From ron at psymon.com Fri Apr 25 13:36:39 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2008 13:36:39 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] On sale Message-ID: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> Note: this is *not* spam! ;) The UK amazon has some interesting (and VERY good -- 60%-80% off!) DVD specials on right now. A promotion on selected films from the "Masters of Cinema" series... http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_25/?docId=1000165713 Various classic silent films... http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/browse.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_13/?node=501992 Plus many other "classic" films... http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/browse.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_10/?node=501976 Again, I'm not spammin' ya, it's just that these specials are too good to not share! Ron ;) Woof?... http://www.Psymon.com Ach, du Leni!... http://www.Riefenstahl.org Hmm... http://www.Imaginary-Friend.ca From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Fri Apr 25 15:50:43 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2008 21:50:43 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] On sale In-Reply-To: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <2C018127-E245-44D2-BEA1-81DF60A9B31C@skynet.be> THese are all masterpieces. Nanook of the North was considered the very first "documentary", the word was used for a film for the first time. And yet it was known that nobody with a name of Nanook existed-- Reflections on the documentary film are endless, don't expect "reality" "truth" etc in a documentary, loooking for new concepts we use at least "documentary style" (or tradition) -- evt. On 25 Apr 2008, at 19:36, Ron Koster wrote: > Note: this is *not* spam! ;) > > The UK amazon has some interesting (and VERY good -- 60%-80% off!) > DVD specials on right now. > > A promotion on selected films from the "Masters of Cinema" series... > > http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/feature.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_25/?docId=1000165713 > > Various classic silent films... > > http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/browse.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_13/?node=501992 > > Plus many other "classic" films... > > http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/browse.html/ref=pe_8371_10678741_pe_10/?node=501976 > > From easternwindow at freenet.de Sat Apr 26 07:39:52 2008 From: easternwindow at freenet.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thomas_K=F6hler?=) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 13:39:52 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> Hi all, there's a brief (and rather shallow) article on Spiegel online commemorating the 70th anniversary of the "Olympia" film. Nothing new, but for completeness sake : http://einestages.spiegel.de/static/topicalbumbackground/1829/die_frau_die_den_perfekten_nazi_koerper_schuf.html Another thing: someone I think (Ron?) mentioned the film "Das Reichsorchester" on the Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra during the Third Reich. Well, I watched it yesterday on TV and found it rather impressive. A fine and sometimes chilling account of what was going on in 'cultural politics' at the time. The film talks about the general apolitical stance of most of the musicians, but also about how Jewish members were expelled and some of the musicians joining the Nazi party (who in the turn were expelled from the orchestra, too, after the war). Also very uneasy to see how the Philharmonic yearly celebrated the birthday of Hitler with a special concert, and Furtw?ngler conducting Beethoven's Ninth with the chorus "All people become brothers" etc. in 1942 for that occasion. Most pertinent to Leni is perhaps a brief excerpt from the Olympics opening ceremony, where we get the Richard Strauss "Olympia Hymn" and learn that every member of the orchestra got a special 'olympic medal' for its participation. Worth seeing in any case. Best Thomas > From ron at psymon.com Sat Apr 26 10:07:21 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 10:07:21 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> Message-ID: <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> At 01:39 PM 4/26/2008 +0200, you wrote: >there's a brief (and rather shallow) article on Spiegel online >commemorating the 70th anniversary of the "Olympia" film. Nothing >new, but for completeness sake : > >http://einestages.spiegel.de/static/topicalbumbackground/1829/die_frau_die_den_perfekten_nazi_koerper_schuf.html Some interesting pictures in the gallery there that I've never seen before. In fact, even one of the posters for the film I hadn't seen before at all! I *have* seen this one (featured in the article) before, many times... http://einestages.spiegel.de/hund-images/2008/04/18/86/66a4ee607d378fd6ab77d01f9d14aada_image_document_large.jpg ...but I've *never* before