my calculations, if the above is true then you're FULL 
>>>> >> > OF
>>>> >> SHIT.
>>>> >> > Just like the rest of us (only slightly moreso ;)
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> > On Behalf Of jerry bodkin
>>>> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 11:27 PM
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Same as, it leaves one a touch outspoken at times, but hey, 
>>>> >> > f*?k
>>>> it!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Jelly...... melting
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > From: stephen.l at live.com
>>>> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 12:49:21 +0000
>>>> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > actually I DON'T
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >> Date: Tue, 30 Jun 2009 00:13:39 +1200
>>>> >> >> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> Cos we all pretend we're something we're not.
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ...cos no one wants to say so to your face?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Keep Smiling...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Autism also affects adults.
>>>> >> >> > Most are isolated and ignored Think. Act. Transform Lives.
>>>> >> >> > www.think-differently.org.uk
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Mon, 29 Jun 2009 14:11:03 +1000
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Rraises some interesting questions for those who have an
>>>> >> alternative
>>>> >> >> set
>>>> >> >> > of ethics as espoused by bands such as Killing Joke etc. From
>>>> what
>>>> >> >> I've
>>>> >> >> > seen that tradition is given lip service but is full of holes to
>>>> >> the
>>>> >> >> > extent that people will find a way to talk about whatever they
>>>> >> want.
>>>> >> >> > Personally I've never really bought into it anyway so I don't
>>>> feel
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> > compunctions either way.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It doesn't generally apply to enemies
>>>> >> >> > Doesn't apply to anyone who fits into any group it's currently
>>>> >> >> fashionable
>>>> >> >> > to dislike
>>>> >> >> > It's okay to say exactly what you want if you preface your
>>>> comments
>>>> >> >> with
>>>> >> >> > the assertion that you're only passing on what someone else said
>>>> >> >> > It's behind closed doors and "just between us"
>>>> >> >> > All bets are off when you've had a few drinks.
>>>> >> >> > Lads / mates can talk about anything...
>>>> >> >> > Partners can talk about whatever they want
>>>> >> >> > It sells copy, I don't make the news I just print it...I'm just
>>>> >> doing
>>>> >> >> my
>>>> >> >> > job. I'm just filling a demand, don't blame me I don't buy the
>>>> >> >> tabloids I
>>>> >> >> > just make them...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UUXBCdt5IPg
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > WHY CAN'T WE JUST ADMIT IT.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
>>>> >> >> [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]
>>>> >> >> > On Behalf Of sade1
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Monday, 29 June 2009 10:11 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >> ...none of the...ass-kissing pieces of tripe that I've read
>>>> >> actually
>>>> >> >> >> mention his court cases and... settlements...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's damn near illegal and harshly looked down upon to talk bad
>>>> >> about
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > dead person, even if they deliberately were a major asshole in
>>>> real
>>>> >> >> > life.** Even worse when it seems it was all a tragic accidental
>>>> >> death
>>>> >> >> (so
>>>> >> >> > they're saying).
>>>> >> >> > Worse now that his doctor has lawyered up i don't think they'll
>>>> >> have a
>>>> >> >> > straight answer on anything until legal and insurance cases have
>>>> >> been
>>>> >> >> > settled.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > **besides, even now, television ratings are everything.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > I would like to see any one of his lawyers write a tell-all
>>>> about
>>>> >> any
>>>> >> >> or
>>>> >> >> > all of MJ's cases and settlements. Would reveal lots.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > ... ... ... ... ... ...
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > [looking at the current state of things..]
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > 'Save me...
>>>> >> >> > save me from Tomorrow..
>>>> >> >> > I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: Jim Harper <jimharper666 at yahoo.co.uk>
>>>> >> >> > To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
>>>> >> >> > <gathering at misera.net>
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Sunday, June 28, 2009 10:05:26 AM
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Aside from the implication that paedophiles are okay if they've
>>>> >> also
>>>> >> >> > written some nice songs, my main grievance about this whole
>>>> bloody
>>>> >> >> circus
>>>> >> >> > is the media conspiracy to hush-up his charming recreational
>>>> >> >> activities. I
>>>> >> >> > could be wrong, but none of the eulogies, bios and ass-kissing
>>>> >> pieces
>>>> >> >> of
