[kj] OT: The Venus Project

[ade]

Yeah, will have a look old bean.

-----Original Message-----
From: gathering-bounces at misera.net
[mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On Behalf Of Brendan
Sent: 14 November 2008 22:10
To: A list about all things Killing Joke (the band!)
Subject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project


Ade - if you're interested (it's a bit of a read), read the Venus
manifesto on their website, the 70 page PDF doco, it specifically
addresses the issue of 'nature', in a relatively new way. When I get home
I'll try and find the page no it's on. Explained pretty well in Zeitgeist:
Addendum, should be able to be torrented...


>> I hope one day they'll be no need for either

>

> Me too, though think it's thousands of years away.

>

> Frank Herbert goes through these ideas throughout the Dune books, but at

> the end I think he realised there will always be struggle because there

> will always be groups that move against each other (no matter how

> transient) - it seems to be our nature. Oh well!

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On

> Behalf Of GREG SLAWSON

> Sent: 14 November 2008 21:01

> To: gathering

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project

>

>

> Depends on how big the movement is...BUt I hope one day they'll be no need

> for either (everyone can get

> stuff w/o $, and people can live where they want w/o lines on the map)...

>

>

>

>   _____

>

>

> Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 20:32:53 +0000

> From: ade at the-lab.zetnet.co.uk

> To: gathering at misera.net

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project

>

>

>

> How about all the people who are happy with money & countries? Will they

> just be forced to accept someone else's ideals ?

>

> -----Original Message-----

> From: gathering-bounces at misera.net [mailto:gathering-bounces at misera.net]On

> Behalf Of GREG SLAWSON

> Sent: 14 November 2008 18:10

> To: gathering

> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project

>

>

> The 2 things you said below--doing away w/money and counties--it my idea

> (and Progressive Labor Party's)

> platform for communism too...

>

>> Date: Sat, 15 Nov 2008 06:30:45 +1300

>> From: bq at soundgardener.co.nz

>> To: gathering at misera.net

>> Subject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project

>>

>> I have sorta been expecting something like this ever since the web came

>> into being, or even email. Replication of memes is incredibly fast and

>> almost impossible to stop by the corporate lobby.

>>

>> They have some interesting ideas.

>>

>> I already agree that rational, intelligent, well educated, unbiased

>> minds

>> (scientists in particular) should have far more say, over corporates,

>> politicians, the religious lobby etc. Irrational lobby groups have far

>> too

>> much say.

>>

>> I agree that the military are an anachronism to a large extent (although

>> until every disarms, there's no way you could go whole hog in one

>> step...but the US pulling military out from o/s bases for example would

>> be

>> a start...)

>>

>> I agree that as soon as you remove people from behind the wheel of cars

>> and implement a decent automated system, you'll basically kiss goodbye

>> to

>> the road toll. As much as petrol heads will be annoyed (tough)

>>

>> What I find interesting is their idea that human nature is largely

>> irrelevant - it's the environment that dictates behaviour. In the

>> absence

>> of scarcity, people tend to be nice and share with each other. With

>> scarcity and fear of scarcity, and hugely unequal distribution of

>> wealth,

>> to the point that many don't even have the basics...you end up with

>> poverty, crime, poor health etc.

>>

>> Most of what they say makes perfect sense. I dunno about moving to a

>> system of no money (Jaz agrees), but I do like the idea of doing away

>> with

>> countries.

>>

>> Interesting stuff, kind of what I've been harping on about for a while.

>>

>> Wonder how big their island is...?

>>

>>

>>

>> >

>> > who ever does their PR is rather good ;)

>> > they're all over the internets.."

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > Date: Fri, 14 Nov 2008 18:48:23 +1300From: humanhybrid666 at gmail.comTo:

>> > gathering at misera.netSubject: Re: [kj] OT: The Venus Project

>> > http://au.youtube.com/results?search_query=zeitgeist+refuted+1+of+10&search_type=&aq=0&oq=zeitgeist+refuted

>> >

>> > you checked out any of the anti-zeitgeist crowd? i got through a few

>> > minutes.....

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > On Fri, Nov 14, 2008 at 6:42 PM, Brendan Quinn

>> <bq at soundgardener.co.nz>

>> > wrote:

>> >

>> >

>> >

>> > So has anyone seen Zeitgeist: Addendum?

>> >

>> > Apart from the ridiculous idea of putting the word 'addendum' in a

>> title

>> > (?!), I quite enjoyed it. And I'm intrigued by 'The Venus Project.'

>> (Well

>> > mainly the part about self-replicating machines doing all the work I

>> > suppose...)

>> >

>> > www.thevenusproject.com

>> >

>> > They really need someone to proof-read their manifesto though, for a

>> bunch

>> > of people espousing science over everything else, they can't write

>> good.

>> >

>> > And it so should have been called Zeitgeist II: Zeit Geister.

>> > _______________________________________________Gathering mailing

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