seen this poster... http://einestages.spiegel.de/hund-images/2008/04/18/80/5644604eba0bac3f74274a60f21586cd_image_document_large.jpg No doubt an original copy of that poster would probably go for $5000 or more on eBay (based on past auctions I've seen), but gee, it'd be nice if they did a reprint of that one, if only because... that's Leni! I wonder if audiences (and people walking on the street, or wherever that poster was displayed) at the time realized that that was Leni herself featured nude in the poster for the film??? >Another thing: someone I think (Ron?) mentioned the film "Das >Reichsorchester" on the Berlin Philharmonic Orchestra during the Third Reich. I forget if it was me -- although I *do* remember it coming up here! I think it was someone else, actually. ;) >Worth seeing in any case. I don't suppose it's available with English subtitles, is it? Ron :? Woof?... http://www.Psymon.com Ach, du Leni!... http://www.Riefenstahl.org Hmm... http://www.Imaginary-Friend.ca From ron at psymon.com Sat Apr 26 10:30:45 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 10:30:45 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] Nanook vs. South In-Reply-To: <2C018127-E245-44D2-BEA1-81DF60A9B31C@skynet.be> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <2C018127-E245-44D2-BEA1-81DF60A9B31C@skynet.be> Message-ID: <20080426143045.56AC52BD7B@mailwash40.pair.com> At 09:50 PM 4/25/2008 +0200, Luc Deneulin wrote: >THese are all masterpieces. >Nanook of the North was considered the very first "documentary", the >word was used for a film for the first time. And yet it was known that >nobody with a name of Nanook existed-- Actually, speaking of Nanook (and those amazon sales), I was surprised to come across this film... http://www.amazon.co.uk/South-Ernest-Shackleton/dp/B000065C2C/ ..."South", from 1919, about Shackleton's trip to Antarctica. I've seen modern TV documentaries about that expedition, but never heard of this 1919 film. Wouldn't *that* be a documentary that pre-dates Nanook? Surely the definition of a "documentary" isn't simply that the makers referred to it as such, is it? And from the description/reviews of this film, it does sound as though South would be a more "real" documentary than Nanook, if only in that it really does "document" actual events (as opposed to staged/acted scenarios). Ron :? From easternwindow at freenet.de Sat Apr 26 10:46:56 2008 From: easternwindow at freenet.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thomas_K=F6hler?=) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 16:46:56 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Nanook vs. South In-Reply-To: <20080426143045.56AC52BD7B@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <2C018127-E245-44D2-BEA1-81DF60A9B31C@skynet.be> <20080426143045.56AC52BD7B@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <48134060.2040805@freenet.de> > Wouldn't *that* be a documentary that pre-dates Nanook? Surely the definition of a "documentary" isn't simply that the makers referred to it as such, is it? And from the description/reviews of this film, it does sound as though South would be a more "real" documentary than Nanook, if only in that it really does "document" actual events (as opposed to staged/acted scenarios). You're quite right there. "South" is much closer to being a 'real' documentary, although, if I remember correctly, there are some few scenes that were re-staged (but not invented). A fascinating film in any case; if you liked the Arctic deserts in "Eisberg", you'll surely love these from Antartica. The film has been wonderfully restored by the British Film Institute (with original tintings), and the disc offers a lot of fascinating extra materials. Highly recommended, really. Thomas From easternwindow at freenet.de Sat Apr 26 10:53:02 2008 From: easternwindow at freenet.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thomas_K=F6hler?=) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 16:53:02 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> Interesting, I wasn't aware that this poster was unseen. Are you sure that's Leni? "Reichsorchester" is out on dvd, in both Germany and the UK. And the latter will have English subs, I would assume.. Here's the link: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Berlin-Philharmonic-Third-Reich-Reichsorchester/dp/B0012K53UO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=dvd&qid=1209221519&sr=8-1 Best Thomas > From schmidt- at web.de Sat Apr 26 13:39:04 2008 From: schmidt- at web.de (Helmut Schmidt) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 19:39:04 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] =?iso-8859-15?q?Article_on_Olympia_in_DER_SPIEGEL_/_=22Da?= =?iso-8859-15?q?s_Reichsorchester=22?