>>>> >> >> > tripe that I've read actually mention his court cases and
>>>> >> >> multi-million
>>>> >> >> > dollar out-of-court settlements. The closest any of them have
>>>> come
>>>> >> was
>>>> >> >> a
>>>> >> >> > sheepish remark that "[his] later life was dogged by legal
>>>> >> problems"..
>>>> >> >> > Since when did being arrested count as a 'legal problem'? That
>>>> >> makes
>>>> >> >> it
>>>> >> >> > sound like some boundary dispute with a neigbour, or at worst a
>>>> >> little
>>>> >> >> > income-tax evasion..
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's disgraceful. If Gary Glitter had actually written some
>>>> >> >> half-decent
>>>> >> >> > songs, does that mean he was really a nice guy? When he dies do
>>>> we
>>>> >> all
>>>> >> >> > have to agree not to mention his child molestation in case it
>>>> >> offends
>>>> >> >> > someone?
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jim.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > --- On Sun, 28/6/09, Alex Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > It's all fucking meaningless. People have been force-fed this
>>>> inane
>>>> >> >> > bologna for years that MJ was some sort of "genius' (the most
>>>> >> abused
>>>> >> >> word
>>>> >> >> > in the English language). Pile of fucking crap.
>>>> >> >> > I'm sick of it.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Alex in NYC
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> >> > From: jerry bodkin
>>>> >> >> > Sent: Jun 28, 2009 11:24 AM
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: jelbod at hotmail.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > To: dpeace at suspiria.demon.co.uk
>>>> >> >> > Subject: RE: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:24:17 +0100
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > If his fans liked his music, why didnt they have the c.d's,
>>>> >> downloads
>>>> >> >> etc
>>>> >> >> > already? Why the sudden rush to purchase and d/load. Somethings
>>>> >> smells
>>>> >> >> > and dont just mean his corpse!
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Jelly.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > From: dpeace at bigfoot.com
>>>> >> >> > To: gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > Date: Sun, 28 Jun 2009 16:07:37 +0100
>>>> >> >> > Subject: Re: [kj] Michael Jackson dead
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Oh Christ.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/entertainment/8123085.stm
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Darren
>>>> >> >> > Hungerford, UK
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live.
>>>> Find
>>>> >> out
>>>> >> >> > more.
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > -----Inline Attachment Follows-----
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >> > _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >> >
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >>
>>>> >> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Beyond Hotmail - see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find
>>>> out
>>>> >> > more.
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > View your Twitter and Flickr updates from one place? Learn more!
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> >
>>>> >> > Upgrade to Internet Explorer 8 Optimised for MSN. Download Now
>>>> >> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> >> > Get the best of MSN on your mobile
>>>> >> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/147991039/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> >> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >> >
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> Gathering mailing list
>>>> >> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> >> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > Beyond Hotmail? see what else you can do with Windows Live. Find out
>>>> > more.
>>>> > _________________________________________________________________
>>>> > With Windows Live, you can organise, edit, and share your photos.
>>>> > http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>>> > Gathering mailing list
>>>> > Gathering at misera.net
>>>> > http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>> >
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Gathering mailing list
>>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>> _________________________________________________________________
>>> Share your photos with Windows Live Photos? Free.
>>> http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/134665338/direct/01/_______________________________________________
>>> Gathering mailing list
>>> Gathering at misera.net
>>> http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Gathering mailing list
>>Gathering at misera.net
>>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
>_______________________________________________
>Gathering mailing list
>Gathering at misera.net
>http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering
>
> 
>-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>HBOS plc, Registered in Scotland No. SC218813. Registered Office: The Mound, Edinburgh EH1 1YZ. HBOS plc is a holding company, subsidiaries of which are authorised and regulated by the Financial Services Authority.
>
>==============================================================================
>