= Message-ID: <468072939@web.de> > -----Urspr?ngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Discussion forum about the life and work of Leni Riefenstahl > Gesendet: 26.04.08 13:41:11 > An: Discussion forum about the life and work of Leni Riefenstahl > Betreff: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" > Hi all, > > there's a brief (and rather shallow) article on Spiegel online > commemorating the 70th anniversary of the "Olympia" film. Nothing new, > but for completeness sake : > > http://einestages.spiegel.de/static/topicalbumbackground/1829/die_frau_die_den_perfekten_nazi_koerper_schuf.html Hi Thomas, within this article there is mentioned a Making-Of-film of "Olympia" which is said to have won a gold-medal at the Paris-World-Exhibition in 1937. Is that correct and do you or anyone else know something about this film? Helmut _________________________________________________________________________ In 5 Schritten zur eigenen Homepage. Jetzt Domain sichern und gestalten! Nur 3,99 EUR/Monat! http://www.maildomain.web.de/?mc=021114 From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sat Apr 26 14:09:46 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:09:46 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <468072939@web.de> References: <468072939@web.de> Message-ID: <20CB0274-D9DF-4DC3-9133-6CD180C7242A@skynet.be> yes Helmut, there is such a film. You can see excverpts of it in Die Macht der Bilder. R. Schaad was the director)) Best regards Luc -- On 26 Apr 2008, at 19:39, Helmut Schmidt wrote: >> --- > > Hi Thomas, > > within this article there is mentioned a Making-Of-film of "Olympia" > which is said to have won a gold-medal at the Paris-World- > Exhibition in 1937. > Is that correct and do you or anyone else know something about this > film? > > Helmut > _________________________________________________________________________ > In From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sat Apr 26 14:11:10 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:11:10 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Nanook vs. South In-Reply-To: <48134060.2040805@freenet.de> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <2C018127-E245-44D2-BEA1-81DF60A9B31C@skynet.be> <20080426143045.56AC52BD7B@mailwash40.pair.com> <48134060.2040805@freenet.de> Message-ID: <715B2078-6020-46B3-BB02-65E7FBF5E94C@skynet.be> Probably, but the term "documentary" was used for the first time related to a film for Nanook)) (by Gierson) On 26 Apr 2008, at 16:46, Thomas K?hler wrote: > > > Wouldn't *that* be a documentary that pre-dates Nanook? Surely the > definition of a "documentary" isn't simply that the makers referred > to it as such, is it? And from the description/reviews of this film, > it does sound as though South would be a more "real" documentary > than Nanook, if only in that it really does "document" actual events > (as opposed to staged/acted scenarios). > > Y From easternwindow at freenet.de Sat Apr 26 14:12:06 2008 From: easternwindow at freenet.de (=?ISO-8859-15?Q?Thomas_K=F6hler?=) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:12:06 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <468072939@web.de> References: <468072939@web.de> Message-ID: <48137076.5000706@freenet.de> Hi Helmut, that surprises me as well, and went totally unnoticed by me when first skimming through the article. I never heard of such a 'making of' film. I would be surprised if it was actually true (given the superficiality of the whole article), but I simply don't know. Luc, Ron, anyone? Thomas > > From easternwindow at freenet.de Sat Apr 26 14:13:54 2008 From: easternwindow at freenet.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Thomas_K=F6hler?=) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:13:54 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <20CB0274-D9DF-4DC3-9133-6CD180C7242A@skynet.be> References: <468072939@web.de> <20CB0274-D9DF-4DC3-9133-6CD180C7242A@skynet.be> Message-ID: <481370E2.8010602@freenet.de> Sorry, Luc, your mail clashed with mine. Thanks for the info! Do you know anything more about this? I'm really surprised that such a 'making-of'-film would win such a prestigious price. Best Thomas Luc Deneulin schrieb: > yes Helmut, there is such a film. You can see excverpts of it in Die > Macht der Bilder. R. Schaad was the director)) > > Best regards > Luc > -- > On 26 Apr 2008, at 19:39, Helmut Schmidt wrote: > >>> --- >> >> >> Hi Thomas, >> >> within this article there is mentioned a Making-Of-film of "Olympia" >> which is said to have won a gold-medal at the Paris-World- >> Exhibition in 1937. >> Is that correct and do you or anyone else know something about this >> film? >> >> Helmut >> _________________________________________________________________________ >> >> In > > _______________________________________________ > NOTE 1: PLEASE TRIM THE QUOTED PORTION(S) OF YOUR REPLIES! > NOTE 2: IF YOU CHANGE TOPIC, CHANGE THE SUBJECT HEADING! > List Info: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/len-e/ > Your List Options: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/options/len-e/ > List Archives: http://four.pairlist.net/pipermail/len-e/ > To Unsubscribe: mailto:len-e-request at riefenstahl.org?subject=unsubscribe > > From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sat Apr 26 14:18:36 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:18:36 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <48137076.5000706@freenet.de> References: <468072939@web.de> <48137076.5000706@freenet.de> Message-ID: <4F8C575E-358B-4EA2-9800-A91BB2472A3F@skynet.be> This film got a price at the World Exhibition in Paris, just like Das blaue Licht, Triumph and so many other films. "Kameraleute an der Arbeit" Don't be too impressed with the gold medal these films got, in that sense (almost) everything at that exhibition got a medak, Speer got a lot, not to speak abou Breker, Torak etc etc + of course thjose from other countries) On 26 Apr 2008, at 20:12, Thomas K?hler wrote: > Hi Helmut, > > that surprises me as well, and went totally unnoticed by me when > first skimming through the article. I never heard of such a 'making > of' film. I would be surprised if it was actually true (given the > superficiality of the whole article), but I simply don't know. Luc, > Ron, anyone? > > Thomas > > >> > _______________________________________________ > NOTE 1: PLEASE TRIM THE QUOTED PORTION(S) OF YOUR REPLIES! > NOTE 2: IF YOU CHANGE TOPIC, CHANGE THE SUBJECT HEADING! > List Info: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/len-e/ > Your List Options: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/options/len-e/ > List Archives: http://four.pairlist.net/pipermail/len-e/ > To Unsubscribe: mailto:len-e-request at riefenstahl.org?subject=unsubscribe Luc Deneulin luc.deneulin at skynet.be From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sat Apr 26 14:22:11 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sat, 26 Apr 2008 20:22:11 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <481370E2.8010602@freenet.de> References: <468072939@web.de> <20CB0274-D9DF-4DC3-9133-6CD180C7242A@skynet.be> <481370E2.8010602@freenet.de> Message-ID: <7096CCB2-C3D0-49B0-95E3-5ABB41F66BCB@skynet.be> THe price was as I wrote Thomas not exclusive. In fact the deception - when I read the newspapers of the time" was quite big, when the French knew Olympia was not finished. So that's why Riefenstahl came with Das blaue Licht & Triumph. Best regards (There was quite some protest when the German's got their prices, not only Riefenstahl, all the others) It was in a political landscape, three years before the war, that right and left were "fighting" with democratical means. As you know, France would 3 years later collaborate officially with the 3rd Reich and have a antisemetic policy of their own, sending 3 times as much Jews to Germany as the Germans had asked -- --- On 26 Apr 2008, at 20:13, Thomas K?hler wrote: > Sorry, Luc, your mail clashed with mine. Thanks for the info! Do you > know anything more about this? I'm really surprised that such a > 'making-of'-film would win such a prestigious price. > > Best > Thomas > > > > Luc Deneulin schrieb: > >> yes Helmut, there is such a film. You can see excverpts of it in >> Die Macht der Bilder. R. Schaad was the director)) >> >> Best regards >> Luc >> -- >> On 26 Apr 2008, at 19:39, Helmut Schmidt wrote: >> >>>> --- >>> >>> >>> Hi Thomas, >>> >>> within this article there is mentioned a Making-Of-film of "Olympia" >>> which is said to have won a gold-medal at the Paris-World- >>> Exhibition in 1937. >>> Is that correct and do you or anyone else know something about >>> this film? >>> >>> Helmut >>> _________________________________________________________________________ >>> In >> >> _______________________________________________ >> NOTE 1: PLEASE TRIM THE QUOTED PORTION(S) OF YOUR REPLIES! >> NOTE 2: IF YOU CHANGE TOPIC, CHANGE THE SUBJECT HEADING! >> List Info: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/len-e/ >> Your List Options: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/options/len-e/ >> List Archives: http://four.pairlist.net/pipermail/len-e/ >> To Unsubscribe: mailto:len-e-request at riefenstahl.org?subject=unsubscribe >> >> > _______________________________________________ > NOTE 1: PLEASE TRIM THE QUOTED PORTION(S) OF YOUR REPLIES! > NOTE 2: IF YOU CHANGE TOPIC, CHANGE THE SUBJECT HEADING! > List Info: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/listinfo/len-e/ > Your List Options: http://four.pairlist.net/mailman/options/len-e/ > List Archives: http://four.pairlist.net/pipermail/len-e/ > To Unsubscribe: mailto:len-e-request at riefenstahl.org?subject=unsubscribe Luc Deneulin luc.deneulin at skynet.be From ron at psymon.com Sun Apr 27 08:54:48 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 08:54:48 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> Message-ID: <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> At 04:53 PM 4/26/2008 +0200, Thomas K?hler wrote: >Interesting, I wasn't aware that this poster was unseen. Well, I've seen that picture of Leni before (all over the place), but never in that poster -- that doesn't mean that the poster was unseen, just that *I* have never seen