_______________________________________________
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Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



      
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 17:51:47 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:51:47 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil>
	<359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil>

He's an insult to that special day.  But thanks for the laugh, sade1. 

Cheers.

k.w.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: sade1 
  To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:38 PM
  Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July


  Glenn Beck wants to blow u.s. up: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auQJVhNH99c


    From: Brendan 
    To: 'A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)' 
    Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 8:54 AM
    Subject: Re: [kj] Antithesis of Killing Joke


    Truckload of Michael Jackson...coming right up.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h6TJJ7amXV0&feature=channel




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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 17:53:10 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:53:10 -0700
Subject: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!
In-Reply-To: <524059.27904.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
References: <2362780.1246544703247.JavaMail.root@elwamui-polski.atl.sa.earthlink.net>
	<524059.27904.qm@web110201.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W52ADA03D47DBE4401F70F9D2F0@phx.gbl>


That's about the norm over this way, no? ;)

Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 11:08:24 -0700
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com
To: vassifer at earthlink.net; gathering at misera.net
Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!






 In other newz, Michael was found to have spent $48,000 a month on prescription drugs from a Beverly Hills pharmacist (wtf?!), a

_________________________________________________________________
Windows Live?: Keep your life in sync. 
http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_BR_life_in_synch_062009
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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 17:54:03 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:54:03 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
In-Reply-To: <B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil>
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil>
	<359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com> 
	<B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W20BA0682B269BA2C2BE29B9D2F0@phx.gbl>


Time to get my Union Jack out...



_________________________________________________________________
Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. 
http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/Storage?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_Storage_062009
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 17:55:41 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:55:41 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil><359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil>
	<BAY125-W20BA0682B269BA2C2BE29B9D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <5500856B021849A0BD0EB42A87EDCCF0@edweil>

Shall I sing, "God Save the Queen"?  : ) 


k.w.
SoCal
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: folk devil 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:54 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July


  Time to get my Union Jack out...


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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 17:56:52 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:56:52 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
In-Reply-To: <5500856B021849A0BD0EB42A87EDCCF0@edweil>
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil><359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>
	<B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil>
	<BAY125-W20BA0682B269BA2C2BE29B9D2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<5500856B021849A0BD0EB42A87EDCCF0@edweil>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W24B1B47E580FFFF62B614C9D2F0@phx.gbl>


oh lordy, please no! :P

From: karen.weil at sddt.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:55:41 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July










Shall I sing, "God Save the Queen"?  : ) 

 
 
k.w.
SoCal

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  folk 
  devil 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:54 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of 
  July
  
Time to get my Union Jack out...


  
  


  
  Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. Check it out. 
  
  


  
_______________________________________________
Gathering mailing 
  list
Gathering at misera.net
http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering

_________________________________________________________________
Lauren found her dream laptop. Find the PC that?s right for you.
http://www.microsoft.com/windows/choosepc/?ocid=ftp_val_wl_290
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From karen.weil at sddt.com  Thu Jul  2 18:02:54 2009
From: karen.weil at sddt.com (Karen Weil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 15:02:54 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil><359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil><BAY125-W20BA0682B269BA2C2BE29B9D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<5500856B021849A0BD0EB42A87EDCCF0@edweil>
	<BAY125-W24B1B47E580FFFF62B614C9D2F0@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <0D36EA1F74334D11AE45783274AD890A@edweil>

OK -- well, you asked for it:  "Oh say, can you see ..."  
(You know how we Septics love our national anthem.)  ; ) 

Cheers, 

Karen 


  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: folk devil 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:56 PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July


  oh lordy, please no! :P


------------------------------------------------------------------------------
  From: karen.weil at sddt.com
  To: gathering at misera.net
  Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 14:55:41 -0700
  Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July


  Shall I sing, "God Save the Queen"?  : ) 


  k.w.
  SoCal
    ----- Original Message ----- 
    From: folk devil 
    To: gathering at misera.net 
    Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:54 PM
    Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July


    Time to get my Union Jack out...


----------------------------------------------------------------------------



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    Gathering at misera.net
    http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/gathering



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From saulomar1 at yahoo.com  Thu Jul  2 18:03:55 2009
From: saulomar1 at yahoo.com (sade1)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 15:03:55 -0700 (PDT)
Subject: [kj] Widow of Murdered Fly Seeks White House Apology (Dodgy
	grammar)
In-Reply-To: <00a101c9fb5e$36e73730$0700000a@jo>
References: <00a101c9fb5e$36e73730$0700000a@jo>
Message-ID: <636031.37933.qm@web110216.mail.gq1.yahoo.com>

Thanks, that was very funny. I think (hope) PETA has become a farce of its brand. I liked them before but their response to the fly was too much. 


... ... ... ... ... ... 

[looking at the current?state of things..]
?
'Save me...
? save me?from Tomorrow..
??? I don't want to sail in this Ship Of Fools...'?? 