it, of course. ;) I'd *love* to have a print of that (i.e. a reprint -- I certainly couldn't afford an original!), actually. Indeed, in that regard I'd also love a print of either of the two (that I'm aware of) colour posters for Das blaue Licht, too -- I wish some poster company would come out with these (if, of course, they could get permission to do so). >Are you sure that's Leni? Well, according to Henry (Heinz von) Jaworsky, one of her cameramen -- and, indirectly, Leni herself -- it is! For reference, the spring 1973 issue (number 56-57) of the journal "Film Culture" features an interview with Jaworsky (conducted by Gordon Hitchens, Kirk Bond and John Handhardt), which includes this exchange concerning the shooting of Olympia (pp. 123-124)... HITCHENS: Here is a photograph of a woman, nude, shot full-figure from the rear, on a bench, with her arms upraised in a stylized manner. She [Riefenstahl] told me this was of her, used in the Olympia prologue. JAWORSKY: No... but it could be. Yes. Yes, that's her. There was a cameraman on Olympia by the name of Willy Zielke, who was an absolute genius. He was a great artist, and with him she shot a whole prologue. She went somewhere in the Baltic, I think on the beach, and with a couple of nude girls, including herself, they did this prologue because she wasn't very happy with what they did in Greece. As I told you, she tried in Greece to arrange the whole thing, but it wasn't enough. So she did this prologue with Zielke. Yes, that's her, that's for sure. So here, firstly, we have second-hand information from Hitchens stating that Leni herself asserted that it was a photo of her, which is then confirmed by Jaworsky. David B. Hinton also talks about this in his "The Films of Leni Riefenstahl" (3rd edition) -- in fact, he includes the actual photo (i.e. the exact same one featured in that aforementioned poster) with a caption which reads: "Riefenstahl made an anonymous appearance as a nude dancer in the Olympia prologue." Further, in the main text for his book (on p. 50), in describing the prologue, he states... A close-up shot shows the shot-putter tossing the ball from hand to hand in rhythmic, dance-like motions. This shot becomes another dissolve, as the masculine arms of the shot-putter become the feminine arms of dancers. An erotic and very expressionistic dance is performed by several nude women, including Riefenstahl herself (although her anonymity is protected by the camera angle). The dance was conceived by Riefenstahl and shot in the sand dunes of a Baltic beach. HOWEVER, with that said, I do believe that Hinton is jumping to conclusions! His reference for making these statements is, in fact, solely the above interview with Jaworsky -- but Jaworsky does *not* say that Leni was actually in the *film* itself, just that the described *photo* is, indeed, of her. I've looked very closely at the dancers in the prologue (from the film) to see if I could find anyone who might be Leni, and although some of them are indeed only very vaguely shot, even still I just can't really see anyone who genuinely looks like she could be Leni. In any case, while I do feel that Hinton is in error about that (her being in the actual film), at the same time I also believe he is perfectly correct in which particular photo is being referred to. In that regard, it's probably worth mentioning that quite often I'll see various people (eBay sellers, etc.) who state that this is the photo (also from that article) which is Leni "in the nude"... http://einestages.spiegel.de/hund-images/2007/10/18/48/484a418cf011cdf0da61c9ef59b243ac_image_document_large.jpg ...but it's not. For one thing, that girl's nose isn't shaped liked Leni's rather distinctively-shaped nose, and for another thing -- er, another two things ;) -- neither are this girl's breasts. Leni certainly wasn't overly "buxom" by any means, of course, but she was quite obviously (even fully-clothed) discernably more-so than this young girl. Indeed, in watching the actual footage from the film, it's these two (or, uh, three) physical aspects -- along with the shape of Leni's chin -- which make it fairly easy to reject the silhouetted dancers as being her, one by one. The only ones which one can't reject are, of course, the ones which can't be clearly seen at all (such as the beginning shots featuring only the dancers' legs, etc.) -- but that's certainly not any evidence that Leni actually appeared (if only her arms or legs or whatever) in the final film. >"Reichsorchester" is out on dvd, in both Germany >and the UK. And the latter will have English subs, I would assume.. Oh! Thanks! I guess it would've helped if I actually bothered to *look*, of course -- thanks for going to the trouble, though! Ron ;) From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sun Apr 27 09:05:03 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 15:05:03 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Article on Olympia in DER SPIEGEL / "Das Reichsorchester" In-Reply-To: <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> At least she was filmed for Olympia, with others, by Hans Ertl (so he says) von Jaworsky recognizing her is also a good statement She told Hinton she was in the film) -- From ron at psymon.com Sun Apr 27 09:47:12 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 09:47:12 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] Leni in the Olympia prologue In-Reply-To: <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> Message-ID: <20080427134715.62F552BD20@mailwash40.pair.com> At 03:05 PM 4/27/2008 +0200, Luc Deneulin wrote: >At least she was filmed for Olympia, with others, by Hans Ertl (so he >says) Got a reference? If you could provide an *exact* quote (along with publication info, page numbers, etc.) that would be great -- I was thinking, actually, of taking my last post and developing it into an article, since this seems to be a question that often comes up (i.e. re Leni appearing nude, whether in the actual film or the related still photographs). >She told Hinton she was in the film) Any more info on that (reference)? If that's the case, I wonder why he didn't just say so (as a reference) in his book, rather than just referencing the Jaworsky article (only). Ron :? From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sun Apr 27 09:54:08 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 15:54:08 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Leni in the Olympia prologue In-Reply-To: <20080427134715.62F552BD20@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> <20080427134715.62F552BD20@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: <34DEB650-48D2-4F3A-A5BD-9BBF45A3852B@skynet.be> > I have but searching would be too long for now, it's in his book as > well as in the film about and with him. Zielke was there as well, > the big Willy Zielke who made the whole prologue. > > Got a reference? If you could provide an *exact* quote (along with > publication info, page numbers, etc.) that would be great -- I was > thinking, actually, of taking my last post and developing it into an > article, since this seems to be a question that often comes up (i.e. > re Leni appearing nude, whether in the actual film or the related > still photographs). > >> She told Hinton she was in the film)== Hinton told me in 94, he was >> in contact with her and might have heard it from her after the >> publication > > Any more info on that (reference)? If that's the case, I wonder why > he didn't just say so (as a reference) in his book, rather than just > referencing the Jaworsky article (only). > From ron at psymon.com Sun Apr 27 10:14:33 2008 From: ron at psymon.com (Ron Koster) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 10:14:33 -0400 Subject: [LEN-E] Leni in the Olympia prologue In-Reply-To: <34DEB650-48D2-4F3A-A5BD-9BBF45A3852B@skynet.be> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> <20080427134715.62F552BD20@mailwash40.pair.com> <34DEB650-48D2-4F3A-A5BD-9BBF45A3852B@skynet.be> Message-ID: <20080427141435.9EC282BCCF@mailwash40.pair.com> At 03:54 PM 4/27/2008 +0200, Luc Deneulin wrote: >>I have but searching would be too long for now, Hey, it's Sunday -- what else do you have to do? ;) >>it's in his book as >>well as in the film about and with him. His book? His film? I've never heard of a book nor a film about/by Hans Ertl! Can you tell me more about these (titles, etc.)??? >>Zielke was there as well, >>the big Willy Zielke who made the whole prologue. Does Zielke talk anywhere about that (the prologue for Olympia, specifically)? Jaworsky mentions him in that interview, of course, but it would certainly help to have something (on that subject) straight from Zielke. Ron :? Woof?... http://www.Psymon.com Ach, du Leni!... http://www.Riefenstahl.org Hmm... http://www.Imaginary-Friend.ca From luc.deneulin at skynet.be Sun Apr 27 10:21:01 2008 From: luc.deneulin at skynet.be (Luc Deneulin) Date: Sun, 27 Apr 2008 16:21:01 +0200 Subject: [LEN-E] Leni in the Olympia prologue In-Reply-To: <20080427141435.9EC282BCCF@mailwash40.pair.com> References: <20080425173715.516682BCCC@mailwash40.pair.com> <48131488.8010905@freenet.de> <20080426140739.2BCFE2BD0E@mailwash40.pair.com> <481341CE.6010003@freenet.de> <20080427125526.1E9B72BD25@mailwash40.pair.com> <2F5B8C3C-CF4D-4D6D-AF16-DF6F84D09B68@skynet.be> <20080427134715.62F552BD20@mailwash40.pair.com> <34DEB650-48D2-4F3A-A5BD-9BBF45A3852B@skynet.be> <20080427141435.9EC282BCCF@mailwash40.pair.com> Message-ID: -- reading dissertations and writing reports on them. Last night till 3 o'clock The book is in German as is the documentary on him, I have it VHS I remember I put H. ertl on it, it was on German TV before I had internet, where is another question. The book is hard to find, the title is Meine wilden dreissiger Jahre Ertl is ver very talented, he invented many things for Olympia as well his own photograph and film work before and after))))) He died not that long ago, before Riefenstahl... Luc Deneulin luc.deneulin at skynet.be