________________________________
From: jo <jo at arcadia.karoo.co.uk>
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Thursday, July 2, 2009 2:44:02 PM
Subject: [kj] Widow of Murdered Fly Seeks White House Apology (Dodgy grammar)


>
> Widow of Murdered Fly Seeks White House Apology
>
> Grieving widow
> Grieving widow faces uphill legal
> Battle against President
>
> WASHINGTON -- The widow of the housefly murdered by Barack Obama
> During a recent CNBC television interview announced this morning
> That she would be filing a wrongful death suit against the
> President in federal district court. The plaintiff brief -- citing
> Pain, suffering and loss of income -- seeks a formal apology and
> Compensatory damages, including an unspecified quantity of manure.
>
> "Bob was a wonderful husband and provider," said the widow, Mrs.
> Vivian Vvzzvzwwzzz, wiping tears from her compound eyes. "Even
> Though he was always busy at the Rose Garden turd pile, he always
> Flew home in time to tuck in our maggots."
> The 17-day old widow said the grieving process since the murder has
> Taken its toll.
> "Although it's been nearly 48 hours, I still get an empty feeling
> In my thorax everytime I think about it," she said. "I feel like
> I've aged an entire week. Mating season is over, and here I am,
> Stuck trying to raise 532 larvae on my own."
>
> Vvzzvzwwzzz described the "abdomen-wrenching horror" she
> Experienced while watching the President casually assassinate her
> Husband during the live broadcast.
>
> "It was just before supper time and I was predigesting the evening
> Shit for the kids," she recalled. "When I looked up at the TV I saw Bob
> there, and of course I was pretty excited. He started waving at
> Me, and then, all of a sudden, SLAP! My whole world, my life, layed
> Smashed across the back of Obama's left hand. And with 360 degree
> Peripheral vision and hundreds of eye facets, it was impossible to
> Look away."
>
> Ever since the incident, Mrs. Vvzzvzwwzzz said she had been trying
> To piece her life back together.
>
> "I just get paralyzed wondering how I'm going to raise my larvae
> For the next six days, alone, without any kind of support," she
> Said. "Most days I just end up on the ceiling, numb
> And crying, eating a rancid bowl of Ben & Jerry's."
>
> Breaking down, an emotionally distraught Vvzzvzwwzzz was comforted
> By PETA President Ingrid Newkirk and ACLU President Nadine
> Strossen. The two groups announced they will file an amicus brief
> In the case and file a separate class action suit against the
> Insecticide, flyswatter and pest strip industries, seeking over 1
> Million metric tons of compensatory manure on behalf of 200 billion
> Fly-Americans.
>
> "The President's treatment of the Fly community has been extremely
> Disappointing, " said Newkirk. "He almost seemed to relish his
> Bloodthirsty attack on Mr. Vvzzvzwwzzz. It's obvious he's in the
> Pocket of Big Manure."
> University of Tennessee law professor Glenn Reynolds said
> Vvzzvzwwzzz v. Obama is likely to raise several thorny
> Constitutional issues.
> "The courts have a lot of questions to sort out here," he said.
> "For example, can a sitting president be forced to testify in a
> Civil suit? Can he give himself immunity? How does this effect the
> Rights of cooties and crab lice? Also, just how completely insane is 
> PETA?"
>
> Despite the prospect of facing a challenge from the President's
> Formidable legal team, Vvzzvzwwzzz said she was prepared to pursuit
> It all the way to the Supreme Court.
>
> "If Mr. Obama thinks he can shoo me away with his legal briefs and
> His rolled-up New York Times, then he is sadly mistaken," said an
> Angry Vvzzvzwwzzz. "He has no idea how persistent and annoying I
> Can be. I'm in this for the long haul. All the way till July, if
> I'm still alive."
>
> Reynolds cautioned that no matter how determined the plaintiff,
> Such a prolonged legal battle against the President could prove
> Prohibitively expensive.
> "Mrs. Vvzzvzwwzzz is likely to end up spending millions in legal
> Fees, with an unknown probability of success. Even if she prevails,
> The ACLU and PETA lawyers will eat 40% of her settlement in
> Contingency fees," he said.
>
> Vvzzvzwwzz said she would be establishing a legal fund to help
> Defray the cost of the suit, and appealed to the public for
> Contributions.
> "PETA has been very generous in relocating my family to a welcoming
> New neighborhood filled with filthy, stoned, slow-reflexed vegans,
> But we still need money for court costs," she said. "Help meee-eee!
> Help meee-ee-eee- eee!"

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From folk.devil at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 18:04:30 2009
From: folk.devil at hotmail.com (folk devil)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 15:04:30 -0700
Subject: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
In-Reply-To: <0D36EA1F74334D11AE45783274AD890A@edweil>
References: <E1MMOcd-0005oL-CZ@pecan2.exetel.com.au><C951ED8B904645B88ED7887145941F5A@edweil><359905.10446.qm@web110214.mail.gq1.yahoo.com><B070673974614ACB98BDF5780571F2F1@edweil><BAY125-W20BA0682B269BA2C2BE29B9D2F0@phx.gbl>
	<5500856B021849A0BD0EB42A87EDCCF0@edweil>
	<BAY125-W24B1B47E580FFFF62B614C9D2F0@phx.gbl> 
	<0D36EA1F74334D11AE45783274AD890A@edweil>
Message-ID: <BAY125-W298E09F3E894F18C16B2D79D2F0@phx.gbl>


I'm also an American ;)
Schizophrenic time for me...

From: karen.weil at sddt.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 15:02:54 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July










OK -- well, you asked for it:  "Oh say, can you 
see ..."  
(You know how we Septics love our national anthem.)  
; ) 
 
Cheers, 
 
Karen 
 
 

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  folk 
  devil 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:56 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of 
  July
  
oh lordy, please no! :P


  
  From: karen.weil at sddt.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Thu, 2 
  Jul 2009 14:55:41 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of 
  July


  

  Shall I sing, "God Save the Queen"?  : ) 
  
   
   
  k.w.
  SoCal
  
    ----- 
    Original Message ----- 
    From: 
    folk 
    devil 
    To: 
    gathering at misera.net 
    Sent: 
    Thursday, July 02, 2009 2:54 PM
    Subject: 
    Re: [kj] Fox wishes this 4th of July
    
Time to get my Union Jack out...


    
    


    
    Hotmail? has ever-growing storage! Don?t worry about storage limits. Check 
    it out. 

    
    
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    list
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From paulwady at hotmail.com  Thu Jul  2 18:00:24 2009
From: paulwady at hotmail.com (Paul Wady)
Date: Thu, 2 Jul 2009 23:00:24 +0100
Subject: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!! OH MY GOD
 ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!
In-Reply-To: <065813AC6F744144AE5C83CAB1537E90@edweil>
References: <32086869.1246455666430.JavaMail.root@mswamui-bichon.atl.sa.earthlink.net><32093ED84AFE4CFFAE0AC9F3B83C8347@edweil>
	<8CBC896FC6FA298-1010-80B@mblk-d43.sysops.aol.com> 
	<065813AC6F744144AE5C83CAB1537E90@edweil>
Message-ID: <COL118-W5BBF146EDB29167036C7CCC2F0@phx.gbl>


Has something happened to dear Michael?
When Thriller was shown in 1984, a statement preceded it.  On the screen it read "Due to my beliefs, I wish to state that this film in no way endorses a belief in the occult."
Cut straight to Jools (Lord of the world, genius presenter) Holland who was presenting the thing for The Tube.
"Yes, well", he nasally stated, "it doesn't actually say what he was convicted of...."


Keep Smiling...

http://www.myspace.com/themodelaircraftmuseum  
 
http://www.myspace.com/paulwadyexperience  
 
Autism also affects adults. 
Most are isolated and ignored
Think. Act. Transform Lives. 
www.think-differently.org.uk



From: karen.weil at sddt.com
To: gathering at misera.net
Date: Wed, 1 Jul 2009 14:49:12 -0700
Subject: Re: [kj] FW:  Michael Jackson dead - ENOUGH!!!!










He does -- just don't call him the King of Pop! 
; ) 
Glad to see the lovely Countess posting here, btw. 

 
Cheers,
 
KW

  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: 
  countessghoulita at aol.com 
  To: gathering at misera.net 
  Sent: Wednesday, July 01, 2009 12:12 
  PM
  Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson 
  dead - ENOUGH!!!!
  

  Alex, you rule! 

CG



  

  
-----Original Message-----
From: Karen Weil <karen.weil at sddt.com>
To: Alex 
  Smith <vassifer at earthlink.net>; A list 
  about all things Killing Joke (the band!) <gathering at misera.net>
Sent: Wed, 
  Jul 1, 2009 10:17 am
Subject: Re: [kj] FW: Michael Jackson dead - 
  ENOUGH!!!!


  Thanks, 
  Alex. Best thing I've read all 
  day. 
 
k.w. 
 
----- Original Message ----- 
  From: "Alex Smith" <vassifer at earthlink.net> 
To: 
  "A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net>; "A list about 
  all things Killing Joke (the band!)" <gathering at misera.net> 
Sent: 
  Wednesda